Appreciation?
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Anonymous
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Mothers of young children - maybe spouses in general - have a sort of object permanency problem when it comes to the efforts of their spouse. If the effort isn't right there in front of them; it doesn't count. When a husband goes off to work to make money to pay for food and shelter; it doesn't "count." The money just sort of happens, and, because he's gone, it's not work -- he is just off having an 8-10 hour break while the SAHM is doing "all" of the work on her own.
I definitely went through a period where I was not valued except as a source of money and childcare. Once the kids passed the toddler stage, things got better. The only advice I can give is to stop keeping score. It's poison. And, if you're busy with something and he's sitting on his ass; feel free to ask him to help with whatever needs doing. |
Anonymous
| Also, I think OP has a misguided notion of what constitutes "the minimum." I'm sure the DH could easily be doing less. Or even be providing negative value to the household. |
Anonymous
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11:44, I can relate in that my H also expects certain things. Or rather, he would just pick on something and try to start a fight about it. It can be anything really. I think he is just mad that I don't feel connected to him anymore (which is not entirely his fault- after having a child I have become pretty involved in all the kiddie stuff and for him it's boring.
I however have little interest in his very amateur political views or the like - not saying it is a good thing but just a fact of life. The key is that H does not feel loved anymore, but I just cannot generate the love. I am not sure if it is because I felt hurt so many times, or because it is just gone. I hope to find out. |
Anonymous
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OP again: of course he could be doing less; there are terrible spouses and dads out there. In that case we would have divorced a long time ago.
I am stuck because on the one hand I value the things he does, but on the other hand I am upset a lot because of petty fights which he starts, and feel mad when he just sits on his ass and I run around with an active, inquisitive preschooler. |
Anonymous
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OP here: as for his criticism, I am not sure I agree with the boring part. I think we grew boring in each others eyes, it's mutual. I also don't talk to him about lots of stuff because I think he will think it stupid (it happened before).
I asked several friends of mine if I have become boring- we are close enough to ask for honest opinions-'they told me no. |
Anonymous
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As for the fat part, yes I need to lose weight, but then he needs to quit smoking, so I don't see why he has a right to call me fat.
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Anonymous
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Again, if we get to the bottom of it, it is about me losing interest in H (for whatever reasons) and him being mad and upset about it (understandably so).
I would be content with simply a parenting partnership, but he is not, so he is nitpicking and criticizing and making my life difficult. I am not very hopeful of rediscovering the love, but maybe we could establish a mutually respectful relationship or maybe we could split- knowing (at least me) that I have tried everything. |
Anonymous
I'm sure for him it feels like a bait & switch. Have a kid and, now that he's locked in financially, his wife suddenly loses interest? I guess I don't know exactly what he wants out of a marriage, but the "parenting partnership" sounds like you get everything you want out of the relationship and he gets nothing. You get financial security; he gets a nanny? |
Anonymous
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OP, who have your role models been in marriage? What have you learned about long-term relationships as you were growing up? If you don't have good role models, find some. Observe them, observe their marriages. Hang out with people who have been married, contentedly, for decades. Observe their interactions. You will see a TON of small gestures go back and forth between them all day. Spoken and unspoken. When one goes grocery shopping and comes home, the other goes out to the car to help bring the groceries in - without even thinking about it or "weighing" it in one's mind. When one is having a hard day, the other will pause in what they are doing. It's really small, small stuff. Very basic stuff.
