Travel Soccer teams around NOVA let's discuss

[Anonymous]

^^ and I meant part of the reason you still have good players in house is that some parents resist travel at first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VYS has a well-intended philosophy of developing players and teaching confidence with the ball, but in practice we're seeing a lost generation of boys travel players who barely know what it's like to win a game. Maybe a technical and tactical approach that takes years and years and years to bear fruit is fine for a high-flying club like Pateadores that has continuity and large player pools but not for our little local club where players come and go. Someone needs to ask if our approach to player development is ever going to work. It's tough out there for these VYS teams that concede 6 or 7 goals in one game. You feel sorry for the players and wonder if their fun is being sacrificed for a seemingly good idea (that player development is more important than winning) that has been taken too far.

I have seen the boys team for the past 10+ years. Vienna is no "little local club", it is larger than most clubs in northern Virginia, including their immediate neighbor McLean. I will agree that the philosophy in use is a problem, and that there have been many lost generations of travel players from vienna. I do not agree that they are teaching confidence with the ball or really developing players. If that was their philosophy and they were any good at it you would see solid technical players that could beat a defender on the dribble and create space with their feet. That's not what you see when you watch them play - you see very direct play (long passes forward, players looking to get the ball away) and very few players with any ability on the ball.

So either VYS is not doing a good job of implementing their philosophy, or the trainer/patent coach dynamic is creating the wrong environment (trainers teaching skills, parents telling them to play direct in games), but you can't put the blame on the player pool. They have one of the bigger and more athletic player pools in nova. They just don't do anything with them.

Hard to say. To some extent, they're playing catch-up, at least on the boys side. Eddie's programs are new, and they start with the youngest kids.

They sometimes put teams in a position where they're going to be at a competitive disadvantage. Crossover is a perfect example -- while some clubs have tryouts and take only one team of All-Stars that trains together all season, they take anyone who signs up and then splits up that pool randomly. They get crushed in the fall season and catch up a bit in the spring.

I can tell you the U9 boys are quite good. Even after taking five travel teams, we still have solid players in the House league.

VYS is pretty deep -- their #3 or #4 teams often do really well in ODSL. But on the boys side, they often don't have that elite team. A big reason for that: Eddie is loathe to recruit outside Vienna. And most people are OK with that. It's a community club that produces some good teams and the occasional really good (Colonial League level) team.

1. U9 boys may be good, but part of the reason you still have good kids in travel is that many parents resist travel, at least initially. When you're taking 5 teams of kids (what is that, 60 kids need to play at a higher level?) you're getting a lot of chaff with that wheat. Sorry, but I've seen the teams and it's true. You could probably scoop the top 24 off and have the really good athletes. Expect re-sorting as more of the kids who didn't tryout at first join and become quickly better than the current C,D and E teams. I have seen all-star house teams beat VYS travel teams.

2. Which means absolutely nothing as ODSL is a glorified house league, or as one of our high soccer players put it, a league for kids who are mediocre at soccer. Sorry if that bursts some bubbles, but it true. Most of the decent ODSL teams are getting moved up to NCSL anyway, as leagues like CCL continue to gut NCSL.

Believe it or not, there are good players in House who didn't make travel teams. (Not that the decisions were always perfect.)

You're right about ODSL - I've seen some really, really bad teams in that league, and VYS has pushed a couple of teams to NCSL and WAGS instead.

I still think the CCL concept is one of the silliest things I've seen in youth soccer. It's designed so coaches and TDs can see their top kids in one spot. It's not designed for parents' convenience (lots of driving) or player development (team not doing well? Time to recruit!).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:VYS is pretty deep -- their #3 or #4 teams often do really well in ODSL. But on the boys side, they often don't have that elite team. A big reason for that: Eddie is loathe to recruit outside Vienna. And most people are OK with that. It's a community club that produces some good teams and the occasional really good (Colonial League level) team.

