What's it really like at the Big 3?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to think that the parents at my child's school treat one another the same regardless of socioecomic class, but I was most astonished to find that a current parent who is African-American and to who seems virtually shunned at school events is actually an alumnus who attended the school on scholarship and was a varsity athlete! I learned this when I came across his name in the school directory with his year of graduation after it, as all alumni are designated. Could it be that race and FA status are insurmountable barriers at this school? Are other parents perhaps unaware that this parent is an alumnus? As a member of a minority group (though not African-American) and a relatively new parent at this school, I have felt like an outsider at school events, but I don't know how much of this is my being relatively new, my seeming aloof (as I have been told since I was eight years old!), my being a minority, other parents' being shy, other parents' being exclusive . . . . Who knows?

At my son's school, an AA alum with an ivy league degree and who is quite intelligent has worked there as a coach for almost 20 years and has never been invited to teach in a classroom. Not surprising given that there's only 2 male AA teachers at the school. Usually alum at this school are teacher-coaches.

[Anonymous]

Which school are you referring to?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to think that the parents at my child's school treat one another the same regardless of socioecomic class, but I was most astonished to find that a current parent who is African-American and to who seems virtually shunned at school events is actually an alumnus who attended the school on scholarship and was a varsity athlete! I learned this when I came across his name in the school directory with his year of graduation after it, as all alumni are designated. Could it be that race and FA status are insurmountable barriers at this school? Are other parents perhaps unaware that this parent is an alumnus? As a member of a minority group (though not African-American) and a relatively new parent at this school, I have felt like an outsider at school events, but I don't know how much of this is my being relatively new, my seeming aloof (as I have been told since I was eight years old!), my being a minority, other parents' being shy, other parents' being exclusive . . . . Who knows?

At my son's school, an AA alum with an ivy league degree and who is quite intelligent has worked there as a coach for almost 20 years and has never been invited to teach in a classroom. Not surprising given that there's only 2 male AA teachers at the school. Usually alum at this school are teacher-coaches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Which school are you referring to?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to think that the parents at my child's school treat one another the same regardless of socioecomic class, but I was most astonished to find that a current parent who is African-American and to who seems virtually shunned at school events is actually an alumnus who attended the school on scholarship and was a varsity athlete! I learned this when I came across his name in the school directory with his year of graduation after it, as all alumni are designated. Could it be that race and FA status are insurmountable barriers at this school? Are other parents perhaps unaware that this parent is an alumnus? As a member of a minority group (though not African-American) and a relatively new parent at this school, I have felt like an outsider at school events, but I don't know how much of this is my being relatively new, my seeming aloof (as I have been told since I was eight years old!), my being a minority, other parents' being shy, other parents' being exclusive . . . . Who knows?

At my son's school, an AA alum with an ivy league degree and who is quite intelligent has worked there as a coach for almost 20 years and has never been invited to teach in a classroom. Not surprising given that there's only 2 male AA teachers at the school. Usually alum at this school are teacher-coaches.

STA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Which school are you referring to?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd like to think that the parents at my child's school treat one another the same regardless of socioecomic class, but I was most astonished to find that a current parent who is African-American and to who seems virtually shunned at school events is actually an alumnus who attended the school on scholarship and was a varsity athlete! I learned this when I came across his name in the school directory with his year of graduation after it, as all alumni are designated. Could it be that race and FA status are insurmountable barriers at this school? Are other parents perhaps unaware that this parent is an alumnus? As a member of a minority group (though not African-American) and a relatively new parent at this school, I have felt like an outsider at school events, but I don't know how much of this is my being relatively new, my seeming aloof (as I have been told since I was eight years old!), my being a minority, other parents' being shy, other parents' being exclusive . . . . Who knows?

At my son's school, an AA alum with an ivy league degree and who is quite intelligent has worked there as a coach for almost 20 years and has never been invited to teach in a classroom. Not surprising given that there's only 2 male AA teachers at the school. Usually alum at this school are teacher-coaches.

