Non-DC academies

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

And the professional academies can get access to the UK kids much earlier, so the risk is considerably less when they can actually train the kid in development years, opposed to only having a year or two in their system.

Considering MLS Academy Players that hit 18 are going to England and Europe (or before if they have EU passport)
We are still waiting for your details on why they can't.

He’s not saying they can’t, just that it makes it more difficult, particularly for players who are not touted as the next big thing (eg sullivan) by the academy. There’s a reason why the MLS players union opposed it when the U.S. finally agreed to comply with FIFAs training compensation and solidarity payment requirements. And I think training compensation is only payable to an MLS club and non-MLS clubs will likely need to file suit with FIFA to get any compensation or solidarity payments.

Professional Scouts don't use who's hyped on IG as their scouting, vetting and recommendation process.
Only us parents are mesmerised by the temporary shiny stuff

Of course they don’t but it’s clear academies focus on certain players in terms of marketing and touting their development prowess. U think Union didn’t do anything to hype up Sullivan?

The marketing hype of Sullivan is for us.
Professional teams are checking the same scouting boxes for him as they will anyone else.
Jamir Johnson may have more interests from European clubs than Sullivan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

If a kid is a good player in America and is a U15, U16 or U17, what should they do to have a better chance at Europe come 18 years old outside a MLS Club Academy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

If a kid is a good player in America and is a U15, U16 or U17, what should they do to have a better chance at Europe come 18 years old outside a MLS Club Academy?

You should be going to Europe regularly already, that is connecting with local clubs and securing practices with them. Making connections here and there. Those trips are essential also to give ur kid a reality check and to keep them motivated.

Obviously ur kid has to be good, so development in the US is key. Make sure u pick a club where ur kid can use their technical skills (good for highlight clips too) and has lots of playing time. Scouts and coaches look at your kids skills first and care less about clubs than parents think. For the love of God, please make sure ur kid can juggle effortlessly as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

If a kid is a good player in America and is a U15, U16 or U17, what should they do to have a better chance at Europe come 18 years old outside a MLS Club Academy?

You should be going to Europe regularly already, that is connecting with local clubs and securing practices with them. Making connections here and there. Those trips are essential also to give ur kid a reality check and to keep them motivated.

Obviously ur kid has to be good, so development in the US is key. Make sure u pick a club where ur kid can use their technical skills (good for highlight clips too) and has lots of playing time. Scouts and coaches look at your kids skills first and care less about clubs than parents think. For the love of God, please make sure ur kid can juggle effortlessly as well.

Rumors have it, the winds of change has already begun.
As great as technical skills (trickery) are highlighted on IG for all to like and share, clubs are looking for exceptional IQ and coachability because everyone above a certain level has good technical skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

If a kid is a good player in America and is a U15, U16 or U17, what should they do to have a better chance at Europe come 18 years old outside a MLS Club Academy?

You should be going to Europe regularly already, that is connecting with local clubs and securing practices with them. Making connections here and there. Those trips are essential also to give ur kid a reality check and to keep them motivated.

Obviously ur kid has to be good, so development in the US is key. Make sure u pick a club where ur kid can use their technical skills (good for highlight clips too) and has lots of playing time. Scouts and coaches look at your kids skills first and care less about clubs than parents think. For the love of God, please make sure ur kid can juggle effortlessly as well.

Rumors have it, the winds of change has already begun.
As great as technical skills (trickery) are highlighted on IG for all to like and share, clubs are looking for exceptional IQ and coachability because everyone above a certain level has good technical skills.

For sure, I think that’s always been the case but as you point out, not necessarily highlighted on social media. I have also heard that US players aren’t known for their coachability. 😆 That’s why I think trips to Europe are essential, gotta be humbled and have reality checked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Boys or girls?