For anyone considering VYS, this is what they have to brag about - how good some of their teams do in ODSL. And it's not that Vienna doesn't recruit, it's that they have nothing to sell, because good players don't go to a club that can only point to their ODSL prowess, and oh yeah, that one time they had a team make Colonial League. And that won't change, as VYS does not support its top teams. But if you're from Vienna, want a solid travel experience and maybe win a low-level tournament every couple of years, it's perfect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VYS is pretty deep -- their #3 or #4 teams often do really well in ODSL. But on the boys side, they often don't have that elite team. A big reason for that: Eddie is loathe to recruit outside Vienna. And most people are OK with that. It's a community club that produces some good teams and the occasional really good (Colonial League level) team.

For anyone considering VYS, this is what they have to brag about - how good some of their teams do in ODSL. And it's not that Vienna doesn't recruit, it's that they have nothing to sell, because good players don't go to a club that can only point to their ODSL prowess, and oh yeah, that one time they had a team make Colonial League. And that won't change, as VYS does not support its top teams. But if you're from Vienna, want a solid travel experience and maybe win a low-level tournament every couple of years, it's perfect.

Once upon a time not so long ago, a lot of very good players went to VYS travel because they lived in Vienna and wanted to play for their local league and their parents didn't want things to get completely out of control at age 8. I still think a lot of people, maybe even the majority feel this way. And frankly, except for a very small minority of players, this is just fine. Why get on the 495 and fight traffic with your third grader to drive to Arlington or Annandale or Braddock Road or Bethesda? What a slog! None of these kids are going to be hurt by the VYS Academy experience if they have talent. You can always move them to a more competitive league if you want to when they're older and it might matter or when they're actually recruited away because an actual coach (not the parent) thinks they can compete at a higher level.

I've had two kids play for Vienna. One is pre-Academy and has been on the same team since he was 8. The only kids who have left that team, have left soccer. A few of the kids could probably play somewhere more competitive, but they would rather stay with the team. And now they're actually pretty good. Given that most kids will never play soccer past high school, I think it sad that more kids can't have this experience. Perhaps I'm naïve, but it just seems that all this stressing and positioning and club-shopping and club-hopping is unnecessary and very parent driven. Would be nice to see more kids able to just play locally as opposed to being swapped around like a mini-Premier League.

And yes, to a PP's point, I think all this CCL, ECNL, elite league nonsense that's slicing and dicing the current leagues for supposed competitive reasons, is ridiculous too.

[Anonymous]

A few points:

VYS: doesn't do a good job of teaching their players. They have enough athletes to compete, but they don't improve year over year. Whether they are not taught the right things or the right philosophy is there and just the implementation is bad, I don't know. I do know they should be far better than they are. You can talk about "not recruiting", but really the pp above is right - there is nothing to sell. Some VYS families leave if they have an older kid or family friend with kids in another club with better training.

CCL: is a great idea from a number of angles. Put the best coaches with the best players, have them travel and play as a club, guest players between ages, and club coaches and technical directors can observe all the teams. Lack of promotion/relegation allows less crazy movement when a Division 1 team gets put to division 2 for a season, takes the importance off of winning just to stay up.

Where CCL struggles, in my opinion, is getting the message out and having an educated audience. Right now most parents haven't played soccer, much less at a high level or with an understanding of youth development. They don't know what the game should look like at young ages, they don't know what the training sessions should look like, and they don't know what techniques should be taught. So anyone can come to them and sell them a story's, tell them they are following USSF guidelines, and the parents don't know any better. Meanwhile the kids are left in a situation where they aren't getting the development and experience in the sport they deserve. The pay to play model offers a lot of opportunity for exploitation, especially in an area like this where there are so many egos and tiny clubs that only want to look out for themselves, rather than the players.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VYS is pretty deep -- their #3 or #4 teams often do really well in ODSL. But on the boys side, they often don't have that elite team. A big reason for that: Eddie is loathe to recruit outside Vienna. And most people are OK with that. It's a community club that produces some good teams and the occasional really good (Colonial League level) team.

