Being average when you know they can do better

[Anonymous]

I was also going to post about Carol Dweck. Go read her book, Mindset. What you're describing is very characteristic of a Fixed mindset versus a Growth mindset (and 90% of the replies in this thread are more examples of a Fixed mindset).

[Anonymous]

OP, I don't even know where to begin. This post says much more about you than it does about your children. You need to adjust your perspective more than they need to adjust their behavior.

You mentioned leadership. A huge part of being a parent is being a leader for your children until they are ready to run alone. You will find it very difficult to define criteria for success and then expect your children to meet them. Leadership is about providing a framework for success, a vision of the possibilities that your kids g achieve. You need to inspire them if you want them to be driven. If you don't indoor then, they will just go through the motions to get you off their backs.

Sounds to me like you aren't very inspiring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't even know where to begin. This post says much more about you than it does about your children. You need to adjust your perspective more than they need to adjust their behavior.

You mentioned leadership. A huge part of being a parent is being a leader for your children until they are ready to run alone. You will find it very difficult to define criteria for success and then expect your children to meet them. Leadership is about providing a framework for success, a vision of the possibilities that your kids g achieve. You need to inspire them if you want them to be driven. If you don't indoor then, they will just go through the motions to get you off their backs.

Sounds to me like you aren't very inspiring.

+1. Glad I didn't have you as a parent. /s/ Average but successful lawyer and parent to two average kids. We are happy.

[Anonymous]

Op. I do think this is a personality thing. I am highly gifted and fit the mold perfectly. I refused all help and learned and achieved on my terms. I did read a bunch of stuff like support your kid and they will bloom. So i Did. I support and wait for where i can fit in. Then to my surprise , my kids dont have much creativity or inspiration. I guess personally im at a lost. I do think it could be my parenting style but leading seems very manipulative. I talk to parents who plan out clever ways to incentivize their kids to do x or y. I do not do that at all. I want them to ask for what they want. I do suggest. Hey would you like x? If they say no, they dont do. They choose what they want to do. My issue is they dont choose much. I dont make my kids achieve because they arent. Im just surprised they arent choosing when they can.

Also my kids do have a high quality of things but we dont have help. No cleaning lady, no baby sitters, etc. Our oldest gets kids from bus until we come home. We have a chore list that is inclusive of everything. Laundry, kitchen prep, sweeping, trash, bathrooms, room, vacuum. They bring their lunches. Everything. They are ambivalent about it.if reminded, they will do. Partially It is they have nothing they want other than candy or gum. They read and say they get books for free. Some $ goes toward online games.

They are very frugal. They look at everything with a cost benefit. If its low probability of success they always pick a sure thing with no risk. There are some inlaws who have this personality so maybe it comes from there? Its not about me but i am just surprised by this because its so different than me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't even know where to begin. This post says much more about you than it does about your children. You need to adjust your perspective more than they need to adjust their behavior.

You mentioned leadership. A huge part of being a parent is being a leader for your children until they are ready to run alone. You will find it very difficult to define criteria for success and then expect your children to meet them. Leadership is about providing a framework for success, a vision of the possibilities that your kids g achieve. You need to inspire them if you want them to be driven. If you don't indoor then, they will just go through the motions to get you off their backs.

Sounds to me like you aren't very inspiring.

My parents are the most uninspiring ppl. I am into quite a lot of things. Art, exercise, design , cooking, entrepreneur so many things. I have like a zillion ideas from a walk in the park... Nobody inspired me. I am not sure what you mean by this? Completely over my head

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was also going to post about Carol Dweck. Go read her book, Mindset. What you're describing is very characteristic of a Fixed mindset versus a Growth mindset (and 90% of the replies in this thread are more examples of a Fixed mindset).

Lol. I READ THIS. LOVE IT. I had my kids read it. They said it was stupid. Sigh. I dont know what to think..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was also going to post about Carol Dweck. Go read her book, Mindset. What you're describing is very characteristic of a Fixed mindset versus a Growth mindset (and 90% of the replies in this thread are more examples of a Fixed mindset).

Op. Yes!!!

My one caveat with this book is it said some mindsets are innate. I innately have a growth mindset. Just is

My kids and honestly my husband says this book is stupid and im justifying them to be like me.
So the book reinforced everything i believe and it just made them feel like it was some foreign concept that is for other people if they want

I give examples of all the things i didnt do Well but then i kept trying. They just say its pointless because why do they want to do the things i do or other things. I say for personal enjoyment, satisfaction ?

