Time to Stop Counting on Charters

[Anonymous]

Let's face it.

The number of slots available at PS3, the most common entering year (probably by an order of magnitude), leaves newly entering parents with odds something like 1 out of 50 or 1 out of 100 to get their kid a seat. Sometimes worse.

At numbers like that, charters aren't worth counting on in any reasonable way. Which of you, at work or elsewhere, tell your bosses or anyone who counts on you for anything: "well, there's a 97-99% chance that it'll never happen. But we're planning on that, for now."

I would tell parents living in DC that they should all enter all the lotteries they are interested in, then immediately forget they applied, so that maybe, someday in late March, they might get a call saying their kid was admitted or a postcard with a waitlist number under 10. Otherwise, look at whether you can live with your inbound school, think you can win the DCPS lottery somehow, know of a private school you like and can afford (and get into) or would like to move.

As far as life goes for those of us in the game today, there might as well be no such thing as Mundo Verde. Probably the same for LAMB, Capital City, EL Haynes, Two Rivers and all the other places that the PCS Board or others would like to tout as examples of happy rainbow success.

So - at this point, I have decided that the game is either our inbound school, where the kid got a slot, or a local Catholic school. And that's it. And nobody should be under any illusions that there are any likely alternatives.

[Anonymous]

You are immediately going to get slammed from the Charter School parents that troll this site - looking for anyone who slams school choice.

[Anonymous]

I really see your point. I went to the lottery of a popular school that actually had a few slots for the grade we were looking for, and even though I knew the really bad odds, it was sobering to actually be there and watch name after name drawn... and none of them ours. I'm actually glad I went, because it brings up exactly what you're pointing out: for those of us who want to have the best plan possible for our kids (which is most parents, and certainly most parents on DCUM), you really do need to know what your realistic, acceptable "Plan B" is.

And I'm not going to complain about how unfair it is, because DC public schools have sucked for so long for the most part, for anyone who's not FARMS to complain now when most families weren't even considering sending their kid to public school in DC, it seems disingenous.

Our Plan B will have to be throught through by June because we need to move then. As stressful as that will be too, it's kind of good to have that as a line in the sand, even though most waitlists for the popular schools don't budge much until Sept/Oct.

Your point is well taken.

[Anonymous]

I agree with the OP. I know many families who are really happy in their charters, and I'm happy for them and envious of them. On the one hand, I think it's great that there is so much interest in non-standard education in DC. On the other hand, it's depressing to know that you're one of 1,000 applications for only a handful of spots.

Does it really count as school choice if you do not have a chance of getting in?

[Anonymous]

I had the same feeling this weekend--our best hope is a number in the high 20s for our east of the park but out of bounds school--but its unlikely to move as much as we would need to get in. However, I think there are a few things to consider.

First, the biggest competiition is for PS3 because not all schools offer it. Most west of the park and several more charters start at PK4. By K, when a lot of kids are guaranteed at their IB schools, it is yet another shuffle.

Secondly, I'm not sure the actual chances are 1 in a 100 for charters. I'd be curious, though. Cap City, a desirable charter, got 522 applications for PS 3 (I'm in the 400s). 30 spaces, half of which are for siblings. I'm assuming that the same 522 parents, more or less, are applying for the other 'hot' to "good enough" charters (mundo verde, lamb, cap city, creative minds, stokes, bridges, haynes, Inspired teaching--if you throw in apple tree, meridian, etc, there are more). . Let's say there's a pool of about 700 kids, more or less, applying for about an average of 15 slots at, let's say, a top 8 charter schools for PS (looking at a couple WL for ps# will give a good idea of how large the pool is). But if each PS3 has about 12 non sibling slots, then your chances are closer to 1 in 7 of getting in at a charter, when the dust settles. Plus, many of these same 700 kids will be applying for either IB or OOB schools. So, when puzzling this out this weekend with DH, even though its depressing to get a waitlist number of 400something, my sense was that our chances were closer to 1:3 of getting into one of the 16 schools we applied to (10 charters, 6 DCPS OOB). But no, you can't really count on the charters--unless you start one yourself when your kid is 2 years away from PS3 or getting in the first year, which is how I know several families at MV and CM, got in the year it opened.

[Anonymous]

This is my first time playing the lottery and I really don't know what to think. The word "choice" doesn't seem accurate since luck plays such a much larger role when it comes to the charters. Also, it seems like there is a lot of movement over the next 6 months that the initial results are not at all indicative on where families end up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You are immediately going to get slammed from the Charter School parents that troll this site - looking for anyone who slams school choice.

Why? The point is not that there is something wrong with charters/school choice. The point is that there aren't enough charters to go around and we need more of them for true choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had the same feeling this weekend--our best hope is a number in the high 20s for our east of the park but out of bounds school--but its unlikely to move as much as we would need to get in. However, I think there are a few things to consider.

First, the biggest competiition is for PS3 because not all schools offer it. Most west of the park and several more charters start at PK4. By K, when a lot of kids are guaranteed at their IB schools, it is yet another shuffle.

