Jews with Christmas/Holiday trees

[Anonymous]

What's the position on snowmen, or mistletoe?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's the position on snowmen, or mistletoe?

Or what about Christmas music? Irving Berlin wrote some pretty great Christmas music and he was a good Jewish boy.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It would seem that Jews want to have a tree for the shallowest if reasons......envy.

One more time, most Jews dont want to have a tree.

That wasn’t the impression I got from the posters on this very thread.

Hmmm, you wouldnt have guessed that a thread about Jews with christmas trees might attract a statistically non representative group of posters? Not be racist but this sure don't sound like a "yiddishe kopf".

Interesting point but no, I think it would attract an equal number of Jews opposed to the practice.

[Anonymous]

As this article points out, in the 19th century, many Germanic Jews celebrated Christmas as a secular holiday. When you combine that with the non-Christian origins of a Christmas tree, I really see no problems with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.myjewishlearning.com/rabbis-without-borders/why-im-not-afraid-of-natalie-portmans-christmas-tree/amp/

[Anonymous]

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Plus, the point is, to many Jews, telling us to just have a Christmas tree because it's secular is no different from telling us to celebrate Christmas or celebrate Christ. For some reason this is seems very hard for non-Jews to understand. It is very obvious to me and the other Jewish posters on here, however. So thanks to the PP above for the flip answer. "The problem" is exactly this -- we don't want to celebrate Christmas, and claiming that Christmas traditions are not really Christian, but pagan, doesn't change that. Also, turning a Christmas tree into a Hanukkah tree fools no one.

For the n-th time: No one is telling you to have a tree. They are telling you your outrage when non-christians do is wrong.

I have never expressed outrage that gentile agnostics (or Hindus or whatever) have trees. And while its difficult to be sure in an anon forum, I am quite sure that no other Jew is doing so.

What bothers us are people trying to say that as Jews we should not have issues with another Jew having a tree. We do have such issues and with good reason, and debating the details of ancient Roman saturnalia is neither here nor there.

That is your problem and your problem alone! You do not speak for other Jews. Who made you God? Your problem is that you want to control other Jews. It is not your right or any of your business as to what other Jews do. Please cease with the guilt tripping and bullying! Also, not every Jew is walking around with hatred in their hearts for Christians and things that happened centuries ago. Not all Jews have anonmosity against Jews who have Christmas trees.

[Anonymous]

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I don't know where you live but if you go to any church the christmas tree will be present and the services will focus on the true meaning of christmas, which is not the santa in the mall. Again, why the intensity of you effort to turn christmas into some sort of non-demonitational holiday? Is it simply to make you feel better about having a tree in your home?

First, I don't care what goes in any church. Mine had fish symbols in it also, does that mean we should be offended by Bass Pro Shops?

There is no intensity on this side to turn christmas into anything. It can be means what it means to you and exactly zero non-religious people will take any issue with it. But it is your side that is saying non-religious people should not put up a tree or celebrate the season. One side is intolerant despite the fact they they are guilty of exactly what they accuse others of.

Get it, now? Finally?

Different poster here. I don't care what non-religious people do. What I find annoying -- not offensive, but annoying -- is people who keep claiming that Christmas is secular and therefore Jews should celebrate it as a secular or American holiday. If Christmas can be whatever it means, then I wish those posters (who may not be you) would understand that to most Jews, at least any who were raised with any religious or traditional fervor, Christmas means Christ. Even if the actual celebration for many people means Santa. Because Christmas means Christ, and Jews don't do Christ, Jews don't do Christmas. It's pretty simple.

NP. LOL. Nobody here said Jews should celebrate Christmas. The only people who even care whether a Jew has a Christmas tree are other Jews.

+1

[Anonymous]

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Different poster here. I don't care what non-religious people do. What I find annoying -- not offensive, but annoying -- is people who keep claiming that Christmas is secular and therefore Jews should celebrate it as a secular or American holiday. If Christmas can be whatever it means, then I wish those posters (who may not be you) would understand that to most Jews, at least any who were raised with any religious or traditional fervor, Christmas means Christ. Even if the actual celebration for many people means Santa. Because Christmas means Christ, and Jews don't do Christ, Jews don't do Christmas. It's pretty simple.

Well that will be news to all the people insisting that Jews do Christ.

Which, as far as I can tell, is exactly zero people.

Not sure what the problem is, still.

There is an entire industry of people trying to get Jews to 'do' Christ.

