Bromance interfereing with child rearing --- will he ever get it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That's how my husband was-and it killed our marriage. He was using a lot of that time to avoid me and avoid dealing with problems. He does see the kids more now that we're separated, but he missed out on so much of their lives, and is still missing so much time he could have had with them. I think he would say he's a comitted, involved father, but he's so oblivious to things going on with them and I don't think he'll ever understand or appreciate the damage he has done to his relationship.

I have a similar story. I tried so many times to discuss this with now ex-husband - I mean I really approached him repeatedly from every angle. For us what happened was that he pulled away MORE. 40 year old "Frat guy" is exactly how I would describe him when the kids were young. At times I was more demanding about him being home more rather than out with his friends (all single and younger) - then he would be home more but in a horrible mood. He really truly did not want to be a husband and father. At least, not how I imagined it would be. This was before I ever heard of DCUM but I did ask as many people in real life as I could about what was "normal."
So OP, my advice to you would be to have a calm but serious discussion with your DH about your expectations and needs. Ask him to tell you what his expectations and needs are. Try to reach a compromise. Obviously he needs his friend time. But does he need so much friend time that you feel alone with the kids nearly all of the time? It is not clear from your posts whether or not you have talked to him - really talked with him - about how his social life is impacting your marriage and your kids' childhoods. I highly recommend you taking the here is the problem/let's find a solution approach. This as opposed to an attack or an airing of complaints. It's worth a try. Some guys need it spelled out for them. Hopefully you are able to work it out.
If not then you will have to decide whether this lifestyle is okay for you or not and then do what you have to do.
Fwiw I lived this way for 10 years with 3 kids and then finally got divorced when it was clear the man was not going to change. I was too lonely, too hurt and too angry to stay with the 40 year old Frat Boy. Not sure if this was predictable in my case - he did want kids for sure. And probably has always seen himself as an involved dad. From my perspective his involvement has been quite limited, as he has never had much time or interest in them. It's very sad and entirely his loss. I truly wish my kids had a better dad.

[Anonymous]

Set a schedule. Each parent gets one weeknight out with friends after the kids are asleep. For example, you get Tues nights and he gets Thurs nights after 8 PM. Maybe schedule a weekend morning or afternoon off for each of you if that's feasible. One person gets Sat. morning off and the other gets Sun. morning. The rest of the weekend should be family time unless there's a special occasion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So let's use the store example since that happened today. So his reason was that I didn't ask however he was getting ready to go to hang with the boys. Nothing urgent or time sensitive going on with his friends.

Will asking really change things?

He has such a sense of urgency for them but never initiates anything with the kids.

Are most men gathering the family to go out for walks or suggesting shows or movies to watch together if it's raining out? Am I too unrealistic? I'm not sure as to what other people do when everyone is home at the same time.

It doesn't really matter how most men are, it matters how your husband is. For the record, my husband did not initiate family walks or find family friendly movies or shows, or even consider things to do with little kids. He's amazing with teenagers, but he had no idea what to do with little kids and I had it handled so he ignored it. Until I started using my words and saying I needed him to do more with the kids. I'd say we were going for after dinner walks, and I expected him to join us. When it became habit, yes, he did begin initiating sometimes. On rainy weekends I'd involve him in the brainstorming for what to do with the kids. When I was doing it all myself, it was exhausting, but he had no idea what to do and I wasn't giving him the space to figure it out himself because I had it handled.

[Anonymous]

All I can say OP is that's not typical with my DH or any of my friends' DHs.

My DH has a guys poker night and goes out about every bird Saturday. He stays out very late. He does 1-2 weekends a year with friends. He and I together socialize with couples as well and I do things with just my friends.

I would not be ok with what you're describing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All I can say OP is that's not typical with my DH or any of my friends' DHs.

My DH has a guys poker night and goes out about every bird Saturday. He stays out very late. He does 1-2 weekends a year with friends. He and I together socialize with couples as well and I do things with just my friends.