If you did not grow up seeing this kind of thing, then find people who are living it. Don't be embarrassed to talk to them. Everyone needs mentors and role models at work. We all need people to show us the ropes. Same with marriage. It's not necessarily intuitive... |
Anonymous
Yes, this is very close to how he feels (and what he tells me). I don't know how to change this. I was never as interested in sex (his proxy for love) as he was- he would love to do it twice a day everyday. I am even less interested now. Part of it is probably hormonal (first breastfeeding, then birth control), but part of it is that I am not very interested in him anymore. In fact I think I totally overrated sex when I was young. I would rather read a book now 
I know it sounds terrible. I still made sure we had sex 2-3x/week. But it's not the real thing that he wants. Maybe I should save on therapy and just get myself some women's Viagra and things will get back on track. |
Anonymous
This is exactly the kind of interactions I had in mind- if one is sitting on the sofa and another is lifting a heavy suitcase, the first one gets up and lends a hand. That's what I try to do. He, however, will sit until prompted. Then he maybe will or maybe won't help. |
Anonymous
Not sure if it's good for what ails your particular relationship, but I'd suggest giving a look at a couple of books from Athol Kay: The Married Man Sex Life Primer and the Marriage Action Plan. The first one is a little more male oriented; the second a bit more aimed at couples. I've only read the first one and participated on a related Internet forum. It's helped my marriage and sex life a fair amount. The basic notion is that the guy has to make himself a better man. This doesn't necessarily mean doing the things the woman thinks she wants to be sexual; creating covert contracts, and being disappointed when she isn't magically sexual with you. Rather, you do some of the superficial stuff -- get in better shape and make more money among others. And, you make some deeper changes -- become a leader in your family. (This sounds contrary to a pro-feminist relationship because it implies subordination of the wife; but, really, is a woman likely to be sexually attracted to a man who defers to her as the leader? And is a marriage realistically going to have consistent equilibrium?) You also work on becoming the kind of guy who other women are interested in. This doesn't mean cheat on your wife, but: a) if you're the kind of guy other women are interested in, you're probably the kind of guy who would interest your wife; and b) women seem to take some pointers as to whether their man is desirable from whether other women find him desirable. And, from the guy's point of view, if he puts in that effort and his wife still doesn't find him sexually desirable, when the marriage ends, he'll now have a much better chance of landing a woman who will be up for sharing a good sex life. |
Anonymous
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There are some great nuggets in some of the PPs advice and comments.
First, the toddler stage is really hard and remember it may get easier. Second, a PPs comments on "object permanence". Third, the idea that keeping score is poison. Fourth, to think about doing without. The way to appreciate is to recognize what it would be like to not have the things you have. It's by comparison. We are told not to compare, but in truth, we need to compare, just not compare UP the ladder…compare DOWN and see what great things you have that others don't (or that you didn't have before). Think about how BAD it can be without all that DH is providing you. The comparison is a way to get to GRATITUDE, which is necessary for happiness. Finally: One way to get to feeling appreciation (gratitude) is to FAKE it. Just say thank you like you mean it. Just do all the things you would do if you really were appreciative. Cognitive dissonance will step in and change your mind--over time it will realign your brain with your actions. Just like now, your behavior of non-appreciation does affect your mind and keeps you in this hole. |
Anonymous
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OP here: thank you everyone for the great tips and all the thoughts... It really helps to spell things out and read the feedback...
I wanted to share some background to our relationship with H. When we met he was separated, I was a single professional, both in their early 30s. He told me how his wife was "concentrated on the child", did not care for him anymore, became very "suburban" in her boss and dreams- wanted to have a big house, two kids, etc etc. I now understand that there were huge red flags- these "she's not taking care of me" ideas, not too interested in kids, lazy. I was not completely innocent, but had zero understanding of married life- so I took his complaints at face value. He was very much attracted to me. He files for divorce (he had a 6 yo daughter), we move in together quickly. He is not crazy about being a father but does whatever needs to be done (child support, seeing his daughter, etc). He does not want more kids but agrees to that if ts important to me. I really like him, sexual attraction, even love- but I have a hard time respecting him. He has no college degree and thinks its ok to just get a degree from a third tier college (which he does while living with me); he is a good professional but seems to make chaotic career choices; he has some debt and seems to be less than perfect in his financial decisions. We argue a lot on things from politics to video games; we are very different but committed to make it work. I tried to break up with him several times but it seems I had some motherly instinct towards him plus physical attraction plus I wanted to settle down and he seemed so accessible so to speak. We got married and had a baby and things just went downhill from there... I was a bit overly hormonal at first, he on the other hand was not always helpful and understanding, but expected love and passion from me... As things went back to normal (or rather the new normal), I did regain some of my attraction to him, but probably not enough for him, plus he was hurt, plus he wasn't exactly the most attentive and helpful spouse and parent, so somehow things didn't get better (even though I was now able to devote more time to him). I suddenly discovered that I have an immature guy for a partner, who does not know and does not want to know how to be a good parent... This is of course just one side of the story. I admit to being too focused on the child as opposed to husband/work/life; but as I feel I am slowly becoming more balanced, somehow H does not see this dynamic...or so it seems, as he gets more and more resentful and criticizing. |
Anonymous
| OP here: just a quick note on faking it- I did try to be a "good wife" for too long, but it only drained me emotionally and did not fool him... |