Honors for All: when will it end

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

True. When low skill students are mainstreamed, honors becomes regular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing but I agree that you have to be aware of it.

Then schools should be more forthcoming about it. Instead what's been happening is the regular courses have quietly been eliminated and all kids are being assigned to honors regardless of what their grades have been.

Forthcoming? What more do you want, if you look at courses offered and don't see a regular class for that subject? Are you going to assume that all students magically became good at the subject, or are you going to understand that the "Honors" class is just the least challenging class?

I see you belong in the Regular class, PP

You don't understand. When our then-8th-grader was registering for 9th grade, the school's registration form listed both regular and honors classes for English and Biology. But then when they got to 9th, the regular classes had disappeared and every 9th grader was put into 'Honors' English and 'Honors' Biology. There was no explanation about this change ever shared by the school. We only found out it happened because a parent shared the info on the listserv.

Same experience. It was the lack of communication and transparency that frustrated me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

And then everyone is like "Why are our kids doing drugs and so depressed?" Duh.

Again, mixing everything up.

The kids who are serious and doing multiple APs are not the same ones vaping in the bathroom, partying and doing harder drugs. They're at home, studying. They do risk burnout and they're ALL stressed.

The druggies are not on the 12-AP track. This is my neighbor kid, buying drugs, out at all hours, whooping it up. He's a smart kid too. He's going to community college, but he might be perfectly well-adjusted in a decade, who knows.

Statistically, the former tend to reach higher income brackets than the latter. Drugs are now laced with Fentanyl and you play Russian roulette every time. But hey, at least the druggies are not stressed right now!

LOL. Welcome to Churchill.
You don't live in the county, do you?

Yeah, stop lying. My teen is at Walter Johnson, and has friends at Churchill, Whitman and BCC. We've been around for a while in this part of the county. I'd say that 99% of high achievers in these schools are not wasting their time doing drugs.

But you go on spreading nonsense on DCUM

You definitely don't have kids in the county.
It's not a secret there are lot of drugs at Churchill. Ambulance used to be called almost every week for kids passing out from drugs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

True. When low skill students are mainstreamed, honors becomes regular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing but I agree that you have to be aware of it.

Then schools should be more forthcoming about it. Instead what's been happening is the regular courses have quietly been eliminated and all kids are being assigned to honors regardless of what their grades have been.

Forthcoming? What more do you want, if you look at courses offered and don't see a regular class for that subject? Are you going to assume that all students magically became good at the subject, or are you going to understand that the "Honors" class is just the least challenging class?

I see you belong in the Regular class, PP

You don't understand. When our then-8th-grader was registering for 9th grade, the school's registration form listed both regular and honors classes for English and Biology. But then when they got to 9th, the regular classes had disappeared and every 9th grader was put into 'Honors' English and 'Honors' Biology. There was no explanation about this change ever shared by the school. We only found out it happened because a parent shared the info on the listserv.

DP but what's the problem there? Maybe there was not enough students taking the regular classes, or maybe they were challenging everyone to their potential?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

True. When low skill students are mainstreamed, honors becomes regular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing but I agree that you have to be aware of it.

Then schools should be more forthcoming about it. Instead what's been happening is the regular courses have quietly been eliminated and all kids are being assigned to honors regardless of what their grades have been.

Forthcoming? What more do you want, if you look at courses offered and don't see a regular class for that subject? Are you going to assume that all students magically became good at the subject, or are you going to understand that the "Honors" class is just the least challenging class?

I see you belong in the Regular class, PP

You don't understand. When our then-8th-grader was registering for 9th grade, the school's registration form listed both regular and honors classes for English and Biology. But then when they got to 9th, the regular classes had disappeared and every 9th grader was put into 'Honors' English and 'Honors' Biology. There was no explanation about this change ever shared by the school. We only found out it happened because a parent shared the info on the listserv.

DP but what's the problem there? Maybe there was not enough students taking the regular classes, or maybe they were challenging everyone to their potential?

NP. no, they dumbed it down. And they do nothing in MS to prepare kids for the more rigorous AP classes.

