What to do about hyper vigilant parents in public & SN kids whose disabilities are not alway obvious

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: On OP's larger point, though, I agree that I would not find her supervision to be enough if she's describing other kids having to tell him multiple times to stop splashing them when they go to the pool. She needs (in my opinion) to be more proactive and work on some ground rules, first and foremost not engaging in aggressive behavior toward kids you don't know or are not already playing with. Inviting someone to splash or charge around the pool with you is a skill that is important. I have no idea if my toddler is going to have ADHD, but there's a lot of it in my family so I'm very familiar with the type of 8 year old you're describing. You're not doing such a child any favors by excusing this type of behavior due to their impulsivity; they'll end up increasingly isolated as teenagers and young adults once the children grow older and have more freedom to choose to avoid being crashed into (or splashed or whatever) all the time. It's draining, and only family members are "stuck with" a person with ADHD and have to learn to live with it. Everyone else has the ability to choose to not engage, and that's often what happens when there hasn't been enough focus on learning to behave in socially acceptable ways (in my experience).

I totally agree. There have been a number of people pointing out that an 8 year old should be able to X, Y or Z. Perhaps those posters don't have ADHD kids or have forgotten that brain development in most ADHD kids is delayed by as much as 30%. A child may chronologically be 8 years old but only 5.6 developmentally. This is very true for my 2 ADHD kids.

[Anonymous]

I totally agree. There have been a number of people pointing out that an 8 year old should be able to X, Y or Z. Perhaps those posters don't have ADHD kids or have forgotten that brain development in most ADHD kids is delayed by as much as 30%. A child may chronologically be 8 years old but only 5.6 developmentally. This is very true for my 2 ADHD kids.

Then, a parent of this kind of child should be MORE vigilant, not less. Right? If you know that your child is 30% behind, that's not the time to kick back with a magazine and assume he'll work it out, and announce that you follow the Slacker Philosophy.

If a mom knows her kid is 30% vision impaired, she would be more vigilant when crossing streets in New York City with that child, not less. Unless something is really wrong with her, she would not announce she loves to slack off and see what happens when her 30% blind child tries to navigate turning taxis and Walk signs all by himself.

That's one kind of disability, blindness, and ADHD is another. Step up for your kid. You don't have to look like a meddling, smothering idiot, but you also can't abdicate your duty to your child. Be discreet, and yes, be vigilant. Intervene and teach, and put down the magazine.

[Anonymous]

Hi,
Personally, my son (5) has a complex, rare genetic disorder that basically affects all area of development and has certain unique features and he does not have dysmorphic features that necessarily indicate this impairment. I really try not to hover as it is really important for him to try to navigate social environments such as the pool on his own, but given his disability I definitely am aware of what is going on each moment he is in the pool. If he tantrums or is acting up in some manner, we talk about it and try to change the behavior. If he escalates or continues on in not an appropriate manner--we leave the pool. It's an effective consequence even if he tantrums even more. It teaches him that he has to behave in a certain way at the pool, just like he has to behave a certain way at school. I think we all want to relax at the pool and not be so vigilant about this stuff, but unfortunately you can't.

[Anonymous]

OP, what I like about this particular forum are the thoughtful and useful responses offered by posters. If you had posted this in the Olders Kids and Teenagers forum, you would've probably been flamed. I am not saying you deserved to be flamed, but that folks would've been less judicious in their comments.

I am the mom of 2 NT children and have a SN sib. Like many of the posters here, we have a "no splashing" rule. There is more leeway with their close friends and family, but none with strangers of any age. When our children deviate from our family rules, we address it in the moment, not later on that day. We may reflect again on the incident later that day, but we don't wait as it will then be too late. Yes, there are rowdy, boisterous boys (and girls) who like to mix it up. But my kids may be rowdy and boisterous one day and rather serene - and detest the prospect of being splashed - the next.

Regarding your son, I think the margins for accepting his misbehaviour (for lack of a more appropriate word) are shrinking. What happens when he does this at ten, twelve, fourteen, and sixteen? My SIL does this with one of her children. Her DC is somewhat misanthropic and fairly eccentric. It was kind of cute at seven, but it is starting to get really annoying at eleven. DC is not expected to be courteous and respectful of others, etc because he has never been taught that his contempt for people is unacceptable. I was a nerdy child, but my parents always expected a "please" and a "thank you." OP, I am not saying your son is headed down a similar path, but folks will start to extend a narrow berth to your son's misconduct as he ages. I hope you are able to heed the suggestions here and realize that there is big diff between constantly admonishing a child who is wiggling in his seat to reminding one's child that unsolicited splashing merits the loss of pool time on a hot day.