For anyone considering VYS, this is what they have to brag about - how good some of their teams do in ODSL. And it's not that Vienna doesn't recruit, it's that they have nothing to sell, because good players don't go to a club that can only point to their ODSL prowess, and oh yeah, that one time they had a team make Colonial League. And that won't change, as VYS does not support its top teams. But if you're from Vienna, want a solid travel experience and maybe win a low-level tournament every couple of years, it's perfect.

Once upon a time not so long ago, a lot of very good players went to VYS travel because they lived in Vienna and wanted to play for their local league and their parents didn't want things to get completely out of control at age 8. I still think a lot of people, maybe even the majority feel this way. And frankly, except for a very small minority of players, this is just fine. Why get on the 495 and fight traffic with your third grader to drive to Arlington or Annandale or Braddock Road or Bethesda? What a slog! None of these kids are going to be hurt by the VYS Academy experience if they have talent. You can always move them to a more competitive league if you want to when they're older and it might matter or when they're actually recruited away because an actual coach (not the parent) thinks they can compete at a higher level.

I've had two kids play for Vienna. One is pre-Academy and has been on the same team since he was 8. The only kids who have left that team, have left soccer. A few of the kids could probably play somewhere more competitive, but they would rather stay with the team. And now they're actually pretty good. Given that most kids will never play soccer past high school, I think it sad that more kids can't have this experience. Perhaps I'm naïve, but it just seems that all this stressing and positioning and club-shopping and club-hopping is unnecessary and very parent driven. Would be nice to see more kids able to just play locally as opposed to being swapped around like a mini-Premier League.

And yes, to a PP's point, I think all this CCL, ECNL, elite league nonsense that's slicing and dicing the current leagues for supposed competitive reasons, is ridiculous too.

But ... but ... that means your kids may only be playing in NCSL Div 3! Don't you realize that if you drive 45 minutes each way three times a week, you can go to another club that might have a team in NCSL Div 2? Why would you short-change your kids that way?! If they're not playing at least NCSL Div 2, they will flunk out of college, never marry, live at home until they're 40 and contract Type I AND Type II diabetes?

In fact, what you should REALLY do is try out for at least six different clubs so you have a chance of squeaking onto an NCSL Div 1 team or maybe even a CCL team. That way, you can have road games in Richmond in which your team wins 8-1 while your son plays about 5 minutes. It's worth it because you'll be able to say you play in CCL!

Actually, if you REALLY cared about your kids, you'd move to California, where a lot of clubs play in elite leagues that send kids to nationals. If you're not playing at least six showcase tournaments a year, your kids will never amount to anything.

In fact, scratch all that. You HAVE to move to Europe and make sure your kid gets in the Academy of a pro club, so they can really focus on soccer. If they wash out of the Academy at age 14, just cast them aside and concentrate on your next kid.

My kids are only in ODSL right now, but that's just because the coaches are idiots who don't realize how much we've spent on private coaches. Next year, they'll be on Region I Premier League teams for sure, if not at D.C. United. If D.C. United won't take them by age 14, we'll just have them play for Barcelona.

And here you are, thinking you should just have a good experience playing soccer with the local team as part of a well-rounded childhood. You make me sick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A few points:

VYS: doesn't do a good job of teaching their players. They have enough athletes to compete, but they don't improve year over year. Whether they are not taught the right things or the right philosophy is there and just the implementation is bad, I don't know. I do know they should be far better than they are. You can talk about "not recruiting", but really the pp above is right - there is nothing to sell. Some VYS families leave if they have an older kid or family friend with kids in another club with better training.

CCL: is a great idea from a number of angles. Put the best coaches with the best players, have them travel and play as a club, guest players between ages, and club coaches and technical directors can observe all the teams. Lack of promotion/relegation allows less crazy movement when a Division 1 team gets put to division 2 for a season, takes the importance off of winning just to stay up.

