Which country actually has the best healthcare system?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s our skyrocketing chronic diseases that’s killing us. Other countries don’t have this.

Yep. Brought on by poor lifestyles. Americans have poor work-life balance, lots of stress, lack community etc., all which impact our health.

All of this is true, and also we live in mortal bodies that are guaranteed to fail. Also people get diseases even when they do everything “right.”

Other countries have mortal people who get diseases, too, but without people going bankrupt from a cancer diagnosis, and without 1 in 4 type1 diabetics rationing insulin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With all the gazillions of dollars we have been forced to pay — only God knows how many — researchers, we are getting sicker and sicker, now the sickest in the world.

What the hell is going on?!?!??

Anyone?

Here's a different question: Which country has a healthcare industry that generates the largest number of millionaires? It the US by a mile. From the owners of a pediatric practice in Chevy Chase, to the C-suite at health insurance companies to the executives of the advertising for big Pharma, lots of folks are making big money in a way that other countries can only dream of.

True, SOME physicians make big money — but they also spend big money and take out big loans during the course of their training. Is that true — or as true — for people in other countries? Many people would be happy with lower salaries if they had more benefits and safety nets for themselves and for their children. So, while it might be nice to be a millionaire, the comparisons may be with people whose kids will pay exponentially less for education, for example.

I was specifically NOT referring to doctors and nurses who actually work with patients on a daily basis. Those folks are just labor. The doctors who make money are those who own the practice or who do plastic surgery.

The real money is made by higher ups in the healthcare industry (20% of the US economy!) who do not treat patients.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s our skyrocketing chronic diseases that’s killing us. Other countries don’t have this.

Because their citizens benefit from regular, preventative medical treatment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s our skyrocketing chronic diseases that’s killing us. Other countries don’t have this.

Yes they do, and increasingly so. Diabetes is a huge problem in China and other countries.

[Anonymous]

By what metric?

In the US, the people who have access to low out of pocket cost healthcare or have significant financial means have the best healthcare in the world. It’s honestly not even close. I’ve worked with health systems all over Western Europe and the only thing they have us beat on is access. Try getting cutting edge cancer care, or top of the line joint replacement, or extremely technical neurosurgery after head trauma. Some of this is available but it’s not nearly as ubiquitous as it is in the U.S.

Sure, you don’t go bankrupt over medical bills but if your metric is just overall “best” the US can’t be beat.

Our costs are higher because of 1. Consumption, 2. Doctor pay, 3. Obesity

[Anonymous]

Corporate controlled pharma is killing us.
We need health care, not forever treatments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Corporate controlled pharma is killing us.
We need health care, not forever treatments.

So "forever treatments" is the new talking point? Seems to be cropping up everywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Corporate controlled pharma is killing us.
We need health care, not forever treatments.

So "forever treatments" is the new talking point? Seems to be cropping up everywhere.

Can we switch it up to, I don’t know, maybe “healing”? That’s what doctors used to focus on before big pharma took control.

[Anonymous]

EU hands down, i have family there. US is great if one has some very aggressive or rare cancer, great insurance, and wants to be a guinea pig for research.

[Anonymous]

The U.S.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you have enough money, the US is the best. If you are a normal person, someone where in Western Europe other than the UK

This right here.

I would say if you have enough money, you can buy the best anywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By what metric?

In the US, the people who have access to low out of pocket cost healthcare or have significant financial means have the best healthcare in the world. It’s honestly not even close. I’ve worked with health systems all over Western Europe and the only thing they have us beat on is access. Try getting cutting edge cancer care, or top of the line joint replacement, or extremely technical neurosurgery after head trauma. Some of this is available but it’s not nearly as ubiquitous as it is in the U.S.

Sure, you don’t go bankrupt over medical bills but if your metric is just overall “best” the US can’t be beat.

Our costs are higher because of 1. Consumption, 2. Doctor pay, 3. Obesity

"Generally, the U.S. performs worse in long-term health outcomes measures (such as life expectancy), certain treatment outcomes (such as maternal mortality and congestive heart failure hospital admissions), some patient safety measures (such as obstetric trauma with instrument and medication or treatment errors), and patient experiences of not getting care due to cost. The U.S. performs similarly to or better than peer nations in some other measures of treatment outcomes (such as mortality rates within 30 days of acute hospital treatment) and patient safety (such as rates of post-operative sepsis).

Across a wide variety of measures of quality, the U.S. health system appears to perform worse than peer nations on more indicators than it does better."

