Anonymous wrote:I totally get why MCPS doesn’t want to give up on students. But there are a real subset of kids who are violent and disruptive, and they get shuffled from school to school rather than truly addressing the underlying issues. I don’t think many here are aware of some of the deeply disturbed family lives some of these kids are coming from. Social media is THE LAST CONCERN in these situations. But these kids are creating outsized problems.
MCPS thinks it can soften expectations to give kids multiple chances as they attempt to support mental health and teach social skills that aren’t being supported or taught at home.
It doesn’t work, and it degrades the educational experience of everyone else.
MCPS needs to go back to setting clear behavioral and academic expectations and then enforce them. One, this actually helps a lot of kids who struggle in terms of behavior. Two, there are kids who could behave just fine, but who take advantage of the fact there are few rules and no consequences. Three, it makes the environment healthier for everyone.
And four, for those kids with significant behavioral issues, use a collaborative case management approach to address all aspects of the child’s life. If this includes transferring the student to a special school for kids with acute behavioral issues, do it. But have a clear plan in place for reintegrating that child when they meet behavioral expectations.
They are doing far more harm than good with their fake mental health and social support. There is no real mental health or social support, just class discussions with teachers or SSL hour lectures/activities to "discuss it." Kids with true mental health and other issues need real help outside MCPS, as MCPS is to educate, not parent or handle mental health crises, and should only get involved to help parents get their kids to the right support. Many of these kids need therapists, psychologists/psychiatrists and really good evaluations and that's not happening in MCPS. It also needs to start catching learning disabilities earlier and getting those kids help if kids cannot perform in school they get discouraged and give up or act out. MCPS and/or the county should establish a few mental health clinics outside the schools where families can go for crisis mental health (the crisis center is more set up for adults than kids) and the county needs to offer more mental health services (they do have some but not accessible to all) for kids (although I suspect one issue is they cannot hire enough social workers/therapists as no one wants to work for the county anymore as it isn't a good job as it once was).
YES! You nailed it. MCPS is NOT equipped nor should it be the lead on TREATING AND SUPPORTING kids with mental health needs or issues. It can, though, be on the front lines of diagnosing or spotting those needs, much like they are with vision and hearing.
Their vision and hearing screenings are a joke, just are the ones in the ped's clinics. They were completely incorrect for my kids and they have no business doing medical care for kids. If they want to provide medical care, set up clinics in some of the local schools with parent consent so kids can get regular care and physicals at a free or low cost. It's all for the show.
They need to focus on education. If some of these kids were getting a better education and their needs met (especially via early intervention in K-5), many of them would be doing far better later on. When they ignore basic learning disabilities and only provide minimal support for other disabilities and delays they are failing our kids. When they ignore smart and gifted kids and lump them all together, they are failing our kids. When they ignore the average kids who may be struggling but too quiet or because they are passing, they are also failing those kids.
I don't know what to tell you. I personally benefited from the vision screenings in MCPS as a kid in the 90s, so I disagree that it doesn't work. My teachers noticed the issue, I had the vision screening and then I got a referral to an optometrist and I got glasses, which I desperately needed.
I agree with the other points, but it's not unreasonable to expect that the entity that has oversight of our kids for 6 hours a day every day can play a role in screening for physical and mental health anomalies.
Then, you had checked out parents. We always took ours for vision exams when we did our own. I don't need MCPS to do medical care. They did a huge drama for us demanding that we do a vision test for our child and it was bizarre as the child came in the week prior wearing brand new glasses and was wearing them daily. For months they demanded a copy of the doctor's exam and prescription/receipt of the classes.
Why would you be so mean here? The PP said the screening helped her and you bash her parents. Personally. God! This thread is awful. There are a LOT of reasons public school behavior is lacking. It’s not just- other parents aren’t as awesome as me with my cell phone policy and regular vision checks. The world is big. There are lots of kinds of parents. It’s public school! You live near it? You go there! I don’t know why a subset of people just wants to criticize other parents )or teachers or unions). It’s so incredibly complex and life is hard for some families and most of them are trying their hardest. And most teachers are too! And honestly kids are doing the best they can. It’s ain’t perfect, but consider the alternative! No thanks.
Because those checked out parents are part of the problem. Your kids need yearly physicals, yearly eye exams and twice yearly dental cleanings.
It seems like many parents are unhappy that the county doesn't do more to raise their kids for them.
It seems like you'd rather feel superior to parents than make sure kids get what they need.
The problem is the county is so concerned with all these things that they've forgotten about education. Presently, they don't give all kids what they need and are only concerned with ones that are below grade level. Sure, that's unfortunate but all children deserve an education.
I am sincerely sorry that you feel like vision and hearing screening 3 times in 13 years of school significantly detracts from your child's education.