[Anonymous]

Unfortunately, everyone who has any resources whatsoever thinks their child is either highly gifted or gifted and disabled. This has been a trend for the past 10 years. As a teacher, I can tell you that most of the kids that the parents say are so gifted are really only average to slightly above but they have tons of parent support. UMC parents here simply cannot accept that their child is probably more likely average with privilege. This means the district bends over backwards to help make the parents feel special. Even more frustrating are the parents who demand special Ed services because they think their child is so gifted but they are only able to perform at the average range because they have a “disability” (adhd, autism, anxiety). Turns out most of these kids just feel bad about themselves because they can’t live up to the ridiculous expectations. It makes me laugh how we are constantly trying to make parents feel better about themselves by pretending we agree with them but then again, it’s not worth the tantrums the families take. Sadly, the kids end up never being able to live up to these ridiculous expectations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately, everyone who has any resources whatsoever thinks their child is either highly gifted or gifted and disabled. This has been a trend for the past 10 years. As a teacher, I can tell you that most of the kids that the parents say are so gifted are really only average to slightly above but they have tons of parent support. UMC parents here simply cannot accept that their child is probably more likely average with privilege. This means the district bends over backwards to help make the parents feel special. Even more frustrating are the parents who demand special Ed services because they think their child is so gifted but they are only able to perform at the average range because they have a “disability” (adhd, autism, anxiety). Turns out most of these kids just feel bad about themselves because they can’t live up to the ridiculous expectations. It makes me laugh how we are constantly trying to make parents feel better about themselves by pretending we agree with them but then again, it’s not worth the tantrums the families take. Sadly, the kids end up never being able to live up to these ridiculous expectations.

WHEW! You said a word right here. I definitely think many parents default to their kids having a disability as a way to cope with some kind of disappointment on why their child isn't the whiz kid they believe them to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

True. When low skill students are mainstreamed, honors becomes regular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing but I agree that you have to be aware of it.

Then schools should be more forthcoming about it. Instead what's been happening is the regular courses have quietly been eliminated and all kids are being assigned to honors regardless of what their grades have been.

Forthcoming? What more do you want, if you look at courses offered and don't see a regular class for that subject? Are you going to assume that all students magically became good at the subject, or are you going to understand that the "Honors" class is just the least challenging class?

I see you belong in the Regular class, PP

You don't understand. When our then-8th-grader was registering for 9th grade, the school's registration form listed both regular and honors classes for English and Biology. But then when they got to 9th, the regular classes had disappeared and every 9th grader was put into 'Honors' English and 'Honors' Biology. There was no explanation about this change ever shared by the school. We only found out it happened because a parent shared the info on the listserv.

DP but what's the problem there? Maybe there was not enough students taking the regular classes, or maybe they were challenging everyone to their potential?

NP. no, they dumbed it down. And they do nothing in MS to prepare kids for the more rigorous AP classes.

Yes, they dumbed it down. This is how MCPS describes honors courses. Does any honors course even resemble this?:

Honors courses provide expectations and opportunities for students to engage in more rigorous and complex content and processes and to develop authentic products that reflect the student’s understanding of key concepts. The curriculum in each Honors course includes appropriate adaptations for enriched learning to pursue in-depth studies that require abstract and higher-order thinking skills.

It would be nice if on Back to School night, teachers of honors courses would explain to parents how their class will be providing the above.

[Anonymous]

I’m in a different school district, but how did MCPS accomplish this, just rename all the non-honors classes? Did they actually Jack up the expectations in all non-honors classes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m in a different school district, but how did MCPS accomplish this, just rename all the non-honors classes? Did they actually Jack up the expectations in all non-honors classes?

It would be interesting to hear this from a teacher's perspective. As a parent, it certainly feels like they removed any rigorous content.

[Transplant_1]

I just spoke with a recent Whitman grade who said that for freshman year, normally one does not take APs., but there are grade-level and honors courses. For sophmore year, there are grade-level, honors, and AP classes. Then junior year, there are just AP classes, and non-AP classes (whether it's called honors or grade-level.) That makes a lot of sense. If my child was in a regular class in freshman year, they have something to reach for for sophomore year - to get into the honors by working hard, and knowing what to reach for.