*Life expectancy at birth was similar in the U.S. and peer countries on average in 1980 (73.7 and 74.6 years, respectively), but the gap has grown substantially in the following decades as peer nations saw more rapid improvement in life expectancy.

*From 1980 to 2021, all-cause mortality rates — the number of deaths per 100,000 people, adjusted for age differences across countries — fell by about 17%, compared to a 44% decline in peer countries.

*The “years of life lost” metric marks the extent of premature deaths within a population by providing more weight to deaths at younger ages. The U.S. had the highest per capita rate of years of life lost among similarly large and wealthy countries in 2020 and 2021. The per capita premature excess death rate in the U.S. was over twice as high as the next closest peer country, the U.K.

*The 30-day mortality rates after hospital admissions for heart attacks (acute myocardial infarction) and hemorrhagic stroke (caused by bleeding) are similar in the U.S. and comparable countries average. The 30-day mortality rates for ischemic strokes (caused by blood clots) was 4.3 deaths per 100 patients in the U.S. in 2020, compared to an average of 6.2 deaths per 100 patients in similar countries.

*The U.S. is an outlier with the highest rate of pregnancy-related deaths (22.3 deaths per 100,000 live births in 2022) when compared to peer countries (3.9 deaths per 100,000 live births).

*Rates of post-operative complications are an important measure of hospital safety. Pulmonary embolisms and deep vein thrombosis can arise as complications from surgeries or extended hospital stays. The prevalence of post-operative clots for these procedures is higher in the U.S. than in the U.K., Sweden, Belgium, and the Netherlands, but lower than in Australia.

*Post-operative sepsis is less common in the U.S. than in most peer countries.

Source: https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/quality-u-s-healthcare-system-compare-countries/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By what metric?

In the US, the people who have access to low out of pocket cost healthcare or have significant financial means have the best healthcare in the world. It’s honestly not even close. I’ve worked with health systems all over Western Europe and the only thing they have us beat on is access. Try getting cutting edge cancer care, or top of the line joint replacement, or extremely technical neurosurgery after head trauma. Some of this is available but it’s not nearly as ubiquitous as it is in the U.S.

Sure, you don’t go bankrupt over medical bills but if your metric is just overall “best” the US can’t be beat.

Our costs are higher because of 1. Consumption, 2. Doctor pay, 3. Obesity

I think you’re forgetting the real 1) health insurance, which is a complete scam and which dictates what kind of care you’ll receive. It’s bonkers and should be illegal.

[Anonymous]

I know other countries have Mid level providers which cuts a lot of the cost. I'll give a couple examples.
Zofran is prescription only because it can interact with some heart medications. The obvious solution is to put it behind the counter and tell the pharmacist what medications you are on, then allow only a pharmacist to sell it. But no, a doctor has to get their cut.
UTI? A medical technician can easily diagnose this. A gram stain takes two minutes. If the urine shows gram-negative rods, it's almost certainly E coli and a pharmacist can prescribe the appropriate antibiotic. But no, again, in the US a doctor has to be involved, initial the lab report and get their money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Corporate controlled pharma is killing us.
We need health care, not forever treatments.

So "forever treatments" is the new talking point? Seems to be cropping up everywhere.

Can we switch it up to, I don’t know, maybe “healing”? That’s what doctors used to focus on before big pharma took control.

Yeah, and in the 90s HIV was a short-term death sentence.
And in the 80s it was routine for dads to drop dead from heart attacks at age 42.
And in the 1970s a woman diagnosed with breast cancer was 250% more likely to die from the disease than today.
And in the 1960s life expectancy in the U.S. didn't even hit 70 years.
And in the 1950s childhood leukemia was universally fatal.
And in the 1940s tens of thousands of people were still dying of tuberculosis every single year.
And in the 1930s men's life expectancy was only 58, and women barely expected to make it to 60.
And in the 1920s, tens of thousands of kids were dying of diptheria every year.
And in the 1910s, 100% of children and adults diagnosed with type 1 diabetes dropped into a coma and died.
Should I go on?

You want to criticize pharmaceutical companies for prioritizing shareholders over the patients they serve? You want to criticize pricing and distribution? Be my guest -- or even better: criticize the fact that as a nation, we have legally defined the responsibility of ALL corporations, including pharmaceutical companies, as maximizing shareholder value. But I promise you we do not want to return to the "good-ol' days" when we "healed" without the use of medicines.