It should be voluntary. I don’t need the school to take care of my children’s health needs. They get yearly eye exams, more if needed, two to three time a year dental cleanings, yearly physicals and any other time they need a doctor. It’s called parenting. Oh, and monthly to a few time a month ortho appointments.
You do realize that not every student is as fortunate as your children? Sometimes we all make a sacrifice for the greater good.
The point the PPP is trying to make is that the mission of MCPS and most other school districts is EDUCATION not community wellness and support.
While it may be easier to provide for needy kids and families in schools, that is not their mission or purpose. If we as a nation want school systems to be in the business of community wellness and support then we need to greatly reimagine the entire system. Schools and school systems get measured on their ability to EDUCATE kids not in the ability to provide wrap around services.
Some people understand that a school's ability to EDUCATE depends on community wellness and support. And other people do not understand that.
And some understand a school's ability to EDUCATE depends on parents being parents. Most of the problems today go back to people expecting the school to raise their kids and failing at parenting.
All the more reason for kids to have access to these services at school, so that they can be educated even though they have parents who are failures at parenting.
Why is that exactly? No one shows up at a doctors office expecting them to teach kids ABCs. You don’t ask the soccer coach to teach basketball skills on the soccer field. Why should school provide more than an education and opportunity for exploration in learning? Schools are community centers.
I got an email earlier about a meeting reviewing the latest anti-racist audit with our ES. I get that this is a problem for society but our ES spends more time on this than they do on reading or math. It just seems like nothing changes because they aren't really able to address these issues and instead it ends up making things worse sense basic skills like reading and math are neglected.
No, they don't. They just don't send you an email every day about it. Today, we did reading and math. Today, we did reading and math. Today, we did reading and math. Today, we did reading and math.
Based on the test scores, they aren't doing well on the reading and math bit.
Wouldn't know about that but my kids got perfect scores on their MCAPS so they seem to be doing great. I suspect it's because I take an interest in them and don't expect the school to raise them.
Anonymous wrote:Who cares. My kid is getting great grades and is going to a top college next year, and is PREPARED. The older kid also went through MCPS and has a great career.
Anonymous wrote:You can’t take away phones, but no one ever said you can’t build a faraday cage in a school to disrupt cell phone service. Block mobile phone use in all schools, period.
And yes, screen addiction is real. TikTok is absolutely toxic trash that literally is training a generation of minds to become ADD. Kids grow up with years of TikTok use where they need immediate gratification from 10 second video clips. Then they become incapable of sitting for a classroom lesson that might last 50 minutes. Tiktok is ruining brains and attention spans.
Agree. The posters above want to say that since they and their children are not addicted that this widespread phenomenon you’re describing has no bearing on general student behavior. It’s just parents’ fault.
I like the idea of a signal disrupter. How’s that gonna fly with all the school shootings though? Not being snarky- honestly asking how we could make it work.
My kids have zero interest in TikTok. They are pretty busy between homework and activities. Maybe yours need less free time.
Sigh.
Again - this is PUBLIC school, so not everyone is raising their kids the same way as you! If you live near that building, you go there. That's how it works. Just because you love private vision screening (snicker) and have children who don't look at TikTok doesn't mean that other children need the screening, and are addicted. You just want to bash parents, which isn't helpful!
No, I want parents to be responsible for their kids basic needs and school to be about education and academics. I don't need the school to do vision and other exams for my kids. If kids need it, then set up clinics in the schools and get parental consent. That would make the most sense but don't force a screening for every child (and in our case the screenings have been wrong).
Exactly
Yep
And caused a lot of undue stress for my kid
Idiots
How exactly do you still get a 50% if you skip school every single day and get a 60% to pass if you submit 3 assignments the whole time?
MoCo is in steep decline, and property values are so overinflated it is funny. You can't even use the schools argument anymore to support property values. And why should people pay more taxes 'for the schools!' when they're already that much of an abject failure, as discussed in that chat?
The “no consequences” piece is true. Have you heard about Restorative Circles? Twisted on so many ways.
More and more I now understand what School Choice was really about. We are going private this coming year. It was simply too much.
Anonymous wrote:It's not in a steep decline. It hit rock bottom a while ago.
As much as I'd like to agree, mcps can and does continue to find ways to get worse.
Call it like it is. Wolffe and McKnight are in charge and no one can tell them differently. It's nice to be King.
We need new leadership in MCPS and the BOE who care about "Equality" (equal application of resources to all students) over "Equity" (some are more equal than others), Education and Security over Restorative Justice, and Fundamentals (renovations, school supplies) over pet projects (Leader in Me, Smartboards that aren't used, Kid Museum only for a select few). Until Wolffe is out, McKnight can't be fired and Wolffe was just re-elected by a hairline margin.
