Do expect your kids to obey you?

[Anonymous]

I do but also am open to them presenting an argument that my request should be revised due to new information or because I haven’t taken something else into consideration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I actually encourage my kids to push back against rules they disagree with. Ever since they were babies. If I can’t make a good enough case for a rule or if I am inconsistent about it, they get to push back. You want them to grow up and be totalitarian followers? Also, in the rapist example above, where does that leave the girl/victim that was taught to obey?

You cannot raise a leader until you teach him to follow first. Every single leader I met is a very disciplined person. The person who cannot obey the rules very unlikely has a strong discipline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My youngest is 17. My oldest is 27. Until they leave for college, yes. I absolutely expect them to obey.

This. Not saying they can't converse when it's age-appropriate, but bottom line is that minor children should ultimately be taught to obey their parents. Of course this demands enormous self-discipline on the part of the parents.

[Anonymous]

I like to think of myself as an enlightened despot. My daughter is lucky to have me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I actually encourage my kids to push back against rules they disagree with. Ever since they were babies. If I can’t make a good enough case for a rule or if I am inconsistent about it, they get to push back. You want them to grow up and be totalitarian followers? Also, in the rapist example above, where does that leave the girl/victim that was taught to obey?

You cannot raise a leader until you teach him to follow first. Every single leader I met is a very disciplined person. The person who cannot obey the rules very unlikely has a strong discipline.

That is likely an internal personality trait. You can not train that into someone.

[Anonymous]

The word Obey is such a strong word. It makes me feel like a dictator. Go do this, do that, time for school, go to bed. I hate being told what to do when I was young. Now, i feel like I'm doing it. Need you to respond to me with respect, kiddo.

[Anonymous]

You are not a hammer and your child is not a nail.

[Anonymous]

We're supposed to be the parents, not the peers.
To start with, we must model self-disciplined.
We can't be lazy or over-tired, or preoccupied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I actually encourage my kids to push back against rules they disagree with. Ever since they were babies. If I can’t make a good enough case for a rule or if I am inconsistent about it, they get to push back. You want them to grow up and be totalitarian followers? Also, in the rapist example above, where does that leave the girl/victim that was taught to obey?

You cannot raise a leader until you teach him to follow first. Every single leader I met is a very disciplined person. The person who cannot obey the rules very unlikely has a strong discipline.

+1,000,000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not blindly, no. But I expect them to comply when I make reasonable requests and to discuss it calmly and respectfully if they disagree.

^^^mine are older. When they were toddlers, yes I expected them to follow safety commands. Don’t touch that, don’t go in the street, etc.

How old were they when you decided it was ok for you to debate everything you told them, that they didn't agree with?

Not sure. They’ve always been advanced communicators. They are not rude and somehow they know the difference between a non negotiable (like a safety item) and weather or not I feel a certain TV show us age appropriate. I’m open to respectful discussion on some things. And if I’m not, I’ll say “this isn’t negotiable.”

What I'm getting at is this:
When your kid wants something, and you say "no", is it *really* a good idea to let your kid debate you?

People keep asking why so many boys/men think they can assault a girl/woman when she said "no". If our boys have been trained to ignore "no", what exactly should we expect?

If you want to debate things with your kid, please do NOT say "no", and then back off and open a debate.

Instead say, let's talk about it, or let me think about, or I'll discuss it with your father/mother.

If you want "No Means No, start acting like it and put your money where your mouth is. Mean what you say, or don't say it.

I can see how boys think "no means yes", if that's how they're been raised. Most boys know that if they nag/pound their parents long enough, they'll often get what they want. Allowing a debate after you've already said "no", is very dangerous territory.

Well, mine are girls to be precise. And yes I absolutely want them to feel they can question authority when it doesn’t feel right. Blind obedience got us the holocaust.

Evil people got us the Holocaust. As a child, my parents took me to see the German concentration camps. Shameful that it took so long for the American government to acknowledge what was going on, in spite of overwhelming evidence. But I digress.

This thread is about underaged children obeying their parents.

So every single German was that evil? Or were they just ordinary people who were taught to obey and just follow orders? I mean Hilter, Goebbels, Himler and all those Drs who performed vivisection were evil, but the average guard at a Concentration Camp?

Maybe you need to read about the Milgram experiment.

https://www.simplypsychology.org/milgram.html

[Anonymous]

I expect my kids to obey when I tell them to do something and I've made the final decision as the parent. Sometimes (safety issues, urgent situations, most situations in public places, etc.) I will give an instruction that is the final word right off the bat and is to be obeyed immediately.

If I do not see a need for immediate compliance and am instead open to some discussion before making a final decision, I tell them that. They may then calmly and respectfully present their reasons that they think the final decision should be something other than what I've indicated I am inclined to say. I think it's important to model that decisions should be made thoughtfully, deliberately, and based on the most complete information it is reasonable to obtain. Once a decision is made, however, I am the parent and the one ultimately both in charge of and responsible for my kids, so I do expect to be obeyed.

[Anonymous]

Sometimes I’ll tell my kid to do something, she’ll ask why, and when I tell her why she’ll suggest an alternative that accomplishes the same goal but that she’s happier about doing. IF it really does accomplish the same goal, I’m okay with that. I also see a distinction between a request and an order — “go get dressed” is one thing and “I’m in the middle of something tricky” is not an okay answer, “could you please grab me a glass of water, I can’t stop stirring this” is not her job and if she’s busy I can get my own drink in a minute.

[Anonymous]

I tell her what is an absolute rule, and what I would like done. The latter is the more optional. She is not confused because my language is very clear.

“If you ride your moped without a helmet, we will sell it and you will never see it again.”

vs

“It would be helpful if you could empty the dishwasher before I get home.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not blindly, no. But I expect them to comply when I make reasonable requests and to discuss it calmly and respectfully if they disagree.

^^^mine are older. When they were toddlers, yes I expected them to follow safety commands. Don’t touch that, don’t go in the street, etc.

How old were they when you decided it was ok for you to debate everything you told them, that they didn't agree with?

Not sure. They’ve always been advanced communicators. They are not rude and somehow they know the difference between a non negotiable (like a safety item) and weather or not I feel a certain TV show us age appropriate. I’m open to respectful discussion on some things. And if I’m not, I’ll say “this isn’t negotiable.”

What I'm getting at is this:
When your kid wants something, and you say "no", is it *really* a good idea to let your kid debate you?

People keep asking why so many boys/men think they can assault a girl/woman when she said "no". If our boys have been trained to ignore "no", what exactly should we expect?

If you want to debate things with your kid, please do NOT say "no", and then back off and open a debate.

Instead say, let's talk about it, or let me think about, or I'll discuss it with your father/mother.

If you want "No Means No, start acting like it and put your money where your mouth is. Mean what you say, or don't say it.

I can see how boys think "no means yes", if that's how they're been raised. Most boys know that if they nag/pound their parents long enough, they'll often get what they want. Allowing a debate after you've already said "no", is very dangerous territory.

Well, mine are girls to be precise. And yes I absolutely want them to feel they can question authority when it doesn’t feel right. Blind obedience got us the holocaust.

This is about children. And it makes a difference if your disobedient child is a preschooler vs. a highschooler.

[Anonymous]

No, it's not mean. Children should respect and obey their parents.