Secondly, I'm not sure the actual chances are 1 in a 100 for charters. I'd be curious, though. Cap City, a desirable charter, got 522 applications for PS 3 (I'm in the 400s). 30 spaces, half of which are for siblings. I'm assuming that the same 522 parents, more or less, are applying for the other 'hot' to "good enough" charters (mundo verde, lamb, cap city, creative minds, stokes, bridges, haynes, Inspired teaching--if you throw in apple tree, meridian, etc, there are more). . Let's say there's a pool of about 700 kids, more or less, applying for about an average of 15 slots at, let's say, a top 8 charter schools for PS (looking at a couple WL for ps# will give a good idea of how large the pool is). But if each PS3 has about 12 non sibling slots, then your chances are closer to 1 in 7 of getting in at a charter, when the dust settles. Plus, many of these same 700 kids will be applying for either IB or OOB schools. So, when puzzling this out this weekend with DH, even though its depressing to get a waitlist number of 400something, my sense was that our chances were closer to 1:3 of getting into one of the 16 schools we applied to (10 charters, 6 DCPS OOB). But no, you can't really count on the charters--unless you start one yourself when your kid is 2 years away from PS3 or getting in the first year, which is how I know several families at MV and CM, got in the year it opened.

I'm sure we'll all be too busy to remember this in, say November this year, but I'd be REALLY interested if we all came back to this thread in November or started a new one, and shared results. How many schools we applied to, starting admissions/waitlist numbers, how many schools we said yes to and then no to, and whether we ended up in one of our top choices and why it was a top choice.

I think you and OP raise a really interesting question, just what ARE the odds of getting in? And how much to they vary by school and why? Maybe I'll see you all back here to continue the discussion in November!

[Anonymous]

Well, somebody gets in, because there are tons of people with kids in charter schools, including me. I understand your frustration, and yes, the odds are low but just like the Powerball somebody's number is going to come up. It just sucks when it isn't yours. The fact that lots of people don't get in doesn't mean that charters are a waste of time. We all play the hand we're dealt. If I hadn't gotten a slot, we simply would have left our child in daycare until K and then enrolled him at a Catholic school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are immediately going to get slammed from the Charter School parents that troll this site - looking for anyone who slams school choice.

Why? The point is not that there is something wrong with charters/school choice. The point is that there aren't enough charters to go around and we need more of them for true choice.

Do you think it's choice? Or do you think it's chance?

Try asking some of the people east of the park or who don't live in your little Ward 3 worlds and you'll get a different perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, somebody gets in, because there are tons of people with kids in charter schools, including me. I understand your frustration, and yes, the odds are low but just like the Powerball somebody's number is going to come up. It just sucks when it isn't yours. The fact that lots of people don't get in doesn't mean that charters are a waste of time. We all play the hand we're dealt. If I hadn't gotten a slot, we simply would have left our child in daycare until K and then enrolled him at a Catholic school.

Well, great that you can pay for school. Not everyone can do that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, somebody gets in, because there are tons of people with kids in charter schools, including me. I understand your frustration, and yes, the odds are low but just like the Powerball somebody's number is going to come up. It just sucks when it isn't yours. The fact that lots of people don't get in doesn't mean that charters are a waste of time. We all play the hand we're dealt. If I hadn't gotten a slot, we simply would have left our child in daycare until K and then enrolled him at a Catholic school.

Yeah! 2 extra years of daycare - because you know, everyone can just pay for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, somebody gets in, because there are tons of people with kids in charter schools, including me. I understand your frustration, and yes, the odds are low but just like the Powerball somebody's number is going to come up. It just sucks when it isn't yours. The fact that lots of people don't get in doesn't mean that charters are a waste of time. We all play the hand we're dealt. If I hadn't gotten a slot, we simply would have left our child in daycare until K and then enrolled him at a Catholic school.

I don't think anyone said that charters themselves are a waste of time. I posted at 10:10. I think that applying to most of the popular charters is a waste of time. Applying to Mundo Verde for PS this year, for example, was a waste of time for anyone who did not already have a child enrolled there. I don't know how many other schools that's true for, but I'd be willing to bet that MV isn't the only charter with no spaces actually available for the general non-preferenced public.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, somebody gets in, because there are tons of people with kids in charter schools, including me. I understand your frustration, and yes, the odds are low but just like the Powerball somebody's number is going to come up. It just sucks when it isn't yours. The fact that lots of people don't get in doesn't mean that charters are a waste of time. We all play the hand we're dealt. If I hadn't gotten a slot, we simply would have left our child in daycare until K and then enrolled him at a Catholic school.

I don't think anyone said that charters themselves are a waste of time. I posted at 10:10. I think that applying to most of the popular charters is a waste of time. Applying to Mundo Verde for PS this year, for example, was a waste of time for anyone who did not already have a child enrolled there. I don't know how many other schools that's true for, but I'd be willing to bet that MV isn't the only charter with no spaces actually available for the general non-preferenced public.

It really hurt that MV is only having 1 PS class. Hopefully, with the new building 2014-15 will have better chances for entry.

[Anonymous]

Low wait list number for pre-K at Sela, ridiculously high wait list number everywhere else. Overall, pretty excited to be part of a new school.