Shortage of "economically attractive" men reason for marriage decline according to new study

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I read this when it first started but not the next 15 pages or so. Just a funny story. I have a very stable job and would be considered very well off in most of the country. Around here though, pretty average, just over 150K. I keep myself in relatively good shape and am an active parent to our children, do the coaching thing, help with chores, etc.

My wife and I were out at lunch one day and were seated next to two younger women who were talking loud enough to be overheard. Couldn't really be avoided, the seating was very close quarters. One had just broken up with a boyfriend I think, but the other did more of the talking. A lot of it revolved around wanting her boyfriend to get more serious with his life, stable job, etc. If I heard right, she and her parents had even found him a job but he wouldn't take it because they found it for him.

This woman was objectively good looking, nice features, the dress she was wearing was semi-modest and could have gotten her plenty of attention in any bar or club. I could not believe she had settled the way she sounded like she had.

I told my wife afterwards "Holy shit, I had no idea how much of a catch I am!" Simply by being an active, stable, okay looking guy. In fairness, my wife also has a very good job and is a very good parent, she is also very much a catch, but it was just shocking listening to these two talk. This thread reminded me of that lunch.

You married in your 20s? If you stayed single longer you would have seen the dating market flip dramatically in your 30s. Being a gentlemen, in decent shape and with a good job makes you stand out because almost all of those are married. My wife and I separated for a brief period of time and I was drowning in women during the break.

I think this video describes your situation: (Holderness family) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5uMMsIYRKA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

And you sound like you know some subpar women if you or that PP thinks all women marry men just for the money.

I was being somewhat sarcastic in my response to the post about how men are tired of being a meal ticket to women.

My DH pulls his weight and then some. I make about the same as he does.

[Anonymous]

Ironically, this results in both ambitious, careerist women and low status men having a lower fertility rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

And you sound like you know some subpar women if you or that PP thinks all women marry men just for the money.

I was being somewhat sarcastic in my response to the post about how men are tired of being a meal ticket to women.

My DH pulls his weight and then some. I make about the same as he does.

Its about being a good husband, good father and good provider. My bad for quoting the meal ticket part, it was your response that I was after.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

And you sound like you know some subpar women if you or that PP thinks all women marry men just for the money.

I was being somewhat sarcastic in my response to the post about how men are tired of being a meal ticket to women.

My DH pulls his weight and then some. I make about the same as he does.

Its about being a good husband, good father and good provider. My bad for quoting the meal ticket part, it was your response that I was after.

No kidding. That's what women are saying on here.. that they want a good father and good provider, but there is a dearth of them. Most men don't do much childcare or house chores. Studies after studies have shown this. And if a woman can't find a man who is willing to be an equal partner in this regard, then at the least he could do is bring home the bacon so the wife could take on the role of a default parent without having to also take on the role of primary bread winner.

A PP stated that women were just after a meal ticket. I was responding to that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:These are InCel White men. Yes, they are very unattractive as mates, sexual partners or even marriage partners.

I guess they need to hit the community college instead of the gunrange?

Try getting off Reddit and 4chan. Most of us are not particularly interested in whatever arcane argument you're having over there

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

And you sound like you know some subpar women if you or that PP thinks all women marry men just for the money.

I was being somewhat sarcastic in my response to the post about how men are tired of being a meal ticket to women.

My DH pulls his weight and then some. I make about the same as he does.

Its about being a good husband, good father and good provider. My bad for quoting the meal ticket part, it was your response that I was after.

No kidding. That's what women are saying on here.. that they want a good father and good provider, but there is a dearth of them. Most men don't do much childcare or house chores. Studies after studies have shown this. And if a woman can't find a man who is willing to be an equal partner in this regard, then at the least he could do is bring home the bacon so the wife could take on the role of a default parent without having to also take on the role of primary bread winner.

A PP stated that women were just after a meal ticket. I was responding to that.

There are solid men out there. Find them and avoid the losers. And if you have sons, push them, push them hard. Moms that let their sons slide do no one any favors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You married in your 20s? If you stayed single longer you would have seen the dating market flip dramatically in your 30s. Being a gentlemen, in decent shape and with a good job makes you stand out because almost all of those are married. My wife and I separated for a brief period of time and I was drowning in women during the break.

Yes, we were both in our mid 20's, but I have no regrets. I'm happy with the choice we made.