I would not be ok with what you're describing.

Third Saturday

[Anonymous]

Each of us takes a few hours every other week or so for ourselves, either with friends or whatever. All other free non working time is spent as a family or a couple.

Ops situation is definitely very far from the norm.

[Anonymous]

op - you married and procreated with a bro, you reap what you sow

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What is normal?

Well, I've been with my DH 15 years too. Married for almost 11. We have 3 kids.

He gets together with male friends about once a month or so, in our house or someone else's, for a sports game or card game or something. After lunch or before dinner. If it goes on too long, I give him a signal. He packs it up.

Lol you go girl!

[Anonymous]

Did you get pregnant thinking it would change him into a family man?

You say he has always been this way so why did you marry him and why did you have not 1, but 2 kids.

Your husband is not the one who is slow on the intake.

Feel bad for your kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Set a schedule. Each parent gets one weeknight out with friends after the kids are asleep. For example, you get Tues nights and he gets Thurs nights after 8 PM. Maybe schedule a weekend morning or afternoon off for each of you if that's feasible. One person gets Sat. morning off and the other gets Sun. morning. The rest of the weekend should be family time unless there's a special occasion.

+1. I think the first step is some sort of schedule where you get to have an interest/hobby/free time. I think he needs one night a week where he does it all with the kids including bedtime and maybe another where you split up the bedtime duties and he goes out afterwards and vice versa. It's important for him to bond with the children and have time he is 100% responsible while they are awake and you are not there. Have at least one night a week that is a family tradition like Friday night pizza and let DH come up with the tradition or something he remembers fondly about weekends when he was a child.

As for family walks and doing activities outside the home as a family, our ideas are different. We will go as a family to support the kids at local athletic events, go to school events as a family, and go out to dinner as a family. Other than that it tends to be one us comes up with an idea for self and kids. We discuss it so there isn't a schedule conflict and the other can join or not join. I think I went a lot more when they were younger for the bathroom aspect. I might pick a play at Imagination stage, the Children's Library, or the park. He would take the kids out to breakfast, sporting events (though he does that one at a time) or with him on errands.

[Anonymous]

Pp, forgot to add the approach is fairness for you to meet your friends, have a hobby etc, not saying he doesn't measure up as a husband or parent or acting the way you think is right. You want him to be part of the solution and you want the facts to be straightforward. You are NOT trying to stop him from seeing his friends etc, you need to have a similar outlet and need his help coming up with a schedule that works for the both of you and is fair to both of you.

[Anonymous]

Was he like this when you were dating, too? When you were married, but before kids? Did you go with him before the kids and just stopped once you were taking care of them?

I'm an extrovert and I like to see my friends at least once a week. Most of the guys I know do a weekly night out, not an every-night thing. That seems extreme.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:15 years -- married for 7


His response is that I don't ask him to join us but my expectation is that he should WANT to join us.

Now I'm starting to think maybe I am the crazy one who expects things to run too smoothly.

What is "normal"?

Okay he told you what he expects. Now you tell him. I expect you to stop spending time with the boys and start spending time with the children. Tell him he has to spend x number of days a week with the kids. There done. Do not make this hard with oh you should want to spend time with the kids or what ever. Seriously you are thinking about this too much.

[Anonymous]

I don't know any of our friends who spends 3-4 hours every night their friends...even the childfree ones spend most of their time with their spouses! Some of our friends have weekly game nights and those are people with kids and a childfree couple. No way would they consider increasing that to even twice a week.

It seems like he is emotionally manipulating you maybe even gaslighting if you feel like you are the crazy one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know any of our friends who spends 3-4 hours every night their friends...even the childfree ones spend most of their time with their spouses! Some of our friends have weekly game nights and those are people with kids and a childfree couple. No way would they consider increasing that to even twice a week.

It seems like he is emotionally manipulating you maybe even gaslighting if you feel like you are the crazy one.

There it is! One of the favorite buzzwords of dcum women!