STA

Is the person to whom you are referring a full-time coach at STA who coaches or oversees the coaching of several sports, as opposed to coaching one sport and teachin one subject as the teacher-coaches at STA do? If his position is a full-time coaching position, then I could understand why he does not also teach a course. STA has at least one AA male teacher who teaches but does NOT coach a sport, so it seems they have a variety of positions along the spectrum extending from teaching to coaching.

I haven't compared numbers, but I would guess that STA's faculty diversity is not less than similar private schools' in th DC area.

I'm an STA parent, so you and I are posting about the same school, for I am also the one who posted at 07:27 about the AA alum who was a varsity athlete and whom I see everyone else ignoring. I have never met him, and I would not feel comfortable asking him, upon meeting, whether he feels shunned.

[Anonymous]

Harumph well I'm an STA parent too (and different from the two PPs). I know the AA coach who does not teach and went to an Ivy league school. Have you ever ASKED him whether he wants to teach?! Don't make assumptions on an anonymous board that somehow STA is holding him back because he is AA! He has stayed there 20 years after all, and is obviously happy. Perhaps he loves coaching but does not want to be in the classroom. No one who knows him doubts his intelligence or his pedrigree. I find this whole thread odd, as if somehow a man with his background would stay somewhere for 20 years and covet a classroom position and not have one. Just not true.

On the other point, of an AA alum who is seemingly "shunned." Again, I respectfully disagree. Shunned in what way? Doesn't come over and gossip with the ladies who are not even watching the games most of the time? Keeps to himself? Don't jump to conclusions that he is shunned! Just because you did not know he was a "famous" alum doesn't mean others did not! And there are many alum around, all the time, including many current faculty. Most are athletes given the nature of the school. I have no idea how you know this father was on scholarship, unless he told you. But that's a different issue.

We have several fathers who are alumni in my son's grade, and more than 1 is an AA actually. I can think of 2 offhand, and neither are shunned. One however keeps to himself. He comes to games and some events but stands alone, prefers to watch the games from the sideline, rather than the bleachers etc. He is very focused on his son, it is not because he is shunned or anti-social. He was indeed a famous varsity athlete at STA in his day. No one shuns him or treats him differently than any other parent. The other AA alum I can think of is very involved and is a frequent chaperone with his wife, came to the school play, comes to games, parties etc. That's my take at least.

But if you feel this is truly the case, then please be more welcoming -- seems like you have good intentions, then try to make sure you are as inclusive as possible. Sometimes people are just shy and it has nothing to do with financial aid, or socio-economic status or race. You yourself admit to being aloof or shy...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harumph well I'm an STA parent too (and different from the two PPs). I know the AA coach who does not teach and went to an Ivy league school. Have you ever ASKED him whether he wants to teach?! Don't make assumptions on an anonymous board that somehow STA is holding him back because he is AA! He has stayed there 20 years after all, and is obviously happy. Perhaps he loves coaching but does not want to be in the classroom. No one who knows him doubts his intelligence or his pedrigree. I find this whole thread odd, as if somehow a man with his background would stay somewhere for 20 years and covet a classroom position and not have one. Just not true.

On the other point, of an AA alum who is seemingly "shunned." Again, I respectfully disagree. Shunned in what way? Doesn't come over and gossip with the ladies who are not even watching the games most of the time? Keeps to himself? Don't jump to conclusions that he is shunned! Just because you did not know he was a "famous" alum doesn't mean others did not! And there are many alum around, all the time, including many current faculty. Most are athletes given the nature of the school. I have no idea how you know this father was on scholarship, unless he told you. But that's a different issue.

We have several fathers who are alumni in my son's grade, and more than 1 is an AA actually. I can think of 2 offhand, and neither are shunned. One however keeps to himself. He comes to games and some events but stands alone, prefers to watch the games from the sideline, rather than the bleachers etc. He is very focused on his son, it is not because he is shunned or anti-social. He was indeed a famous varsity athlete at STA in his day. No one shuns him or treats him differently than any other parent. The other AA alum I can think of is very involved and is a frequent chaperone with his wife, came to the school play, comes to games, parties etc. That's my take at least.