Anonymous wrote:I think this video describes your situation: (Holderness family) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5uMMsIYRKA

I'm the original person you quoted, the one who told the restaurant story. I *think* this is a compliment? Thanks....maybe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is definitely a thing that’s happening in small town America. The men are mostly NEET’s, or they have some dead end retail job or just do odd jobs here and there. The women see them (rightfully, IMO) as basically children, just another mouth to feed and support financially. A lot of them who are married or partnered will basically just quit working while the women work full time and also raise kids. Women would rather be single moms than married to a man-baby.

It’s like a woman without a vagina!!

Who would marry a bum without a vagina?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

My DH is all of the above but makes very little money as a teacher. You might want to park some of your arrogance about what high earning means. High competence is not exclusive to people earning $1million. Would love to know what noble, selfless profession you are in. Most men earning that amount are status seekers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is there has always been a shortage, but now women don’t need to rely on a man to survive. Easier to work than be married to a loser.

This

This. I’m a single mom making $275k. Yes f I wanted another dependent, I’d have another child. Very few men make the same salary as me, which is fine for lasting or long term relationships, but I’m not marrying financially down.

So if you started dating a super attractive, fit, kind, intelligent, funny man who happened to make 50-100k, you would turn down a proposal?

lol i would absolutely turn that down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The next sexual revolution will be in our households. Women need to demand equal partners. I’m a millennial and I do feel like my generation was better at picking equal partners. I passed on so many scrubs. I married an equal partner who does chores, cooks and cares for our kids equally.

No scrubs

No offense but equal partner means NOT A HIGH EARNER. And a lot of women aren't looking for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ladies, we are done being your meal ticket. Get a job like every adult.

Men, we are tired of taking care of a man/child AND our children AND working FT. Clean up after yourself, and take care of your children as well without another adult telling you or reminding you what needs doing. Yes, kids need more than junk food, shelter and clothing.. if you even pay attention to their clothing.

You sound like you know some sub optimal men.

I am not perfect but -
As far as being a husband goes: I am respectful (WE split responsibilities), I pay attention, I am fit, I am funny, and my wife's happiness matters very much to me.
As far as being a dad goes: I am very engaged in my 3 kids lives now and from the day each was born, including doing most of the doc visits, staying up late at night when they were
infants and now helping with homework, coaching, and car pooling.
As far as being a provider, my income ranges from the high 800s to 1.4 per year and, while it involves travel and some very busy periods, such things are manageable.

My efforts buy me space when my wife wants to assert her opinion about doing things "the right way" (which is really just her way) because she knows I am no man child fudging it (she also likes how I turned out so when I press our son in a particular way that would not have occurred to her, she is aware I have a thoughtful basis.)

And most, if not all of my friends, are just like me.

There is a great expression: if you want to get something done, ask a busy person to do it. The same thing applies here: competence flows across various things. It is a product of energy, intelligence, engagement and commitment. If you know men who lack such capabilities, avoid. If you know men who have them but only focus them on selfish pursuits, avoid. If you find one and see him execute at a high level, proceed (and try to limit the momsplaining, good dad's don't need too much of it.)

My DH is all of the above but makes very little money as a teacher. You might want to park some of your arrogance about what high earning means. High competence is not exclusive to people earning $1million. Would love to know what noble, selfless profession you are in. Most men earning that amount are status seekers.

If pp is real I am just dying to know what kind of job gets you a 7 figure income while giving you so much personal time and flexibility that you can car pool, coach, and help with homework on a daily basis..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Over the last few years, I have witnessed a trend that is very surprising to me: ridiculously well compensated men who have some how achieved the ability to get MORE time with their families at the height of their careers. I am talking managing partners of major law firms, developers, high end lobbyists, CEOs of mid sized businesses and large publicly traded ones - all making seven figures and up - who are simply AROUND for their kids. Coaching, volunteering, attending games, taking sons and daughters on trips, driving them to and from stuff. All very successful men who absolutely make time above and beyond the norm to be present for their kids. They all also appear to have strong marriages and do a lot of things with their wives. I am sure they all have help to take a lot of the running around out of their lives and to get chores done but they don't appear to use the time saved for more work or golf or what have you. The new "goal" for the DC super achievers that I know is to use their time well with their families, careers, communities and their hobbies. These are not man-children at all.

This has been my experience as well. My husband does reasonably well financially (~750k) but more importantly, he has a very flexible job where he can come and go pretty much as he wants. He's leaving today at 3 to take one of our kids to the doctor. He doesn't coach but he makes every game, does pick up from most practices, attends ALL of their school stuff with me in the middle of the day.

If your prioritize your family, you'll find a way to make it work. That's all there is to it.

This is my husband to a T. 34 yr old equity partner. I thank instagram for making it cool to show you are out having experiences with your family.