Need to fire someone - timing?

[Anonymous]

HR generally gives us guidance in these cases as to what time makes the most sense and what you need to do beforehand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What does HR say?

This has to be a troll. Why wouldn’t you follow HR policy? The OP seems to believe they have the right to terminate someone without a PIP or documented cause, which shows a misunderstanding of employment law. Proper documentation and adherence to process are required; failing to do so exposes the organization to significant legal risk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does HR say?

This has to be a troll. Why wouldn’t you follow HR policy? The OP seems to believe they have the right to terminate someone without a PIP or documented cause, which shows a misunderstanding of employment law. Proper documentation and adherence to process are required; failing to do so exposes the organization to significant legal risk.

I an in a “At will” state. And documenting things is actually discouraged some firms. I was let go my one job a week after a perfect YE review where I reached 110 percent of my goals. Bottom line new CEO wanted to bring in his own people.

In this case person just can’t pick things up and refuses to learn new things. We fire them all the time last job just code them “job mismatch”

A PIP is pointless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The health insurance point that a PP made is a good one. Let them stay until Jan 2 so they have insurance until Jan 31.

+1 I agree with this.

[Anonymous]

I’d put them on paid leave through the end of the year if that’s an option.

[Anonymous]

How long has this person been at your organization? Weeks? Months? Years?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:2 comments - 1. I’m one of those people that believe every firing has something to do with and is partly owned by manager/management. 2. They are being let go into the worst job market we’ve had in, what, decades.

Recommend after the holidays and mid-January ‘if’ you’ve given serious critique in verbal and written warning. If they don’t have in writing that they will lose job if they don’t make changes (in email or on paper), don’t think they’ve been given opportunity. Agree with other poster that I sense they haven’t received continuous feedback. (I think many firings are unfair anyway, due to miscommunications or internal politics.)

I don’t believe they’re as bad as you think they are.

+1.

How did this person seem competent in your selection process but is completely useless now?

If this job is so specialized, you should have asked robust screening questions in your interviews. If they managed to slide by these questions while being completely incapable, your team was clueless about what they needed when they hired him, and you are now rewriting history to suit your needs.

Nothing wrong with firing someone who is not working out, but it's easier to be less caring if you don't take accountability of your own failures to hire and train properly.

[Anonymous]

Firing someone in December is cruel especially if you can wait 2 more weeks. It’s not like you didn’t know this was going to happen OP. You could have done it Nov 1. But you sat on it. So sit on it for 15 friggen more days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Firing someone in December is cruel especially if you can wait 2 more weeks. It’s not like you didn’t know this was going to happen OP. You could have done it Nov 1. But you sat on it. So sit on it for 15 friggen more days.

Thank God they took vacation! Going to pull trigger maybe Monday Jan 5th gets them medical and jobs open up.

[Anonymous]

I was fired days after my birthday and days before Thanksgiving.

My birthday is always a dark day for me, but come Thanksgiving I never think about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2 comments - 1. I’m one of those people that believe every firing has something to do with and is partly owned by manager/management. 2. They are being let go into the worst job market we’ve had in, what, decades.

Recommend after the holidays and mid-January ‘if’ you’ve given serious critique in verbal and written warning. If they don’t have in writing that they will lose job if they don’t make changes (in email or on paper), don’t think they’ve been given opportunity. Agree with other poster that I sense they haven’t received continuous feedback. (I think many firings are unfair anyway, due to miscommunications or internal politics.)

I don’t believe they’re as bad as you think they are.

+1.

How did this person seem competent in your selection process but is completely useless now?

If this job is so specialized, you should have asked robust screening questions in your interviews. If they managed to slide by these questions while being completely incapable, your team was clueless about what they needed when they hired him, and you are now rewriting history to suit your needs.

Nothing wrong with firing someone who is not working out, but it's easier to be less caring if you don't take accountability of your own failures to hire and train properly.