But if you feel this is truly the case, then please be more welcoming -- seems like you have good intentions, then try to make sure you are as inclusive as possible. Sometimes people are just shy and it has nothing to do with financial aid, or socio-economic status or race. You yourself admit to being aloof or shy...

07:27 here. You make a lot of good points to consider. However, starting your post with "Harumph" stes a negative tone to your response that detracts from your message. I would like to consider the substance of your message if not the defensive tone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harumph well I'm an STA parent too (and different from the two PPs). I know the AA coach who does not teach and went to an Ivy league school. Have you ever ASKED him whether he wants to teach?! Don't make assumptions on an anonymous board that somehow STA is holding him back because he is AA! He has stayed there 20 years after all, and is obviously happy. Perhaps he loves coaching but does not want to be in the classroom. No one who knows him doubts his intelligence or his pedrigree. I find this whole thread odd, as if somehow a man with his background would stay somewhere for 20 years and covet a classroom position and not have one. Just not true.

On the other point, of an AA alum who is seemingly "shunned." Again, I respectfully disagree. Shunned in what way? Doesn't come over and gossip with the ladies who are not even watching the games most of the time? Keeps to himself? Don't jump to conclusions that he is shunned! Just because you did not know he was a "famous" alum doesn't mean others did not! And there are many alum around, all the time, including many current faculty. Most are athletes given the nature of the school. I have no idea how you know this father was on scholarship, unless he told you. But that's a different issue.

We have several fathers who are alumni in my son's grade, and more than 1 is an AA actually. I can think of 2 offhand, and neither are shunned. One however keeps to himself. He comes to games and some events but stands alone, prefers to watch the games from the sideline, rather than the bleachers etc. He is very focused on his son, it is not because he is shunned or anti-social. He was indeed a famous varsity athlete at STA in his day. No one shuns him or treats him differently than any other parent. The other AA alum I can think of is very involved and is a frequent chaperone with his wife, came to the school play, comes to games, parties etc. That's my take at least.

But if you feel this is truly the case, then please be more welcoming -- seems like you have good intentions, then try to make sure you are as inclusive as possible. Sometimes people are just shy and it has nothing to do with financial aid, or socio-economic status or race. You yourself admit to being aloof or shy...

No assumptions being made in this coach's situation. And, yes, he does love to coach. I'll ask him why he doesn't teach in the classroom. Odd that other coaches are asked to serve dual roles at the school or step in as substitute teachers whenever there's a need.

I'm sure you're right, he was probably asked to teach and he told them no.

[Anonymous]

Wait a minute. At STA, you would expect a coach to also teach? Don't those call for different skills and qualifications? Can STA really be a big 3 if its football coach teaches geometry? That sounds like what would happen in a one-room school house in Kansas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait a minute. At STA, you would expect a coach to also teach? Don't those call for different skills and qualifications? Can STA really be a big 3 if its football coach teaches geometry? That sounds like what would happen in a one-room school house in Kansas.

Actually there are teacher-coaches (some great, some awful) and there are also admin-coaches (the director of admissions is the head soccer coach and the asst director is the head basketball coach).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait a minute. At STA, you would expect a coach to also teach? Don't those call for different skills and qualifications? Can STA really be a big 3 if its football coach teaches geometry? That sounds like what would happen in a one-room school house in Kansas.

No, at STA it's not that coaches also teach; rather, teachers also coach. This teacher-coach model (note: not the other way around, as in "coach-teacher") originated at UK public (read "private") schools. That teachers coach sports at STA and can be horrible at coaching explains why STA is not the sports powerhouse that others such as Landon are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait a minute. At STA, you would expect a coach to also teach? Don't those call for different skills and qualifications? Can STA really be a big 3 if its football coach teaches geometry? That sounds like what would happen in a one-room school house in Kansas.

