Which country actually has the best healthcare system?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Apparently the reason UK, Canada and elsewhere get cheap medications is that the US basically pays for them for the entire world and any small amount the drug companies get from government healthcare countries is just gravy.

We could probably reduce the prices we pay here by forcing the drug companies to charge all countries the same amount.

Do you have something to back that up?

DP - I'd quibble with PP's description, but the fact that most other countries in the world have price controls on their drugs and the US doesn't is pretty well-documented.

[Anonymous]

If we're talking straight healthcare, it's the US far and away. The circumstantial evidence - that wealthy foreigners travel here for care - is fairly clear. Have you ever heard of travel for health care (except to get cheap plastic surgery/dental care)? I lived in Western Europe for 5 years - there were some nice plusses - in home visits by the pediatrician, for example, but when we needed serious interventions, it was terrifyingly slow and difficult. I had a preemie at 30 weeks, and every day I walked into that NICU I thanked my lucky stars she was born in the United States.

Now, if we want to get into the insanity related to cost/transparency/access/pressure by pharma to treat problems rather than prevent them...that's certainly another discussion in which the US does not come out on top.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If we're talking straight healthcare, it's the US far and away. The circumstantial evidence - that wealthy foreigners travel here for care - is fairly clear. Have you ever heard of travel for health care (except to get cheap plastic surgery/dental care)? I lived in Western Europe for 5 years - there were some nice plusses - in home visits by the pediatrician, for example, but when we needed serious interventions, it was terrifyingly slow and difficult. I had a preemie at 30 weeks, and every day I walked into that NICU I thanked my lucky stars she was born in the United States.

Now, if we want to get into the insanity related to cost/transparency/access/pressure by pharma to treat problems rather than prevent them...that's certainly another discussion in which the US does not come out on top.

This is where we would need to go back to empirical data like life expectancy and infant/maternal mortality. The US does not bode very well here. Of course, that data does not tell an accurate picture of the healthcare system since it is very heavily skewed by lifestyle differences. A better dataset would track health provider outcomes, preventable deaths vs. hospitalizations and such. Which healthcare system does a better job at saving lives?

[Anonymous]

US is the best of course people want to harp on the billing and the large costs but no one pays that much out of pocket as its covered by insurance unless you do something dumb by choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:US is the best of course people want to harp on the billing and the large costs but no one pays that much out of pocket as its covered by insurance unless you do something dumb by choice.

Is being poor something doing something dumb by choice? Do you think that world renowned specialist is taking medicaid (or even worse if you're poor, but don't qualify- a payment plan that will never actually cover the cost of care)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:i am from the uk, and while i dont think it is the best, I think it is amazing and integral to being a developed country that there is free healthcare for anyone who needs it.

I think what's really misunderstood is you can also get private healthcare just like you can here. but there is a safety net.

But there is free healthcare in the US as well to those in need. It's called medicaid. ERs also can't turn people away. We also have the healthcare marketplace where plans are really affordable. No one is supposed to be uninsured. Except people don't get the plans still. Dh's friend wasn't okay with spending $55 a month on it.

A lot of my family is on medicaid in a LCOL area. It's really not bad.

? have you tried to get private insurance in the US? I've had it for 20 years, precovid. It's not affordable unless you are under the federal poverty level. Even now, it's $1500 for a famil of four for a high deductible plan. I think we spend almost $20K per year on medical costs.

Several red states have declined the medicaid expansion. Unsurprisingly, those states have more uninsured people. Lots of people make too much for medicaid, but not enough to buy health insurance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:US is the best of course people want to harp on the billing and the large costs but no one pays that much out of pocket as its covered by insurance unless you do something dumb by choice.

$1500 for a family of four for a high deductible plan, especially in years where you don't have a lot of health issues, is paying a lot out of pocket.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If we're talking straight healthcare, it's the US far and away. The circumstantial evidence - that wealthy foreigners travel here for care - is fairly clear. Have you ever heard of travel for health care (except to get cheap plastic surgery/dental care)? I lived in Western Europe for 5 years - there were some nice plusses - in home visits by the pediatrician, for example, but when we needed serious interventions, it was terrifyingly slow and difficult. I had a preemie at 30 weeks, and every day I walked into that NICU I thanked my lucky stars she was born in the United States.

Now, if we want to get into the insanity related to cost/transparency/access/pressure by pharma to treat problems rather than prevent them...that's certainly another discussion in which the US does not come out on top.

Lots of Americans go to Canada or MX to get cheaper drugs.

And Americans go abroad for medical care, too.





What good is the quality of care in the US when your average person cannot afford it?