Response. Its fun watching tv.

[Anonymous]

OP, most of your two posts have been about you. Just look at your opening sentences to each.

There's no way you're a self-aware as you think. There just isn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, most of your two posts have been about you. Just look at your opening sentences to each.

There's no way you're a self-aware as you think. There just isn't.

That is a direct result of the posts insinuating the situation is my doing. Hence what i am doing. Seriously??? ! Are you serious?

[Anonymous]

In 15 years, you'll be back here wondering how much time is "normal" for adult children to spend with their parents during holidays and expectations for the extent of involvement in grandchildren's milestones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I exceed and still excel at a number of things and am willing to try hard. My husband excels at work and is an all or nothing kind of guy. I have 3 kids who dont naturally push themselves. They gravitate to safe and easy. Grades. As and Bs. Sports. Average. Art. Good ability dont want to try. Music. Dont want to practice. Friends. Never initiate. Participate when invited only. Talent > effort in all cases. I never see leadership or a im going to do or be <great at x, win x>. So there is no success stories. Just participation. Pretty complacent about win or lose. Anger when i suggest they do better. They compare yhemself to the worst kid in class, sport etc and use that to justify their medoicrity. We spend a lot of $ on activities (3 eakid)

Problem. Am i a bad parent if i let this continue leave them be. Or am i supposed to push them to some great level by being stricter? I feel like ive failed to give them a life skill. I see them having lifestyles way below their current one.

They have every opportunity but just dont take advantage to make most out of it.
Let them be?

I know some parents would continue to push.
Whats best for the low motivation child?
I ? If pushing would long term change them or just continue to stress me out.
Some tell me natural motivation is ab normal. But when i read bios of any great success they always credit self motivation.

Yes, my child was the same. For an extra curricular she liked, we sat down together and I had her come up with a goal that was reachable. It was to get two levels above her current level. Then I explained that I expected her to practice and participate and that I would support her during practice. I have had to really drive practice at home but once she starts practicing she does get into it and she has passed the first level. That first achievement really helped her see that she could do it.

I realize that just general pushing was too vague for my child and that she was more goal oriented. When she could see the finish line, it made more sense for her to keep going.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, most of your two posts have been about you. Just look at your opening sentences to each.

There's no way you're a self-aware as you think. There just isn't.

That is a direct result of the posts insinuating the situation is my doing. Hence what i am doing. Seriously??? ! Are you serious?

Yeah, I am serious. Your first post was all about you, not just the follow ups where you might be defending yourself.

I stand by my statement. You're not self-aware at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am not a teacher, but I married into a family full of teachers. My in-laws have always spoken, at length, about many of their observations. One that they've mentioned over the years is how, sometimes, when you have two superstar parents, you end up with with a meh kid, or even a dumb kid. They attribute this to a few different things:

- Parents over scheduling and helicoptering because there's a lot of pressure on superstar parents to produce a superstar kid. This isn't child-led and leaves the children with little opportunity to build confidence in themselves and find things at which they are good. This can also lead to a sort of quiet rebellion on the part of the kid, on some level. I'll bet you give a lot of attention to your kids for NOT excelling. On some level, they know this gets a rise out of you. If a parent isn't possible to please, why bother?

- Parents being more focused on their careers than on developing their child academically. Frankly, your kids might think you both work all the damn time, and they might have opinions about that. High pressure careers come with stress. You're very quick to assume that your kids see your work ethic as noble, and you seem confused as to why they don't want to emulate you.

- Parents conceiving with sub-optimal genetic material, since they're older. Superstars rarely crank out kids in their reproductive prime. They're still in school, getting established, making a name for themselves. Their egg and sperm might be able to get the job done (with or without assistance), but still isn't at its prime. This might not apply to your case, since you said your kids are talented. However, by your own admission your kids don't have much to show for their supposedly high level of talent. Have you considered that they might just be talented only in your eyes? Who knows? They might actually not be as smart as you think.

- Children spending a disproportionate amount of time in their early years with people who aren't as intelligent as the parents.