Where CCL struggles, in my opinion, is getting the message out and having an educated audience. Right now most parents haven't played soccer, much less at a high level or with an understanding of youth development. They don't know what the game should look like at young ages, they don't know what the training sessions should look like, and they don't know what techniques should be taught. So anyone can come to them and sell them a story's, tell them they are following USSF guidelines, and the parents don't know any better. Meanwhile the kids are left in a situation where they aren't getting the development and experience in the sport they deserve. The pay to play model offers a lot of opportunity for exploitation, especially in an area like this where there are so many egos and tiny clubs that only want to look out for themselves, rather than the players.

CCL is ALL about ego. Promotion/relegation simply lets teams play with other teams on the same level, as it should be. If your CCL team is getting blown out, it's going to just recruit new players, and then the whole concept of developing within the club is shot. I've seen parents get sold a bill of goods on the concept of taking both kids to the same place on the same day, but then what happens when one of those kids gets bumped down to the B team?

In the meantime, CCL teams are driving, driving, driving. Instead of playing a team that's 20 minutes away, they're playing one that's 90 minutes away.

Unless you're part of the 0.1 percent good enough to play Developmental Academy, ECNL, Premier League or Colonial League, just play in your local club. You're not missing out on anything.

As for VYS -- you can argue about how well they're developing players. One thing you can't argue is that they are looking out for players, not just themselves. It's a community club that serves the needs of 98 percent of the players in the region, and if the training programs start bearing fruit, they'll serve another 1.9 percent. They don't want to cut Vienna kids to bring in Annandale kids. They're putting in programs for U9 and U10 House players so they can keep developing and perhaps make Travel at later ages.

If people feel better about themselves because their team beat Vienna's team, fine. What are you doing in the same division, anyway, if your club is so much better?

[Anonymous]

Charging the same amount for an inferior product is not "serving the other 99%". Fields and leagues are very inexpensive, at the travel level you are paying for training and club admin. In VYS that training is of a vastly different quality compared to other clubs for the same price. There is no reason the training at VYSA should be inferior to other similar sized or smaller clubs - Arlington, BRYC, McLean, etc. it doesn't matter the league affiliation - VYS has the player pool to be competitive, but not the training and skill. It's very disappointing. I live in vienna and don't look forward to having to drive to a more distant club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Charging the same amount for an inferior product is not "serving the other 99%". Fields and leagues are very inexpensive, at the travel level you are paying for training and club admin. In VYS that training is of a vastly different quality compared to other clubs for the same price. There is no reason the training at VYSA should be inferior to other similar sized or smaller clubs - Arlington, BRYC, McLean, etc. it doesn't matter the league affiliation - VYS has the player pool to be competitive, but not the training and skill. It's very disappointing. I live in vienna and don't look forward to having to drive to a more distant club.

You are way overthinking this -- or you've got something in for VYS, which is not inferior and often less expensive then other clubs. Either way, you don't sound very well-informed. Unless someone has recruited your kid, he/she is better off locally. Trust me, if they're any good, one of these clubs you hold in such high esteem will come looking for them. Then you can start commuting all over for practices and games. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of Vienna kids leave for more impressive pastures and come creeping back when they're relegated to the C or D team at these vaunted clubs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:VYS is pretty deep -- their #3 or #4 teams often do really well in ODSL. But on the boys side, they often don't have that elite team. A big reason for that: Eddie is loathe to recruit outside Vienna. And most people are OK with that. It's a community club that produces some good teams and the occasional really good (Colonial League level) team.

For anyone considering VYS, this is what they have to brag about - how good some of their teams do in ODSL. And it's not that Vienna doesn't recruit, it's that they have nothing to sell, because good players don't go to a club that can only point to their ODSL prowess, and oh yeah, that one time they had a team make Colonial League. And that won't change, as VYS does not support its top teams. But if you're from Vienna, want a solid travel experience and maybe win a low-level tournament every couple of years, it's perfect.