[Anonymous]

I just changed insurance and had to repeat a diagnostic procedure because...reasons? I don't understand exactly why - it was not a medical reason - but I was told this is what I had to do otherwise it would be administratively impossible to get the care I need.

There is a lot of waste in our system. Not just in terms of money spent on health care, but the inordinate amount of time people have to spend to navigate different systems and get their health records transferred etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had insurance my entire life. My parents had a great plan and then I do as well (Kaiser Permanente). I can't say that I can complain about anything. I get new doctor's appts within the month, but I'm also young (40s) and haven't had any major issues other than birth. My dad recently needed brain surgery and he was able to go to one of the top surgeons in America for this type of tumor. He easily got an appt and insurance paid most of it.

I really don't think ours is as broken as the news makes it seem. Except for ERs. ERs truly are some kind of sh!tshow. But that's because people clog them up with tons of unneeded stuff. They should be pushing people to urgent cares or primary care doctors, but they can't. Oh and therapy is a sh!tshow too. But I think if therapy was easy to access, nearly every American would be going weekly. There is some cost/benefit analysis there. Kaiser definitely wouldn't pay.

A lot of my friends have lived abroad and were not happy with the medical care and did indicate that they preferred ours. In Ontario my friend got supplemental private insurance because her company said she'd need it. She wasn't happy with them trying to push a vaginal birth on her when she'd had back surgery and a prior c section. Friends currently living in England also have private insurance.

The US system is "broken" in that a person can go bankrupt due to medical debt. No other civilized country has this problem.

The best type of system is both public and private, where you can get private insurance if you want to. Most civilized countries have this option. Also, their insurance is no where near as expensive as ours, and neither are the costs for the medical care even if you pay out pocket.

Donyou know why in other countries people don’t go bankrupt over the medical cost? Because they dead. At least in America we have a choice to go bankrupt or be dead. Over there you don’t have this choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had insurance my entire life. My parents had a great plan and then I do as well (Kaiser Permanente). I can't say that I can complain about anything. I get new doctor's appts within the month, but I'm also young (40s) and haven't had any major issues other than birth. My dad recently needed brain surgery and he was able to go to one of the top surgeons in America for this type of tumor. He easily got an appt and insurance paid most of it.

I really don't think ours is as broken as the news makes it seem. Except for ERs. ERs truly are some kind of sh!tshow. But that's because people clog them up with tons of unneeded stuff. They should be pushing people to urgent cares or primary care doctors, but they can't. Oh and therapy is a sh!tshow too. But I think if therapy was easy to access, nearly every American would be going weekly. There is some cost/benefit analysis there. Kaiser definitely wouldn't pay.

A lot of my friends have lived abroad and were not happy with the medical care and did indicate that they preferred ours. In Ontario my friend got supplemental private insurance because her company said she'd need it. She wasn't happy with them trying to push a vaginal birth on her when she'd had back surgery and a prior c section. Friends currently living in England also have private insurance.

The US system is "broken" in that a person can go bankrupt due to medical debt. No other civilized country has this problem.

The best type of system is both public and private, where you can get private insurance if you want to. Most civilized countries have this option. Also, their insurance is no where near as expensive as ours, and neither are the costs for the medical care even if you pay out pocket.

Donyou know why in other countries people don’t go bankrupt over the medical cost? Because they dead. At least in America we have a choice to go bankrupt or be dead. Over there you don’t have this choice.

That's just a ridiculous response. You still get care in other developed countries. It isn't a choice of dead or bankrupt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had insurance my entire life. My parents had a great plan and then I do as well (Kaiser Permanente). I can't say that I can complain about anything. I get new doctor's appts within the month, but I'm also young (40s) and haven't had any major issues other than birth. My dad recently needed brain surgery and he was able to go to one of the top surgeons in America for this type of tumor. He easily got an appt and insurance paid most of it.

I really don't think ours is as broken as the news makes it seem. Except for ERs. ERs truly are some kind of sh!tshow. But that's because people clog them up with tons of unneeded stuff. They should be pushing people to urgent cares or primary care doctors, but they can't. Oh and therapy is a sh!tshow too. But I think if therapy was easy to access, nearly every American would be going weekly. There is some cost/benefit analysis there. Kaiser definitely wouldn't pay.

A lot of my friends have lived abroad and were not happy with the medical care and did indicate that they preferred ours. In Ontario my friend got supplemental private insurance because her company said she'd need it. She wasn't happy with them trying to push a vaginal birth on her when she'd had back surgery and a prior c section. Friends currently living in England also have private insurance.

The US system is "broken" in that a person can go bankrupt due to medical debt. No other civilized country has this problem.