- Parents' high ability to farm out basic household tasks to outside support, which they need to do in order to save their sanity. This leave leaves the kids with minimal real world responsibilities beyond school/sports/whatever. This is a big one. In some of these households, there are many people waiting on the kids (often indirectly, so they parents don't think it is a problem). The result is that the kids don't have to take really any degree of responsibility for steering the family ship. If you have a lawn guy, your kids don't have to mow the lawn in the hot summer. They also don't learn that manual labor is tough, and that a great white collar job might be a ticket out of a lifestyle where you have to do crap like that. If you have a house cleaner, your kids probably don't know that toilets really start to smell and that they need to be scrubbed thoroughly. If you've got a meal prep service, or you get a lot of takeout from Whole Foods, Larlo never learns that meal prep can take all day on Sunday, and that it cuts into other things he'd rather be doing. My in laws have found that career oriented, "power couple" type households with robust help can often churn out shockingly incapable kids, because the damn kids have never had to troubleshoot anything, screw in a light bulb, and so on.

Your kids probably have absolutely no idea what is involved in the responsibilities of day to day life, or just how much money is involved in running a household such as yours. Good luck to them. There are many partners at my husband's firm who had ONE successful parent (one partner's Mom had a job at Lehman, another partner had a Dad was a partner at another firm, and so on). However most of them had an at home parent, or at least someone who was very part time and added some balance to the household. Believe me, there is no balance in households like yours. And the sad thing is that you probably think you set it up perfectly. ("Hey! If I just outsource as much as possible, we will have tons of time for family!!") You can't spend all day grinding away, come home to a hot meal prepared by Esmeralda, have all house and lawn work done by someone else, and expect your kids to have a damn clue. You just cant.

NP here. This post makes some good points. However, I think the PP is conflating the OP's situation with the situation of a hard-charging career mom. From OP's post, I could not tell whether OP was a working mom or a stay-at-home mom. Plenty of SAHM's are very high achievers and very self-disciplined, at least the ones I know in Bethesda.

Nevertheless, PP makes some good points. I will say that some of those points hit too close to home, and that I don't necessarily agree with them. My DH and I both work full-time for a variety of reasons. We went to top schools but chose more family-friendly jobs. We have 3 kids and therefore have household help at this stage in life (cleaning once a week, and an after-school babysitter who prepares weekday meals). However, I wouldn't characterize my kids as clueless. We live in a modest house with old cars, in part because paying for this household help (a sanity saver for us) means we don't have the money to live in a better house or driver better cars.

As a kid, my mom had to ramp up her career when my dad's job had some setbacks, and we also had weekly cleaning and help with meals. I don't consider myself clueless either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I exceed and still excel at a number of things and am willing to try hard. My husband excels at work and is an all or nothing kind of guy. I have 3 kids who dont naturally push themselves. They gravitate to safe and easy. Grades. As and Bs. Sports. Average. Art. Good ability dont want to try. Music. Dont want to practice. Friends. Never initiate. Participate when invited only. Talent > effort in all cases. I never see leadership or a im going to do or be <great at x, win x>. So there is no success stories. Just participation. Pretty complacent about win or lose. Anger when i suggest they do better. They compare yhemself to the worst kid in class, sport etc and use that to justify their medoicrity. We spend a lot of $ on activities (3 eakid)

Problem. Am i a bad parent if i let this continue leave them be. Or am i supposed to push them to some great level by being stricter? I feel like ive failed to give them a life skill. I see them having lifestyles way below their current one.

They have every opportunity but just dont take advantage to make most out of it.
Let them be?

I know some parents would continue to push.
Whats best for the low motivation child?
I ? If pushing would long term change them or just continue to stress me out.
Some tell me natural motivation is ab normal. But when i read bios of any great success they always credit self motivation.

Yes, my child was the same. For an extra curricular she liked, we sat down together and I had her come up with a goal that was reachable. It was to get two levels above her current level. Then I explained that I expected her to practice and participate and that I would support her during practice. I have had to really drive practice at home but once she starts practicing she does get into it and she has passed the first level. That first achievement really helped her see that she could do it.

I realize that just general pushing was too vague for my child and that she was more goal oriented. When she could see the finish line, it made more sense for her to keep going.

You are good!

[Anonymous]

I have a family member who was pushed to be "at the top" by her parents. She is incredibly bright. She also just dropped out of an Ivy, is battling a raging eating disorder and coke addiction.

So, yeah, pushing might work to some extent. But it's not everything.