Once upon a time not so long ago, a lot of very good players went to VYS travel because they lived in Vienna and wanted to play for their local league and their parents didn't want things to get completely out of control at age 8. I still think a lot of people, maybe even the majority feel this way. And frankly, except for a very small minority of players, this is just fine. Why get on the 495 and fight traffic with your third grader to drive to Arlington or Annandale or Braddock Road or Bethesda? What a slog! None of these kids are going to be hurt by the VYS Academy experience if they have talent. You can always move them to a more competitive league if you want to when they're older and it might matter or when they're actually recruited away because an actual coach (not the parent) thinks they can compete at a higher level.

I've had two kids play for Vienna. One is pre-Academy and has been on the same team since he was 8. The only kids who have left that team, have left soccer. A few of the kids could probably play somewhere more competitive, but they would rather stay with the team. And now they're actually pretty good. Given that most kids will never play soccer past high school, I think it sad that more kids can't have this experience. Perhaps I'm naïve, but it just seems that all this stressing and positioning and club-shopping and club-hopping is unnecessary and very parent driven. Would be nice to see more kids able to just play locally as opposed to being swapped around like a mini-Premier League.

And yes, to a PP's point, I think all this CCL, ECNL, elite league nonsense that's slicing and dicing the current leagues for supposed competitive reasons, is ridiculous too.

But ... but ... that means your kids may only be playing in NCSL Div 3! Don't you realize that if you drive 45 minutes each way three times a week, you can go to another club that might have a team in NCSL Div 2? Why would you short-change your kids that way?! If they're not playing at least NCSL Div 2, they will flunk out of college, never marry, live at home until they're 40 and contract Type I AND Type II diabetes?

In fact, what you should REALLY do is try out for at least six different clubs so you have a chance of squeaking onto an NCSL Div 1 team or maybe even a CCL team. That way, you can have road games in Richmond in which your team wins 8-1 while your son plays about 5 minutes. It's worth it because you'll be able to say you play in CCL!

Actually, if you REALLY cared about your kids, you'd move to California, where a lot of clubs play in elite leagues that send kids to nationals. If you're not playing at least six showcase tournaments a year, your kids will never amount to anything.

In fact, scratch all that. You HAVE to move to Europe and make sure your kid gets in the Academy of a pro club, so they can really focus on soccer. If they wash out of the Academy at age 14, just cast them aside and concentrate on your next kid.

My kids are only in ODSL right now, but that's just because the coaches are idiots who don't realize how much we've spent on private coaches. Next year, they'll be on Region I Premier League teams for sure, if not at D.C. United. If D.C. United won't take them by age 14, we'll just have them play for Barcelona.

And here you are, thinking you should just have a good experience playing soccer with the local team as part of a well-rounded childhood. You make me sick.

You made my day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few points:

VYS: doesn't do a good job of teaching their players. They have enough athletes to compete, but they don't improve year over year. Whether they are not taught the right things or the right philosophy is there and just the implementation is bad, I don't know. I do know they should be far better than they are. You can talk about "not recruiting", but really the pp above is right - there is nothing to sell. Some VYS families leave if they have an older kid or family friend with kids in another club with better training.

CCL: is a great idea from a number of angles. Put the best coaches with the best players, have them travel and play as a club, guest players between ages, and club coaches and technical directors can observe all the teams. Lack of promotion/relegation allows less crazy movement when a Division 1 team gets put to division 2 for a season, takes the importance off of winning just to stay up.

Where CCL struggles, in my opinion, is getting the message out and having an educated audience. Right now most parents haven't played soccer, much less at a high level or with an understanding of youth development. They don't know what the game should look like at young ages, they don't know what the training sessions should look like, and they don't know what techniques should be taught. So anyone can come to them and sell them a story's, tell them they are following USSF guidelines, and the parents don't know any better. Meanwhile the kids are left in a situation where they aren't getting the development and experience in the sport they deserve. The pay to play model offers a lot of opportunity for exploitation, especially in an area like this where there are so many egos and tiny clubs that only want to look out for themselves, rather than the players.

