Ax vs Ask

[Anonymous]

Wow, looks like the ONLY difference in opinion on this board is between those who understand what a regional dialect is and those who do not.

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

But I also think there are a number of people on here who seem to think that having language features that are different from the "norm" is deficient in some way. There have been studies that show people assume certain American regional accents indicate a speaker is less intelligent than they really are -- I believe Georgian (American south, not the Eastern European country!) accents are considered as giving the speaker the biggest perceived deficit in intelligence.

So, my question is, if you DC's teacher were a Georgia native, would you ask her to stop speaking in a Georgian accent around your DC so he/she wouldn't pick up a drawl? No, that would be silly, because clearly one should not be required to change their way of speaking to suit the wants of a parent in an area where that way of speaking is less "favored."

It's a question of whether "ax" is wrong and "ask" is right -- and the facts bear out that "ax" is a regional and social dialect that many people speak, and it's not wrong, per se. You can ask your DC not to use it, but to ask a stranger who grew up using it not to would be like asking anyone with regional quirks or accents to change to suit your needs -- very self-centered and a little frivolous, and ultimately sort of mean-spirited.

I am sure we, on this board, all have silly regionalisms. I sometimes say "warsh" (when my guard is down!), but I would hate to think someone thought it indicated anything more than where I grew up (and when -- seems like fewer people say this these days -- only the old guard like me and Diane Rehm seem to say it!). It doesn't mean I'm intellectually inferior or would make a poor teacher!

[Anonymous]

Very well put, 10:45!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow, looks like the ONLY difference in opinion on this board is between those who understand what a regional dialect is and those who do not.

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

But I also think there are a number of people on here who seem to think that having language features that are different from the "norm" is deficient in some way.

Very well put, 10:45.

Hopefully those who are shrieking about vulgar language, the Great White Linguist, and being intellectually honest AA's can put on their thinking caps for just a moment so that they can read and understand your post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

Yes, it's really true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

Yes, it's really true.

"Dumbass"-spouting angry linguist PP here, and yes, I agree -- it's not that I am delusional and think /aks/ is going to be the better pronunciation to use at an interview or something. I just think the protestations that it's "improper" are completely off-base. It's perfectly fine for a person to use it if that's what their dialect is, and it's annoying to hear people saying it's "improper" like they are the Language Ministry decreeing from on high!

Just teach your own child what you want them to use. Also, consider that you may be able to helicopter mom your way into getting a teacher to change her dialect (which is SO wrong), but you'll never be able to control your child's friends' language use (and peer language use has more of an impact -- in the long run -- on how they'll end up speaking, anyway).

[Anonymous]

I'd just explain that some people say "ask" differently, but that more people say "ask". I'd continue to correct at home. The school system that you use does ot make the pronunciation of the word as "ask" a prerequisite for teaching. If you think it important enough, then work with the system to make something the school seeks to change or let it go. In business, I frankly tolerate the word "ax", but it puts me on edge every time I hear it as being incorrect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

Yes, it's really true.

"Dumbass"-spouting angry linguist PP here, and yes, I agree -- it's not that I am delusional and think /aks/ is going to be the better pronunciation to use at an interview or something. I just think the protestations that it's "improper" are completely off-base. It's perfectly fine for a person to use it if that's what their dialect is, and it's annoying to hear people saying it's "improper" like they are the Language Ministry decreeing from on high!

Just teach your own child what you want them to use. Also, consider that you may be able to helicopter mom your way into getting a teacher to change her dialect (which is SO wrong), but you'll never be able to control your child's friends' language use (and peer language use has more of an impact -- in the long run -- on how they'll end up speaking, anyway).

11:07 again -- Uh, yeah, pps, that is what the linguist has been saying all along. That is an uncontroversial position held by experts such as linguists. Have people generally been missing the important distinction she mentioned above? That saying "ask" will help a child's prospects but that doesn't mean it is intrinsically better than any other usage. All that means is that those in power, e.g., those who do the hiring, say "ask" and so your child would do well to say it the same way. But if ABC, NBC, Fox, CNN, CBS, and MSNBC news all decided tomorrow that their news anchors would say "aks" and the Presidents of all the Ivy League schools went along with them, well, your child better learn to say "aks."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

Yes, it's really true.