Boys

Re: Boys

Many of these destination academies have paid scouts. Charlotte and NCFC, like DC and Loudon FC have men’s pro teams (MLS and USL Championship leagues). Their scouting is a lot different from those like the Kickers in USL1 because the attached academies have more meaningful contract potential, with obviously DC United and Charlotte greater than London or NCFC. IMG also does this, but their model is a bit different, the ex-placement from youth is more NIL driven than contract / transfer / solidarity fee based.

The pro-clubs also tend to scout and poach from MLS Next clubs. MLS Next clubs still haven’t bridged the gap that MLS Academies have in terms of pathways to professional teams. And the pro-academies are free, vs the paid clubs.

Outside of that, lots of kids move because in another market they can play top team vs 2nd or 3rd team in their original market. That makes a huge difference in looks if the boy wants to play in college. Those moves are largely player driven, not scouting driven.

Just to add on this too, signing with a US Academy (like United, Atlanta, Charlotte, etc) kills US Boy’s chances to play overseas. So you might get a little FOMO for your kid when you see these “movers and shakers” getting recruited out of market. But you should know that signing / move likely closed 90% of the doors for that athlete.

Why would that kill a player’s chances? Wouldn’t it be easier because they’ve been vetted by a pro team?

Training fees, transfer fees and solidarity fees. Turns a $100k prospect into a $400k gamble.

So training or solidarity fees are still payable to a non-MLSNext Academy club but that would be a lot less since those clubs are a lower category? Does that sound right?

MLS Next also gets those fees. And / or any academy or club.

A very every simple approximation of how this goes is:

Let’s say a kid goes to DC United Academy, but wants to go to Man City Academy when they turn 16.

Man City says internally, “hey, this kid will cost us $250k to develop.” DC United says, “the kid has cost us $150k so far, Man City, we’ll transfer him to you if you pay us our costs.”

Man City runs their numbers, “$250k + $150k = $400k training. Do we think we can then sell him to a pro team for a first contract of ~ $1.5m? Don’t know yet because we haven’t worked with him. But we were sure we could at least get $750k. $400k is too expensive for us, we’ll pass”

Just to reiterate, this is a really over simplified version. The solidarity and training fee reimbursement it capped at 5% of the pro contract, so the multiple for the academies has to be much much higher. Making the US based player much much riskier.

Man City will have to pay a Category 3 Academy in England more for a player (especially based on how long the kid was at the academy) more than they will have to pay DC United for a player

So the financial risk isn't more for getting a MLS Club Academy player.

That’s not correct. It depends on the individual investment. The academies have to submit their expenses.

There is a system in place by the FA on how much a Cat 1 academy has to pay to get a player from a Cat 2 or Cat 3 academy in England.
It is mainly driven off how long the kid was at the old academy.
It's not a guessing game or winging it.
Its set by the English FA.

No. The system is set by FIFA and then is priced by the confederation and the training level of the academy (per the confederation). Yea, UEFA has the highest fee per year, CONCACAF is 3rd highest after CONMEBOL, but the US isn’t transferring out of Cat 2-3, so we’re talking about fees between UEFA Cat 2 & 3.

You all can believe all you want that the training finances of signing with an American MLS academy won’t impact their ability to transfer to a European academy before they go pro all you want. But it absolutely does close the door unless the athlete is world class in their position. Europe has too many home grown talents in their pipeline to take the financial risk on a Yank, even if the athletes are close to equal, or the American is slightly better.

If a kid is a good player in America and is a U15, U16 or U17, what should they do to have a better chance at Europe come 18 years old outside a MLS Club Academy?

You should be going to Europe regularly already, that is connecting with local clubs and securing practices with them. Making connections here and there. Those trips are essential also to give ur kid a reality check and to keep them motivated.

Obviously ur kid has to be good, so development in the US is key. Make sure u pick a club where ur kid can use their technical skills (good for highlight clips too) and has lots of playing time. Scouts and coaches look at your kids skills first and care less about clubs than parents think. For the love of God, please make sure ur kid can juggle effortlessly as well.