CCL is ALL about ego. Promotion/relegation simply lets teams play with other teams on the same level, as it should be. If your CCL team is getting blown out, it's going to just recruit new players, and then the whole concept of developing within the club is shot. I've seen parents get sold a bill of goods on the concept of taking both kids to the same place on the same day, but then what happens when one of those kids gets bumped down to the B team?

In the meantime, CCL teams are driving, driving, driving. Instead of playing a team that's 20 minutes away, they're playing one that's 90 minutes away.

Unless you're part of the 0.1 percent good enough to play Developmental Academy, ECNL, Premier League or Colonial League, just play in your local club. You're not missing out on anything.

As for VYS -- you can argue about how well they're developing players. One thing you can't argue is that they are looking out for players, not just themselves. It's a community club that serves the needs of 98 percent of the players in the region, and if the training programs start bearing fruit, they'll serve another 1.9 percent. They don't want to cut Vienna kids to bring in Annandale kids. They're putting in programs for U9 and U10 House players so they can keep developing and perhaps make Travel at later ages.

If people feel better about themselves because their team beat Vienna's team, fine. What are you doing in the same division, anyway, if your club is so much better?[/quote]

So true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Charging the same amount for an inferior product is not "serving the other 99%". Fields and leagues are very inexpensive, at the travel level you are paying for training and club admin. In VYS that training is of a vastly different quality compared to other clubs for the same price. There is no reason the training at VYSA should be inferior to other similar sized or smaller clubs - Arlington, BRYC, McLean, etc. it doesn't matter the league affiliation - VYS has the player pool to be competitive, but not the training and skill. It's very disappointing. I live in vienna and don't look forward to having to drive to a more distant club.

You are way overthinking this -- or you've got something in for VYS, which is not inferior and often less expensive then other clubs. Either way, you don't sound very well-informed. Unless someone has recruited your kid, he/she is better off locally. Trust me, if they're any good, one of these clubs you hold in such high esteem will come looking for them. Then you can start commuting all over for practices and games. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of Vienna kids leave for more impressive pastures and come creeping back when they're relegated to the C or D team at these vaunted clubs.

i have coached travel at large and small clubs for many years (not my own kids, but as a paid coach), I have worked with coaches throughout the larger clubs. I have a pretty good idea of what is taught and how it manifests itself on the field. If calling me "not very well-informed" makes you feel better about your situation, good on you, but it's not the case. I have a vested interest in VYS getting their stuff together (because I live there), beyond that I have nothing "in" for them. I just don't equate being "there" as being good enough, especially for an organization with so much potential.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

CCL is ALL about ego. Promotion/relegation simply lets teams play with other teams on the same level, as it should be. If your CCL team is getting blown out, it's going to just recruit new players, and then the whole concept of developing within the club is shot. I've seen parents get sold a bill of goods on the concept of taking both kids to the same place on the same day, but then what happens when one of those kids gets bumped down to the B team? If the CCL concept is so bad, then why did WAGS start up its EPDL league based on the CCL model? Why did VYS sign up as a founding member? While the CCL concept isn't perfect, in concept or application, it's better than WAGS.

In the meantime, CCL teams are driving, driving, driving. Instead of playing a team that's 20 minutes away, they're playing one that's 90 minutes away. Once WAGS and NCSL starts tiering teams, then you're still driving far for some games. Maybe not as far as some CCL games, but still over an hour away.

Unless you're part of the 0.1 percent good enough to play Developmental Academy, ECNL, Premier League or Colonial League, just play in your local club. You're not missing out on anything. In terms of what level you'll ultimately play at, this is probably true for most players. But if you want value for your money and/or your kid to reach his potential, finding the right club does make a difference.