The best type of system is both public and private, where you can get private insurance if you want to. Most civilized countries have this option. Also, their insurance is no where near as expensive as ours, and neither are the costs for the medical care even if you pay out pocket.

Donyou know why in other countries people don’t go bankrupt over the medical cost? Because they dead. At least in America we have a choice to go bankrupt or be dead. Over there you don’t have this choice.

That's just a ridiculous response. You still get care in other developed countries. It isn't a choice of dead or bankrupt.

Once again, mortality data does not back this up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had insurance my entire life. My parents had a great plan and then I do as well (Kaiser Permanente). I can't say that I can complain about anything. I get new doctor's appts within the month, but I'm also young (40s) and haven't had any major issues other than birth. My dad recently needed brain surgery and he was able to go to one of the top surgeons in America for this type of tumor. He easily got an appt and insurance paid most of it.

I really don't think ours is as broken as the news makes it seem. Except for ERs. ERs truly are some kind of sh!tshow. But that's because people clog them up with tons of unneeded stuff. They should be pushing people to urgent cares or primary care doctors, but they can't. Oh and therapy is a sh!tshow too. But I think if therapy was easy to access, nearly every American would be going weekly. There is some cost/benefit analysis there. Kaiser definitely wouldn't pay.

A lot of my friends have lived abroad and were not happy with the medical care and did indicate that they preferred ours. In Ontario my friend got supplemental private insurance because her company said she'd need it. She wasn't happy with them trying to push a vaginal birth on her when she'd had back surgery and a prior c section. Friends currently living in England also have private insurance.

The US system is "broken" in that a person can go bankrupt due to medical debt. No other civilized country has this problem.

The best type of system is both public and private, where you can get private insurance if you want to. Most civilized countries have this option. Also, their insurance is no where near as expensive as ours, and neither are the costs for the medical care even if you pay out pocket.

Donyou know why in other countries people don’t go bankrupt over the medical cost? Because they dead. At least in America we have a choice to go bankrupt or be dead. Over there you don’t have this choice.

That's just a ridiculous response. You still get care in other developed countries. It isn't a choice of dead or bankrupt.

Once again, mortality data does not back this up.

The US has the worse mortality rates than any country that we'd consider a peer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've had insurance my entire life. My parents had a great plan and then I do as well (Kaiser Permanente). I can't say that I can complain about anything. I get new doctor's appts within the month, but I'm also young (40s) and haven't had any major issues other than birth. My dad recently needed brain surgery and he was able to go to one of the top surgeons in America for this type of tumor. He easily got an appt and insurance paid most of it.

I really don't think ours is as broken as the news makes it seem. Except for ERs. ERs truly are some kind of sh!tshow. But that's because people clog them up with tons of unneeded stuff. They should be pushing people to urgent cares or primary care doctors, but they can't. Oh and therapy is a sh!tshow too. But I think if therapy was easy to access, nearly every American would be going weekly. There is some cost/benefit analysis there. Kaiser definitely wouldn't pay.

A lot of my friends have lived abroad and were not happy with the medical care and did indicate that they preferred ours. In Ontario my friend got supplemental private insurance because her company said she'd need it. She wasn't happy with them trying to push a vaginal birth on her when she'd had back surgery and a prior c section. Friends currently living in England also have private insurance.

The US system is "broken" in that a person can go bankrupt due to medical debt. No other civilized country has this problem.

The best type of system is both public and private, where you can get private insurance if you want to. Most civilized countries have this option. Also, their insurance is no where near as expensive as ours, and neither are the costs for the medical care even if you pay out pocket.

Donyou know why in other countries people don’t go bankrupt over the medical cost? Because they dead. At least in America we have a choice to go bankrupt or be dead. Over there you don’t have this choice.

That's just a ridiculous response. You still get care in other developed countries. It isn't a choice of dead or bankrupt.

Once again, mortality data does not back this up.

The US mortality rate is lower than other developed countries with universal healthcare, like Canada

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The US has the best healthcare and actually does make high quality healthcare accessible to a larger range of people.

EU countries have healthcare systems that greatly vary. Some are a combination of public with private insurance. Small countries like Switzerland and Denmark can fare very well but have very different dynamics making comparison nearly impossible.

I find many problems with the US systems but the quality of healthcare isn't so much the problem. It's the bureaucracy and how it's financed (ever so complicated!) and the opaqueness of information that makes it so frustrating.

I don't think anyone will argue that the quality of care in the US is subpar compared to most other countries, just that the system is so broken that we are paying ridiculous amounts for something that other countries charge half the amount for private care.

I will. I believe it is a myth that the US has better quality or outcomes.