"Dumbass"-spouting angry linguist PP here, and yes, I agree -- it's not that I am delusional and think /aks/ is going to be the better pronunciation to use at an interview or something. I just think the protestations that it's "improper" are completely off-base. It's perfectly fine for a person to use it if that's what their dialect is, and it's annoying to hear people saying it's "improper" like they are the Language Ministry decreeing from on high!

Just teach your own child what you want them to use. Also, consider that you may be able to helicopter mom your way into getting a teacher to change her dialect (which is SO wrong), but you'll never be able to control your child's friends' language use (and peer language use has more of an impact -- in the long run -- on how they'll end up speaking, anyway).

No, no Don Quixote, it is but another windmill! You mustn't spend all your strength on it!

Your squire,

Sancho Panza

[Anonymous]

Don't make me ax you again, Sancho, give me mines lance so I may tilt at yon windmill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hard to believe so many people here are afraid to tell a teacher to pronounce a word in proper standard english.

They're not afraid. They just realize it's rude.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I think we are all agreeing that the more favored pronunciation of "ask" is generally advantageous to a child's future prospects. (Has anyone implied that it's not?)

Is this really true? Prior posters, what say you? My impression was that the Linguist Cabal sought to proffer evidence of the legitimacy of the use of "aks" and thus by implication would take issue with such a statement. If I'm wrong, then I stand corrected.

Yes, it's really true.

"Dumbass"-spouting angry linguist PP here, and yes, I agree -- it's not that I am delusional and think /aks/ is going to be the better pronunciation to use at an interview or something. I just think the protestations that it's "improper" are completely off-base. It's perfectly fine for a person to use it if that's what their dialect is, and it's annoying to hear people saying it's "improper" like they are the Language Ministry decreeing from on high!

Just teach your own child what you want them to use. Also, consider that you may be able to helicopter mom your way into getting a teacher to change her dialect (which is SO wrong), but you'll never be able to control your child's friends' language use (and peer language use has more of an impact -- in the long run -- on how they'll end up speaking, anyway).

11:07 again -- Uh, yeah, pps, that is what the linguist has been saying all along. That is an uncontroversial position held by experts such as linguists. Have people generally been missing the important distinction she mentioned above? That saying "ask" will help a child's prospects but that doesn't mean it is intrinsically better than any other usage. All that means is that those in power, e.g., those who do the hiring, say "ask" and so your child would do well to say it the same way. But if ABC, NBC, Fox, CNN, CBS, and MSNBC news all decided tomorrow that their news anchors would say "aks" and the Presidents of all the Ivy League schools went along with them, well, your child better learn to say "aks."

Uh oh! Does that mean I have to start teaching my kid to say "noo-cyoo-ler" instead of "nuclear"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Seriously, I think improper English should not be tolerated in an educator and she should be told that ax is wrong, so she won't continue to do it. It would be easy enough for her to change it. Otherwise, she's passing on bad usage to a generation of kids. What's the good in that?

Would you also not tell someone they had spinach in their teeth or had TP hanging out of their pants?

Please post here so we can know how that convo went. Anyone else interested in placing bets on it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'd just explain that some people say "ask" differently, but that more people say "ask". I'd continue to correct at home. The school system that you use does ot make the pronunciation of the word as "ask" a prerequisite for teaching. If you think it important enough, then work with the system to make something the school seeks to change or let it go. In business, I frankly tolerate the word "ax", but it puts me on edge every time I hear it as being incorrect.

Exactly. I cringe a bit when I hear "ax," but I don't make it a point of humiliating the speaker by correcting them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd just explain that some people say "ask" differently, but that more people say "ask". I'd continue to correct at home. The school system that you use does ot make the pronunciation of the word as "ask" a prerequisite for teaching. If you think it important enough, then work with the system to make something the school seeks to change or let it go. In business, I frankly tolerate the word "ax", but it puts me on edge every time I hear it as being incorrect.

Exactly. I cringe a bit when I hear "ax," but I don't make it a point of humiliating the speaker by correcting them.

Has it occurred to you that the person might be grateful? What if someone had spinach in their teeth, or TP hanging out of their pants.
Would you not tell them to spare humiliation?