I dont have time for that crap. We hire, and to be honest our severance sucks it is at 2 weeks per year. This person was fired last job so unemployed at time so not a big deal.

My last job we had 30-40 percent turnover on new hires we just hire and fire to ramp up. More efficient. Not really my job to train someone who is doing exact same job they were doing at prior three companies.

Seen this a lot people churn through jobs at quick to hire desperate places but quickly get let got 3-5 times in a row over a short period of time. Then even shitty companies wont hire. I do a job where every job is different and we dont repeat jobs for 1-3 years. So it is something you have to pick up one your own as I dont know it or other people dont know it.

So it is more art than skill. So you churn people. Around 8-15 months if not getting it off they go. My old company we fired or they quit 80 percent of new hires in first 24 months. They kept the 20 percent rock stars. this went on for 2-4 years till they had mainly rock stars > my new place is not a start up but seems we have the 10-30 year people and the 6-12 month people. We churn the 6-12 month people.

But I did the right thing. Jan 2nd. Person walks out a bag of cash since I let them get paid during holidays for doing nothing, then got paid med all of Jan and we top up some vacation days in Jan and two weeks severance. With UI can hold them over at least 2-3 months till they land on their feet

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was fired days after my birthday and days before Thanksgiving.

My birthday is always a dark day for me, but come Thanksgiving I never think about it.

I was Fired 12-31 twice. So what. They did not want to pay me New Years Day and Martin Luther King day or have me go on medical benefits or get new topped up days off and wanted my salary off books so they can rehire. I was on COBRA the day after being let go.

Every day stayed in next year is stealing from the next employee. Meaning. I already budget that salary. I want to replace better which will take a higher salary. So you get them off the books very early in Jan. Then takes me 2-3 months to replace then I have more money to hire a better person. And then next year I budget more. The new person can have that old salary plus the raise and a bit more as I had no one a few weeks. And the new person with less vacation days being new and have to wait till next year to get bonus helps.

It is addition by subtraction in this case. It takes like 80-120 hours to do a project that requires 20 hours of managing him to get it done. Meanwhile I could do it in 40 hours and so could his co-workers Sometimes we pray person takes off so we can can get work done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How long has this person been at your organization? Weeks? Months? Years?

How was this person even hired?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has this person been at your organization? Weeks? Months? Years?

How was this person even hired?

We have a similar situation, the hiring was ok, he was a fine worker for 1.5 years. Then all of a sudden he can’t produce a single task right as a mid-senior level. I am still confused, our team has grown he is set up for fast track to promotion within a year and we have communicated to him multiple times, I even give task specific check list that even a monkey can follow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has this person been at your organization? Weeks? Months? Years?

How was this person even hired?

We have a similar situation, the hiring was ok, he was a fine worker for 1.5 years. Then all of a sudden he can’t produce a single task right as a mid-senior level. I am still confused, our team has grown he is set up for fast track to promotion within a year and we have communicated to him multiple times, I even give task specific check list that even a monkey can follow.

thats my person. they started strong. Better than the others. Around 4 months ago they completely checked out. So much people dont want to work with them. I even asked WTF is going on twice on 1 and 1s and I got "I am processing what you said". Very very long pause and I am like I need to know what is going on? You seem unable to now do your job, you wont tell me what issue is, wont say if you need training, any training I offer you decline I dont now how to fix this if you dont tell me. I got I will come up with an action plan, next one on one they are coming up with an action plan. Then dude gives me he will think of something in next few months. At this point just dumb or playing me. I think dumb.

But then again I had a few con men work for me in past. You be shocked at junior levels how truly dumb 90 percent of them are and how truly smart 10 percent are. My last job we only hired pretty much 22-28 year olds for 90 pecrent of roles and some were really smart. But 10=20 percent were train wrecks and barely lasted 3-6 months, 20-80 percent lasted 18 months. the ones that cleared two years were rock stars way way way smarter than me and way way way better workers.