Agree there are no consequences (kids in a W, work at another W - this is true at all levels of school and in all schools).
Agree there are children who need more help and support at every school.
Agree MCPS has been going downhill for a long time.
Principals have their hands tied by central office.
Teachers have their hands tied by Principals.
No final exams, 50% grades, etc have not helped.
Demographics of the county have changed, and that has not helped either
Anonymous wrote:It's not in a steep decline. It hit rock bottom a while ago.
As much as I'd like to agree, mcps can and does continue to find ways to get worse.
Call it like it is. Wolffe and McKnight are in charge and no one can tell them differently. It's nice to be King.
We need new leadership in MCPS and the BOE who care about "Equality" (equal application of resources to all students) over "Equity" (some are more equal than others), Education and Security over Restorative Justice, and Fundamentals (renovations, school supplies) over pet projects (Leader in Me, Smartboards that aren't used, Kid Museum only for a select few). Until Wolffe is out, McKnight can't be fired and Wolffe was just re-elected by a hairline margin.
And this is the reason folks can’t make progress because you think equality will work and don’t understand equity. Equity is about providing everyone the resources they need to be successful and not assuming that the same resources for everyone will create the same results. Folks don’t come into an organization (including education) on an equal playing field. So believing that giving them equal resources will result in equal or even near equal outcomes is crazy.
Sorry to gloat but we recognized MCPS was going downhill long ago - started actually with Weist giving deal to Pearson in exchange for grand tour of Australia and New Zealand. Now just jobs program for women in the county.
Anonymous wrote:MCPS is a shell of its past. First no SRO's, now more protection for the principals? WTF
I find it interesting that MCPS is getting the blame here not the quoted problem:
And that aggressive behavior isn’t from students — it’s “parents and community members.
+1. The thread should be "The state of MCPS parents is atrocious"
+1. Schools are microcosm of society. So until we begin to fix those problems in earnest schools will continue to deteriorate. The funny thing is that studying other education systems in the world pointed to the fact that the problem that exist in the US education system actual are cultural in nature and larger than one school district.
Anonymous wrote:I totally get why MCPS doesn’t want to give up on students. But there are a real subset of kids who are violent and disruptive, and they get shuffled from school to school rather than truly addressing the underlying issues. I don’t think many here are aware of some of the deeply disturbed family lives some of these kids are coming from. Social media is THE LAST CONCERN in these situations. But these kids are creating outsized problems.
MCPS thinks it can soften expectations to give kids multiple chances as they attempt to support mental health and teach social skills that aren’t being supported or taught at home.
It doesn’t work, and it degrades the educational experience of everyone else.
MCPS needs to go back to setting clear behavioral and academic expectations and then enforce them. One, this actually helps a lot of kids who struggle in terms of behavior. Two, there are kids who could behave just fine, but who take advantage of the fact there are few rules and no consequences. Three, it makes the environment healthier for everyone.
And four, for those kids with significant behavioral issues, use a collaborative case management approach to address all aspects of the child’s life. If this includes transferring the student to a special school for kids with acute behavioral issues, do it. But have a clear plan in place for reintegrating that child when they meet behavioral expectations.
They are doing far more harm than good with their fake mental health and social support. There is no real mental health or social support, just class discussions with teachers or SSL hour lectures/activities to "discuss it." Kids with true mental health and other issues need real help outside MCPS, as MCPS is to educate, not parent or handle mental health crises, and should only get involved to help parents get their kids to the right support. Many of these kids need therapists, psychologists/psychiatrists and really good evaluations and that's not happening in MCPS. It also needs to start catching learning disabilities earlier and getting those kids help if kids cannot perform in school they get discouraged and give up or act out. MCPS and/or the county should establish a few mental health clinics outside the schools where families can go for crisis mental health (the crisis center is more set up for adults than kids) and the county needs to offer more mental health services (they do have some but not accessible to all) for kids (although I suspect one issue is they cannot hire enough social workers/therapists as no one wants to work for the county anymore as it isn't a good job as it once was).
YES! You nailed it. MCPS is NOT equipped nor should it be the lead on TREATING AND SUPPORTING kids with mental health needs or issues. It can, though, be on the front lines of diagnosing or spotting those needs, much like they are with vision and hearing.
Their vision and hearing screenings are a joke, just are the ones in the ped's clinics. They were completely incorrect for my kids and they have no business doing medical care for kids. If they want to provide medical care, set up clinics in some of the local schools with parent consent so kids can get regular care and physicals at a free or low cost. It's all for the show.
They need to focus on education. If some of these kids were getting a better education and their needs met (especially via early intervention in K-5), many of them would be doing far better later on. When they ignore basic learning disabilities and only provide minimal support for other disabilities and delays they are failing our kids. When they ignore smart and gifted kids and lump them all together, they are failing our kids. When they ignore the average kids who may be struggling but too quiet or because they are passing, they are also failing those kids.