No, at STA it's not that coaches also teach; rather, teachers also coach. This teacher-coach model (note: not the other way around, as in "coach-teacher") originated at UK public (read "private") schools. That teachers coach sports at STA and can be horrible at coaching explains why STA is not the sports powerhouse that others such as Landon are.

Bullshit! It depends on the sport. STA has excellent baseball and lacrosse coaches. Coaching success also depends on the talent level of your athletes and the lack of involvement of bullying parents.

[Anonymous]

We are at a Big 3. We are not elite and we are accepted more there and our child has tons of friends and loves it. I have been at both a Big 3 and a non Big 3 and can say personally that we find the people at the Big 3 much friendlier and welcoming to our surprise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harumph well I'm an STA parent too (and different from the two PPs). I know the AA coach who does not teach and went to an Ivy league school. Have you ever ASKED him whether he wants to teach?! Don't make assumptions on an anonymous board that somehow STA is holding him back because he is AA! He has stayed there 20 years after all, and is obviously happy. Perhaps he loves coaching but does not want to be in the classroom. No one who knows him doubts his intelligence or his pedrigree. I find this whole thread odd, as if somehow a man with his background would stay somewhere for 20 years and covet a classroom position and not have one. Just not true.

On the other point, of an AA alum who is seemingly "shunned." Again, I respectfully disagree. Shunned in what way? Doesn't come over and gossip with the ladies who are not even watching the games most of the time? Keeps to himself? Don't jump to conclusions that he is shunned! Just because you did not know he was a "famous" alum doesn't mean others did not! And there are many alum around, all the time, including many current faculty. Most are athletes given the nature of the school. I have no idea how you know this father was on scholarship, unless he told you. But that's a different issue.

We have several fathers who are alumni in my son's grade, and more than 1 is an AA actually. I can think of 2 offhand, and neither are shunned. One however keeps to himself. He comes to games and some events but stands alone, prefers to watch the games from the sideline, rather than the bleachers etc. He is very focused on his son, it is not because he is shunned or anti-social. He was indeed a famous varsity athlete at STA in his day. No one shuns him or treats him differently than any other parent. The other AA alum I can think of is very involved and is a frequent chaperone with his wife, came to the school play, comes to games, parties etc. That's my take at least.

But if you feel this is truly the case, then please be more welcoming -- seems like you have good intentions, then try to make sure you are as inclusive as possible. Sometimes people are just shy and it has nothing to do with financial aid, or socio-economic status or race. You yourself admit to being aloof or shy...

Of the 570 boys attending STA roughly 60 appear to be of African descent, there are about 6-8 per grade. Wow, more than 1 AA alumni in your son's grade? That's a pretty decent number given the limited number of AAs who would have attended the school 20-30 or so years ago. The gregarious alumni is probably the one on the governing board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wait a minute. At STA, you would expect a coach to also teach? Don't those call for different skills and qualifications? Can STA really be a big 3 if its football coach teaches geometry? That sounds like what would happen in a one-room school house in Kansas.

No, at STA it's not that coaches also teach; rather, teachers also coach. This teacher-coach model (note: not the other way around, as in "coach-teacher") originated at UK public (read "private") schools. That teachers coach sports at STA and can be horrible at coaching explains why STA is not the sports powerhouse that others such as Landon are.

Bullshit! It depends on the sport. STA has excellent baseball and lacrosse coaches. Coaching success also depends on the talent level of your athletes and the lack of involvement of bullying parents.

I didn't say that all the coaches at STA were horrible, just that some teachers can be horrible at coaching their sport. Ans that's fine with me. Better that than a school that hired coaches first, and teachers second. I'm an STA parent and I'm proud that STA's ideal of the scholar-athlete places emphasis on teaching over coaching. My child is not at STA for the athletics.

[Anonymous]

As much as I am not a fan of STA, I find this whole line of discussion troubling, and I am not talking about Mr. Hummmph.