Plus, the point is, to many Jews, telling us to just have a Christmas tree because it's secular is no different from telling us to celebrate Christmas or celebrate Christ. For some reason this is seems very hard for non-Jews to understand. It is very obvious to me and the other Jewish posters on here, however. So thanks to the PP above for the flip answer. "The problem" is exactly this -- we don't want to celebrate Christmas, and claiming that Christmas traditions are not really Christian, but pagan, doesn't change that. Also, turning a Christmas tree into a Hanukkah tree fools no one.

No one on this thread was telling Jews to have a Christmas tree. A Jewish person wants a Christmas tree and other Jews objected saying Christmas trees are about Jesus. Christians and others chimed in and said, based on their experience, it's transitioned into something more about Santa and gifts, not about Jesus. I'm willing to bet no non-Jew on this thread is telling Jews to have a Christmas tree. The only Christian that seemed to care if Jews had a Christmas tree was the "cultural appropriation" one who found Jews having Christmas trees offensive.

[Anonymous]

Jews should also totally celebrate Easter. I mean, the last supper was Seder! Nobody believes that pagan resurrection myth crap! Medieval Christians were just having a good laugh when they joshed about Jews kidnapping children and using their blood for those silly matzah crackers and such just before pagan Easter. Programs-schmograms!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jews should also totally celebrate Easter. I mean, the last supper was Seder! Nobody believes that pagan resurrection myth crap! Medieval Christians were just having a good laugh when they joshed about Jews kidnapping children and using their blood for those silly matzah crackers and such just before pagan Easter. Programs-schmograms!

+1. I totally agree. Why let the goyim have all the fun with the egg hunts. We will just dye ours blue and silver to acknowledge our roots. And that lunar new year festival looks fun as well.....let’s get in on that as well. We will just use gold colored envelopes instead of red because we’re Jews!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jews should also totally celebrate Easter. I mean, the last supper was Seder! Nobody believes that pagan resurrection myth crap! Medieval Christians were just having a good laugh when they joshed about Jews kidnapping children and using their blood for those silly matzah crackers and such just before pagan Easter. Programs-schmograms!

+1. I totally agree. Why let the goyim have all the fun with the egg hunts. We will just dye ours blue and silver to acknowledge our roots. And that lunar new year festival looks fun as well.....let’s get in on that as well. We will just use gold colored envelopes instead of red because we’re Jews!

Not equivalent at all ....

[Anonymous]

Sounds to me like you spend a lot of effort into shunning everything from the outside culture into your lives.
I feel fortunate to have the freedom to enjoy Chinese New year and Diwali, Irish dancing and samba
I once got invited to an eid festival

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As this article points out, in the 19th century, many Germanic Jews celebrated Christmas as a secular holiday. When you combine that with the non-Christian origins of a Christmas tree, I really see no problems with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.myjewishlearning.com/rabbis-without-borders/why-im-not-afraid-of-natalie-portmans-christmas-tree/amp/

Exactly, absolutely nothing happened in Germany, say, in the 20th century, of any importance at all - that should have should have any bearing whatsoever on Jewish identity...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As this article points out, in the 19th century, many Germanic Jews celebrated Christmas as a secular holiday. When you combine that with the non-Christian origins of a Christmas tree, I really see no problems with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.myjewishlearning.com/rabbis-without-borders/why-im-not-afraid-of-natalie-portmans-christmas-tree/amp/

Exactly, absolutely nothing happened in Germany, say, in the 20th century, of any importance at all - that should have should have any bearing whatsoever on Jewish identity...

What does that have to do with the practices of Germanic Jews in the 19th Century?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sounds to me like you spend a lot of effort into shunning everything from the outside culture into your lives.
I feel fortunate to have the freedom to enjoy Chinese New year and Diwali, Irish dancing and samba
I once got invited to an eid festival

Exactly. If you have no background in those cultures, it would seem a little random to me, but if you do have family history (like we do, being half-Catholic), why not celebrate your ancestry?

Otherwise, I see no problem in accepting invitations to help others celebrate their holidays. I've been Eid celebrations and would love to celebrate Diwali--it seems really fun.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As this article points out, in the 19th century, many Germanic Jews celebrated Christmas as a secular holiday. When you combine that with the non-Christian origins of a Christmas tree, I really see no problems with it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.myjewishlearning.com/rabbis-without-borders/why-im-not-afraid-of-natalie-portmans-christmas-tree/amp/

Lol....why are you so determined to justify your tree? If you want a tree, get a tree. You obviously have some level of discomfort or you wouldn’t be frantically searching for some obscure precedent.