Lawmakers told Maryland Schools are Complacent and Middle of the Pack

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/10/a-creative-way-to-educate-low-income-students/381461/

Background on Cristo Rey schools and their mission to break the cycle of poverty.

A friend is affiliated with one in Los Angeles, and the outcomes are nothing short of amazing. Everyone gets up to grade level or higher (most students start several years below grade levels), everyone graduates, everyone goes to college, and everyone is ultimately employed.

If you went to private school, you understand the difference between private and public when it comes to structure, discipline, and philosophy.

The biggest thing these schools accomplish is preventing kids from getting involved with drugs or crime. Once a kid sets down the wrong path, it's nearly impossible to succeed.

If we learned anything from Mark Zuckerberg's failed school experiment in Newark, it's that fancy buildings with fancy technology and fancy pants teachers aren't the solution. Closing the achievement gap entails kicking it old school: setting expectations, demanding excellence, and an all hands on deck approach to equipping students to succeed. We don't need Prometheun boards and chrome books. We need a better curriculum, structure, discipline, smaller class sizes, and more resources.

We need better pay for teachers to get best teachers. We need to have involved parents. There is no way that the schools can replace what parents need to do at home. And we need to ban smartphones in school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:


We need better pay for teachers to get best teachers. We need to have involved parents. There is no way that the schools can replace what parents need to do at home. And we need to ban smartphones in school.

In the countries that have school systems that everybody likes to point to as good, are all parents involved? And how are they involved?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Nope, not necessarily. Look at Clarksburg HS which has a 30% FARMS rate, look at the data and you'll see that Asian students there are thriving and doing very well. These are not kids from wealthy Bethesda families. Same with other schools- look at the data on Asian students. The fact is, a lot of Asian families regardless of socioeconomic background- value education, expect success and pass this down to their children.

Right, they're kids from wealthy Clarksburg families.

(My kid goes to Clarksburg HS, so please forgive me if I'm a bit eye-roll-y about the cultural expectations and values that all families with ancestry from anywhere in Asia have for their children.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope, not necessarily. Look at Clarksburg HS which has a 30% FARMS rate, look at the data and you'll see that Asian students there are thriving and doing very well. These are not kids from wealthy Bethesda families. Same with other schools- look at the data on Asian students. The fact is, a lot of Asian families regardless of socioeconomic background- value education, expect success and pass this down to their children.

Right, they're kids from wealthy Clarksburg families.

(My kid goes to Clarksburg HS, so please forgive me if I'm a bit eye-roll-y about the cultural expectations and values that all families with ancestry from anywhere in Asia have for their children.)

Obviously there are exceptions to everything but let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that there is a value system in most Asian families that education is the way to success. Whether you like it or not, it exists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Obviously there are exceptions to everything but let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that there is a value system in most Asian families that education is the way to success. Whether you like it or not, it exists.

Let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that Asia is a big continent. Lots of different cultures, lots of different values. Not to mention that there are plenty of "Asian" families -- including in Clarksburg -- where the parents are as American as you are and I am. Or at least as I am (I don't know about you). And even in the families where the parents grew up in a country on the continent of Asia, the kids are growing up in America.

[Anonymous]

Would you encourage your child to go into teaching? No. The best and the brightest are doing things to go for $$, the autonomy, etc. Teachers used to be able to teach. Now, the bureaucracy is insane, the paperwork is all consuming, the differentiation for 35+students 5 classes per day, the percentage of kids that need accomodations, dealing with crazy parents without having an administration that backs you up, having to teach to the test, and so on. Now add in Title 1, high ESOL or focus school, so your students are also hungry, worried about money, or a parents sobriety or interpreting for a parent at a school meeting or Dr appt, or where they will live next week or about a million other things not related to school.

I know some AMAZING teachers. They love what they do, and work their magic under ridiculous circumstances. They sometimes (if in late 40s/50s) have a spouse that also teaches, but nowadays, you need at least one high-earner in the family. Plus, so many get burned out within the first 5 years. Its a career you have to do out of love or passion, but I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Obviously there are exceptions to everything but let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that there is a value system in most Asian families that education is the way to success. Whether you like it or not, it exists.

Let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that Asia is a big continent. Lots of different cultures, lots of different values. Not to mention that there are plenty of "Asian" families -- including in Clarksburg -- where the parents are as American as you are and I am. Or at least as I am (I don't know about you). And even in the families where the parents grew up in a country on the continent of Asia, the kids are growing up in America.

Okay clearly you are just here to argue. The truth shall set you free. If you don't see a bit of truth in what I'm saying then I don't know what else to tell you. Please explain the data to me though. Why do Asian students on average consistently do well in school compared to other ethnic groups. Guess what- the answer isn't because they are all wealthy.