So in which schools are all the on-level courses disappearing, and instead all kids are just put into a dumbed down honors, and is that for all 4 grades?

[Anonymous]

PP, that is no longer true. For next year, Whitman has honors for all for English and social studies. See the registration card for freshman: https://sites.google.com/mcpsmd.net/wwhs-counseling/academics/registration-course-selection?authuser=0

For English: If you are not an ELL, your only option is honors English.

For social studies, your option is honors or AP.

There remains differentiation for math and science — but at some schools, for science regular and honors kids take the same class but have different exams. (Not sure if that is the case at Whitman, but it is the case at BCC and some other schools.)

[Transplant_1]

Thank you. Why do they do this? Under resourced? In the name of equity? Both?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
My senior just graduated, OP, with a dozen AP classes, like many students.

AP is the new Honors.
Honors is the new Regular.
Regular is the new Remedial.

This has been going on for years.
If you don't know this, you haven't been paying attention.

If you care at all about college admissions, you have to play that game. There are plenty of 4.2 wgpa, multiple-AP students who are rejected from UMD.

True. When low skill students are mainstreamed, honors becomes regular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing but I agree that you have to be aware of it.

Then schools should be more forthcoming about it. Instead what's been happening is the regular courses have quietly been eliminated and all kids are being assigned to honors regardless of what their grades have been.

Forthcoming? What more do you want, if you look at courses offered and don't see a regular class for that subject? Are you going to assume that all students magically became good at the subject, or are you going to understand that the "Honors" class is just the least challenging class?

I see you belong in the Regular class, PP

You don't understand. When our then-8th-grader was registering for 9th grade, the school's registration form listed both regular and honors classes for English and Biology. But then when they got to 9th, the regular classes had disappeared and every 9th grader was put into 'Honors' English and 'Honors' Biology. There was no explanation about this change ever shared by the school. We only found out it happened because a parent shared the info on the listserv.

DP but what's the problem there? Maybe there was not enough students taking the regular classes, or maybe they were challenging everyone to their potential?

NP. no, they dumbed it down. And they do nothing in MS to prepare kids for the more rigorous AP classes.

Yes, they dumbed it down. This is how MCPS describes honors courses. Does any honors course even resemble this?:

Honors courses provide expectations and opportunities for students to engage in more rigorous and complex content and processes and to develop authentic products that reflect the student’s understanding of key concepts. The curriculum in each Honors course includes appropriate adaptations for enriched learning to pursue in-depth studies that require abstract and higher-order thinking skills.

It would be nice if on Back to School night, teachers of honors courses would explain to parents how their class will be providing the above.

At our school, this is not the case at all. They have helped students rise to new heights, but I did hear at the lesser schools they had to dumb it down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately, everyone who has any resources whatsoever thinks their child is either highly gifted or gifted and disabled. This has been a trend for the past 10 years. As a teacher, I can tell you that most of the kids that the parents say are so gifted are really only average to slightly above but they have tons of parent support. UMC parents here simply cannot accept that their child is probably more likely average with privilege. This means the district bends over backwards to help make the parents feel special. Even more frustrating are the parents who demand special Ed services because they think their child is so gifted but they are only able to perform at the average range because they have a “disability” (adhd, autism, anxiety). Turns out most of these kids just feel bad about themselves because they can’t live up to the ridiculous expectations. It makes me laugh how we are constantly trying to make parents feel better about themselves by pretending we agree with them but then again, it’s not worth the tantrums the families take. Sadly, the kids end up never being able to live up to these ridiculous expectations.

WHEW! You said a word right here. I definitely think many parents default to their kids having a disability as a way to cope with some kind of disappointment on why their child isn't the whiz kid they believe them to be.

I think this has to do with he 300% increase in special ed cases in the more affluent schools this past decade. The problem is this makes it hard for those who need these services to get them since the system is spread to thin.

[Anonymous]

How is MCPS able to do Honors for all? In DCPS we can’t even do grade level for all, let alone honors. What is happening to all the kids below grade level in MCPS?