[Anonymous]

I'm the proud slacker mom from earlier.

To the OP, there are parents who are showing up at job interview with their kids. There are parents who are calling their college professors to complain.

A lot of what you've read above is how this starts. This is not healthy. This is not necessary.

You may enjoy a site called freerangekids . wordpress . com.

And FWIW, I have a SN child. My obligation to her (and to society) is to help her function as an independent adult. It is entirely possible that many kids will get splashed in the process.

[Anonymous]

I totally agree. There have been a number of people pointing out that an 8 year old should be able to X, Y or Z. Perhaps those posters don't have ADHD kids or have forgotten that brain development in most ADHD kids is delayed by as much as 30%. A child may chronologically be 8 years old but only 5.6 developmentally. This is very true for my 2 ADHD kids.

Absolutely. But that excuses, to a certain extent, the kid's behavior, not the parents'. If you know your kid isn't capable of acting his age, shouldn't you address that with him, and not be a self-described "slacker mom?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the proud slacker mom from earlier.

To the OP, there are parents who are showing up at job interview with their kids. There are parents who are calling their college professors to complain.

A lot of what you've read above is how this starts. This is not healthy. This is not necessary.

You may enjoy a site called freerangekids . wordpress . com.

And FWIW, I have a SN child. My obligation to her (and to society) is to help her function as an independent adult. It is entirely possible that many kids will get splashed in the process.

Really? You think correcting your kids when they act inappropriately is not healthy? Awesome. Sounds to me like you've taken your daughter's special needs as an excuse to indulge your own slacker and selfish tendencies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the proud slacker mom from earlier.

To the OP, there are parents who are showing up at job interview with their kids. There are parents who are calling their college professors to complain.

A lot of what you've read above is how this starts. This is not healthy. This is not necessary.

You may enjoy a site called freerangekids . wordpress . com.

And FWIW, I have a SN child. My obligation to her (and to society) is to help her function as an independent adult. It is entirely possible that many kids will get splashed in the process.

Its very unusual to have someone judge the rest of us who have kids with special needs but you have managed that. Clearly you have ideological views of childrearing and you are rigidly adhering to them, in spite of the context.

I would never go to a job interview with either my NT child or my child with AS/ADHD. I would never call their professors. I have never haggled over grades or complained about something a teacher has done. Ever.

And I would never allow my child to disturb others. If I did I would be failing to raise him to be an independent adult. The world will not change its rules for my child, it will not cut him slack. Other people will not want to be with him if he doesn't treat them respect. And because I will not be intervening, going on job interviews with him and calling his professors, I had better teach him now how to behave. The more i think about it, the more your post doesn't make any sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the proud slacker mom from earlier.

To the OP, there are parents who are showing up at job interview with their kids. There are parents who are calling their college professors to complain.

A lot of what you've read above is how this starts. This is not healthy. This is not necessary.

You may enjoy a site called freerangekids . wordpress . com.

And FWIW, I have a SN child. My obligation to her (and to society) is to help her function as an independent adult. It is entirely possible that many kids will get splashed in the process.

PP, the free range philosophy says that you should let your child attempt to solve his own problems; you only step in with guidance if something is beyond his ability.

It doesn't say that parents should refrain from teaching their children appropriate behavior in public situations.

The "splashing" people are talking about isn't the kind where a child cannonballs into a pool, and bystanders get wet. This is normal, appropriate pool splashing.People are talking about the aggressive kind kids sometimes get involved in, where they deliberately send a lot of water in the direction of another person's face -- more like having a snowball fight.

Kids should be kids -- in the winter that means kids throw snowballs at each other -- but I grew up in upstate NY in the 70s, and even though ALL us kids were "free range" back then, we had commonly accepted rules about what was and wasn't kosher in a snaowball fight. And the big one was NO ICE BALLS (esp not in the face.)

In the summer when swimming, there were rules commonly accepted by all us kids, and one was "no hard splashing" -- especially not if someone told you "no".