Rumors have it, the winds of change has already begun.
As great as technical skills (trickery) are highlighted on IG for all to like and share, clubs are looking for exceptional IQ and coachability because everyone above a certain level has good technical skills.

For sure, I think that’s always been the case but as you point out, not necessarily highlighted on social media. I have also heard that US players aren’t known for their coachability. 😆 That’s why I think trips to Europe are essential, gotta be humbled and have reality checked.

A culture of parental interference primarily because of big monies being paid to play gives many US families a distorted view of player/coach relations.

[Anonymous]

Can you expand on the Europe trips. What ages and for how long and what types of programs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can you expand on the Europe trips. What ages and for how long and what types of programs?

Because of many non-European kids trying to train with clubs in Europe even temporarily, UEFA/FIFA have now put pressure on the clubs by calling these training sessions 'trials'
So the club has to adhere to lots of insurance and other red-tape they rather avoid. Or get in trouble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can you expand on the Europe trips. What ages and for how long and what types of programs?

Because of many non-European kids trying to train with clubs in Europe even temporarily, UEFA/FIFA have now put pressure on the clubs by calling these training sessions 'trials'
So the club has to adhere to lots of insurance and other red-tape they rather avoid. Or get in trouble.

The alternative is for team based tours. Many top tier academies go over on tours during breaks, and some supplemental programs will take “teams” over for visits to their pipeline programs.

Most kids go on these for “cultural exchange” experience…they’re kids… but the focused kids are meeting coaches, networking, getting numbers and email addresses, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can you expand on the Europe trips. What ages and for how long and what types of programs?

Because of many non-European kids trying to train with clubs in Europe even temporarily, UEFA/FIFA have now put pressure on the clubs by calling these training sessions 'trials'
So the club has to adhere to lots of insurance and other red-tape they rather avoid. Or get in trouble.

The alternative is for team based tours. Many top tier academies go over on tours during breaks, and some supplemental programs will take “teams” over for visits to their pipeline programs.

Most kids go on these for “cultural exchange” experience…they’re kids… but the focused kids are meeting coaches, networking, getting numbers and email addresses, etc.

if your baseline mentality, discipline, drive and motivations aren't right, the 5 day trip to Bayern Munich ain't doing nothing

[Anonymous]

OP asks about local boys playing for MLS Academies other than DCU, everyone goes off about everything BUT that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP asks about local boys playing for MLS Academies other than DCU, everyone goes off about everything BUT that.

I thought it was just me. 🤣
I know of a few players who recently bypassed DCU and signed with other academies. Or left DCU for other academies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP asks about local boys playing for MLS Academies other than DCU, everyone goes off about everything BUT that.

I thought it was just me. 🤣
I know of a few players who recently bypassed DCU and signed with other academies. Or left DCU for other academies.

Yea there are a bunch of local kids playing for other academies throughout the age ranges. Either because DCU scouting is bad, politics, or they are looking for something specific. DCU academy doesn't have the best reputation... either way, they lost out on a lot of talented kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Through social media, I’ve noticed that there are a few local players who moved to academies outside of DC.

How did they do that? Did they reach out to those clubs when they were not scouted by DCU? Or did they move there from DCU? How would one get into those clubs without triggering interest from DCU? Or is that not possible? That is, those clubs are required to disclose to DCU that a player in their region is being considered at their club?

Couple of ways. Most often, those academy scouts see them at national events like MLS Flex or whatever ECNL events there are. Or, the player can reach out to the academy with highlight tape or whatever, and if interested, they will come out to evaluate them at an event.

If your kid is good enough to be noticed and picked up by another academy, they were probably on DCU's radar. With the new homegrown rules, any player can move to an outside academy with no restrictions. Unless they are on DCU's protected list. If that's the case, they will have to negotiate a trade. I am not sure on what amount is paid for the trade. But the protected list includes DCU's current roster and 9 additional players in their territory. You can also get off of that list if you move into another academy's territory with a parent.

I think I missed a couple of points, but that's the jist of it.