[Anonymous]

Schools like Cristo Ray can kick out students who aren't pulling their own weight. I know because one of my former students was asked to leave. He had very little work ethic and while his teachers saw potential, nobody at home cared much that he was asked to leave. To his parents, what difference does it make where he goes to school? Read this article about a Cristo Rey student who wasn't allowed to attend graduation due to his latenesses.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-cristo-rey-graduation-20160610-story.html
My DS goes to a private school now after years in public school. There is much more structure, discipline (behaviorally and in terms of work ethic) and basic skills are mastered before moving on to higher order thinking skills. I work in a Title One school and our district LOVES to tout the higher order thinking skills but our students often cannot write a complete sentence. They can't spell and their handwriting is often impossible to read. "It's the message that counts!" Um, no. Kids need the basics first and then they can move on to the higher order stuff. Our teachers assign basic HW and the majority of students don't do it. Simple stuff like spelling words three times each, basic math worksheets, etc. Nobody at home makes them do it. It is not a priority. That is the difference between poor Asians. Even poor Asians prioritize education. They work multiple jobs to pay for tutors. They value teachers. I have parents screaming at me at least once a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nope, not necessarily. Look at Clarksburg HS which has a 30% FARMS rate, look at the data and you'll see that Asian students there are thriving and doing very well. These are not kids from wealthy Bethesda families. Same with other schools- look at the data on Asian students. The fact is, a lot of Asian families regardless of socioeconomic background- value education, expect success and pass this down to their children.

Right, they're kids from wealthy Clarksburg families.

(My kid goes to Clarksburg HS, so please forgive me if I'm a bit eye-roll-y about the cultural expectations and values that all families with ancestry from anywhere in Asia have for their children.)

Obviously there are exceptions to everything but let's truly be honest with ourselves and not deny that there is a value system in most Asian families that education is the way to success. Whether you like it or not, it exists.

Well, I would qualify that to emphasize that *certain* kinds of education are the way to *financial* success. You don't see many Asian parents encouraging their kids to become scholars, teachers, librarians, or philosophy PhDs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: Schools like Cristo Ray can kick out students who aren't pulling their own weight. I know because one of my former students was asked to leave. He had very little work ethic and while his teachers saw potential, nobody at home cared much that he was asked to leave. To his parents, what difference does it make where he goes to school? Read this article about a Cristo Rey student who wasn't allowed to attend graduation due to his latenesses.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-cristo-rey-graduation-20160610-story.html
My DS goes to a private school now after years in public school. There is much more structure, discipline (behaviorally and in terms of work ethic) and basic skills are mastered before moving on to higher order thinking skills. I work in a Title One school and our district LOVES to tout the higher order thinking skills but our students often cannot write a complete sentence. They can't spell and their handwriting is often impossible to read. "It's the message that counts!" Um, no. Kids need the basics first and then they can move on to the higher order stuff. Our teachers assign basic HW and the majority of students don't do it. Simple stuff like spelling words three times each, basic math worksheets, etc. Nobody at home makes them do it. It is not a priority. That is the difference between poor Asians. Even poor Asians prioritize education. They work multiple jobs to pay for tutors. They value teachers. I have parents screaming at me at least once a week.

There's always a counterexample though. I have worked at private schools with very little discipline because the children (and their very influential parents) are always right. Lessons are always fun and never too taxing or stressful, because the customers wouldn't like it. In contrast my kids go to a public school with high behavioral expectations where kids (and parents) respect the teachers.

[Anonymous]

Catholic schools are the way to go.

[Anonymous]

Maryland was ranked number one in the country in the same survey only three years ago. Thanks Hogan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Okay clearly you are just here to argue. The truth shall set you free. If you don't see a bit of truth in what I'm saying then I don't know what else to tell you. Please explain the data to me though. Why do Asian students on average consistently do well in school compared to other ethnic groups. Guess what- the answer isn't because they are all wealthy.

It's certainly part of the answer. Another part of the answer is the educational levels of the immigrants when they arrived in the US.

Not part of the answer: "the Asian culture". Because there is no such thing as "the Asian culture".

http://www.pewresearch.org/topics/asian-americans/

The "model minority" myth benefits nobody, and people should stop peddling it. You know which immigrant groups are notably successful in the US, by the way? Immigrants from West Africa and the Caribbean. "The Asian culture" doesn't explain that either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: Schools like Cristo Ray can kick out students who aren't pulling their own weight. I know because one of my former students was asked to leave. He had very little work ethic and while his teachers saw potential, nobody at home cared much that he was asked to leave. To his parents, what difference does it make where he goes to school? Read this article about a Cristo Rey student who wasn't allowed to attend graduation due to his latenesses.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-cristo-rey-graduation-20160610-story.html
My DS goes to a private school now after years in public school. There is much more structure, discipline (behaviorally and in terms of work ethic) and basic skills are mastered before moving on to higher order thinking skills. I work in a Title One school and our district LOVES to tout the higher order thinking skills but our students often cannot write a complete sentence. They can't spell and their handwriting is often impossible to read. "It's the message that counts!" Um, no. Kids need the basics first and then they can move on to the higher order stuff. Our teachers assign basic HW and the majority of students don't do it. Simple stuff like spelling words three times each, basic math worksheets, etc. Nobody at home makes them do it. It is not a priority. That is the difference between poor Asians. Even poor Asians prioritize education. They work multiple jobs to pay for tutors. They value teachers. I have parents screaming at me at least once a week.

Your post seemingly supports the structure and rigor of Cristo Rey, and it certainly underscores how low the bar is set in MD with 2.0---which no longer teaches handwriting or grammar and produces students who can't write basic sentences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Your post seemingly supports the structure and rigor of Cristo Rey, and it certainly underscores how low the bar is set in MD with 2.0---which no longer teaches handwriting or grammar and produces students who can't write basic sentences.

I, personally, do not judge the quality of a school based on how much time they have students practicing their cursive.