I don't know what to tell you. I personally benefited from the vision screenings in MCPS as a kid in the 90s, so I disagree that it doesn't work. My teachers noticed the issue, I had the vision screening and then I got a referral to an optometrist and I got glasses, which I desperately needed.
I agree with the other points, but it's not unreasonable to expect that the entity that has oversight of our kids for 6 hours a day every day can play a role in screening for physical and mental health anomalies.
Then, you had checked out parents. We always took ours for vision exams when we did our own. I don't need MCPS to do medical care. They did a huge drama for us demanding that we do a vision test for our child and it was bizarre as the child came in the week prior wearing brand new glasses and was wearing them daily. For months they demanded a copy of the doctor's exam and prescription/receipt of the classes.
Why would you be so mean here? The PP said the screening helped her and you bash her parents. Personally. God! This thread is awful. There are a LOT of reasons public school behavior is lacking. It’s not just- other parents aren’t as awesome as me with my cell phone policy and regular vision checks. The world is big. There are lots of kinds of parents. It’s public school! You live near it? You go there! I don’t know why a subset of people just wants to criticize other parents )or teachers or unions). It’s so incredibly complex and life is hard for some families and most of them are trying their hardest. And most teachers are too! And honestly kids are doing the best they can. It’s ain’t perfect, but consider the alternative! No thanks.
Because those checked out parents are part of the problem. Your kids need yearly physicals, yearly eye exams and twice yearly dental cleanings.
It seems like many parents are unhappy that the county doesn't do more to raise their kids for them.
It seems like you'd rather feel superior to parents than make sure kids get what they need.
The problem is the county is so concerned with all these things that they've forgotten about education. Presently, they don't give all kids what they need and are only concerned with ones that are below grade level. Sure, that's unfortunate but all children deserve an education.
I am sincerely sorry that you feel like vision and hearing screening 3 times in 13 years of school significantly detracts from your child's education.
It should be voluntary. I don’t need the school to take care of my children’s health needs. They get yearly eye exams, more if needed, two to three time a year dental cleanings, yearly physicals and any other time they need a doctor. It’s called parenting. Oh, and monthly to a few time a month ortho appointments.
You do realize that not every student is as fortunate as your children? Sometimes we all make a sacrifice for the greater good.
The point the PPP is trying to make is that the mission of MCPS and most other school districts is EDUCATION not community wellness and support.
While it may be easier to provide for needy kids and families in schools, that is not their mission or purpose. If we as a nation want school systems to be in the business of community wellness and support then we need to greatly reimagine the entire system. Schools and school systems get measured on their ability to EDUCATE kids not in the ability to provide wrap around services.
We need to "reimagine the entire system" to continue to provide services that have been part of schools since the 1950s? Vision screenings and even vaccinations have long been done through public schools. Part of that is because being able see is obviously important for learning, but also because they've always had a role in supporting child wellness.
I take my kids to a pediatrician who does these things. The school just insists I provide proof of vaccination for my kid to attend.
And its fine for you to do so. But you’re the one suggesting we “reimagine” the system by having schools *stop* providing those services.
Schools have become so overwhelmed by providing all these secondary services that they no longer provide education.
I don’t think the schools are overwhelmed. However, certain kids literally can’t function right now and disrupt the entire classroom for others. They are in deep need of services, but schools lack the capacities to give them. Some students really need daily therapy to improve, schools are not able to provide such services forcing admin and teachers to become armchair therapists. Most staff are poorly skilled for this and lack the time needed. This obviously dilutes the main educational mission of education for the majority of the student body.
I hear people claim this but none of my kids have experienced this at their schools so I feel these issues are being exaggerated. The problem to me is more they are so focused on closing the gap and all the other non-school issues that actual education never happens for most kids.
My child has. This year and last year. Children so disruptive, with paraeducators in and out of the class. It disrupts the classroom experience completely.
Anonymous wrote:It's not in a steep decline. It hit rock bottom a while ago.
As much as I'd like to agree, mcps can and does continue to find ways to get worse.
Call it like it is. Wolffe and McKnight are in charge and no one can tell them differently. It's nice to be King.
We need new leadership in MCPS and the BOE who care about "Equality" (equal application of resources to all students) over "Equity" (some are more equal than others), Education and Security over Restorative Justice, and Fundamentals (renovations, school supplies) over pet projects (Leader in Me, Smartboards that aren't used, Kid Museum only for a select few). Until Wolffe is out, McKnight can't be fired and Wolffe was just re-elected by a hairline margin.
Agreed.
The “Five things to know” emails are shameful and show the lack of focus. Narcan in schools now accepted? It is sick we are at this level. Focus on education, discipline, civics. Enough.
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