"No means no!" is a lesson kids really do need to learn, especially Free Range kids who will be operating on their own in the world!

If your kid can't stop when another kid tells him to stop -- that's a problem. Free range philosphy won't help that child. He needs to learn how to respect another child's "no".

If you have a better way to teach a child to stop when someone says "stop" (besides parental involvement) please do share. I'm all ears!

[Anonymous]

PP again. Not to belabor the point, but you know what we "free range kids" of the 70s, unsupervised by parents, did when faced with kids who surely would be defined as special needs today, who didn't follow our community norms?

We called them horrible names and told everyone to stay away from them.

That taught 'em, good!

Well, no, they didn't actually learn to follow the norms or anything. But at least it made most of them stay away from us "normal" kids. Problem solved! (Well, for us.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I totally agree. There have been a number of people pointing out that an 8 year old should be able to X, Y or Z. Perhaps those posters don't have ADHD kids or have forgotten that brain development in most ADHD kids is delayed by as much as 30%. A child may chronologically be 8 years old but only 5.6 developmentally. This is very true for my 2 ADHD kids.

Absolutely. But that excuses, to a certain extent, the kid's behavior, not the parents'. If you know your kid isn't capable of acting his age, shouldn't you address that with him, and not be a self-described "slacker mom?"

I think you're misunderstanding this poster. She was agreeing that the slacker mom should be more proactive in monitoring and correcting her DS's behavior. She wasn't excusing it but pointing out that what you expect of a NT 8 yo isn't necessarily what you can expect of a SN 8 yo old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP again. Not to belabor the point, but you know what we "free range kids" of the 70s, unsupervised by parents, did when faced with kids who surely would be defined as special needs today, who didn't follow our community norms?

We called them horrible names and told everyone to stay away from them.

That taught 'em, good!

Well, no, they didn't actually learn to follow the norms or anything. But at least it made most of them stay away from us "normal" kids. Problem solved! (Well, for us.)

yes, i remember this well. I cringe when I think about our attitudes toward kids much like my DS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the proud slacker mom from earlier.

To the OP, there are parents who are showing up at job interview with their kids. There are parents who are calling their college professors to complain.

A lot of what you've read above is how this starts. This is not healthy. This is not necessary.

You may enjoy a site called freerangekids . wordpress . com.

And FWIW, I have a SN child. My obligation to her (and to society) is to help her function as an independent adult. It is entirely possible that many kids will get splashed in the process.

Sorry. Have to disagree with you here. Completely.

[Anonymous]

OP,

Let me reframe this a little bit for you so you can see why it might be a good idea to tamp down on the super soaker shooting now. You said basically a bunch of kids are playing and then someone says essentially, "Hey! No. Stop that." And it takes your son a couple more times to get that. Right now what will happen is you will get the stink eye from other parents -- myself included -- for not stepping in and enforcing that no means no. And let me also give the full disclaimer that I HATE those super soaker things. No one was happier than I was that they were banned at our pool.

Let us flash forward 7 years to when your ADHD boy is 15 and at the teen party at the pool or at the mall with some friends or at a football game at school or some other place with his friends. The important fact being that there are no parents as would be totally age appropriate in any of these situations. Your son meets a pretty girl and they chat. They kiss a couple times. Maybe your son touches her breasts. She tells him no and he says ok. They kiss some more, but because it takes your son a few times to get it when someone says no and no one has ever stepped in and brought the hammer down when it really didn't matter, it still takes him a few times to get it and he touches her breasts again. Now she is mad and upset so she leaves. She goes home and eventually tells mom and dad who then flip the eff out and call the police. She has his contact information because they exchanged names and numbers so they could text. She knows what school he goes to so it is pretty easy for the school resource officer at his school to bring him in for a talk in which he admits to all of the conduct. And no, OP, no one has to notify you that the school resource officer is going to talk to your kid. And now you have a 15 year old who is charged with at a minimum of a sexual battery -- let me insert here that having ADHD is not a defense to a crime in most states. And I am assuming that the girl is the same age in my hypo -- this gets worse if the girl is 14 or 13.

And before anyone piles on and says that I am being hysterical -- I am a criminal defense attorney and I see this fact pattern at a minimum of 3 or 4 times per month in court with a real family who loves their kid just like you do, OP. I am the one representing your son in this hypo.

[Anonymous]

Thanks PP.