As for VYS -- you can argue about how well they're developing players. One thing you can't argue is that they are looking out for players, not just themselves. It's a community club that serves the needs of 98 percent of the players in the region, and if the training programs start bearing fruit, they'll serve another 1.9 percent. They don't want to cut Vienna kids to bring in Annandale kids. They're putting in programs for U9 and U10 House players so they can keep developing and perhaps make Travel at later ages. Keep kidding yourself but VYS will absolutely take players from other clubs and push down VYS players in order to make room. To your example, there's one team right now that has two players who were playing in Annandale jerseys this time last year.

If people feel better about themselves because their team beat Vienna's team, fine. What are you doing in the same division, anyway, if your club is so much better?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Charging the same amount for an inferior product is not "serving the other 99%". Fields and leagues are very inexpensive, at the travel level you are paying for training and club admin. In VYS that training is of a vastly different quality compared to other clubs for the same price. There is no reason the training at VYSA should be inferior to other similar sized or smaller clubs - Arlington, BRYC, McLean, etc. it doesn't matter the league affiliation - VYS has the player pool to be competitive, but not the training and skill. It's very disappointing. I live in vienna and don't look forward to having to drive to a more distant club.

You are way overthinking this -- or you've got something in for VYS, which is not inferior and often less expensive then other clubs. Either way, you don't sound very well-informed. Unless someone has recruited your kid, he/she is better off locally. Trust me, if they're any good, one of these clubs you hold in such high esteem will come looking for them. Then you can start commuting all over for practices and games. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of Vienna kids leave for more impressive pastures and come creeping back when they're relegated to the C or D team at these vaunted clubs.

i have coached travel at large and small clubs for many years (not my own kids, but as a paid coach), I have worked with coaches throughout the larger clubs. I have a pretty good idea of what is taught and how it manifests itself on the field. If calling me "not very well-informed" makes you feel better about your situation, good on you, but it's not the case. I have a vested interest in VYS getting their stuff together (because I live there), beyond that I have nothing "in" for them. I just don't equate being "there" as being good enough, especially for an organization with so much potential.

This is a great way to frame the issue, PP. I've found a lot of the discussion on this thread interesting, but my main take-away is that my family is fortunate to live in an area (Bethesda) where we have a soccer club that offers both convenient practice fields and a very high level of training.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Charging the same amount for an inferior product is not "serving the other 99%". Fields and leagues are very inexpensive, at the travel level you are paying for training and club admin. In VYS that training is of a vastly different quality compared to other clubs for the same price. There is no reason the training at VYSA should be inferior to other similar sized or smaller clubs - Arlington, BRYC, McLean, etc. it doesn't matter the league affiliation - VYS has the player pool to be competitive, but not the training and skill. It's very disappointing. I live in vienna and don't look forward to having to drive to a more distant club.

You are way overthinking this -- or you've got something in for VYS, which is not inferior and often less expensive then other clubs. Either way, you don't sound very well-informed. Unless someone has recruited your kid, he/she is better off locally. Trust me, if they're any good, one of these clubs you hold in such high esteem will come looking for them. Then you can start commuting all over for practices and games. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of Vienna kids leave for more impressive pastures and come creeping back when they're relegated to the C or D team at these vaunted clubs.

i have coached travel at large and small clubs for many years (not my own kids, but as a paid coach), I have worked with coaches throughout the larger clubs. I have a pretty good idea of what is taught and how it manifests itself on the field. If calling me "not very well-informed" makes you feel better about your situation, good on you, but it's not the case. I have a vested interest in VYS getting their stuff together (because I live there), beyond that I have nothing "in" for them. I just don't equate being "there" as being good enough, especially for an organization with so much potential.

Potential to do what?

(Reference to another post -- I have misgivings about VYS joining EPDL, too. At least it's only a couple of games on the side for now.)