Ax vs Ask

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only AA on this board who is intellectually honest enough to admit that to say "ax" when you mean "ask" is grammatically incorrect, and fair or unfair, is a burden in mainstream society.

No, you're not.

And nobody has addressed my point made pages and pages ago. I have never heard anyone pronounce it "aks" that doesn't also make many other grammatical errors in their speech, which I'd be inclined to think is a much larger problem for an elementary school teacher. OP's child can probably ignore the one word, but I'd be concerned about the rest of the teacher's speech patterns.

[Anonymous]

All I know is that at our Big 3 private, as far as I can tell, all the AA kids say "ask."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All I know is that at our Big 3 private, as far as I can tell, all the AA kids say "ask."

Well, I can't decide if that's more helpful than relevant or vice versa. Thanks, ever so!

[Anonymous]

I have never heard anyone pronounce it "aks" that doesn't also make many other grammatical errors in their speech,

Do you know any black people? I have plenty of friends who will say "ask" when they are really being conscious of their speech, but say /aks/ in normal conversation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only AA on this board who is intellectually honest enough to admit that to say "ax" when you mean "ask" is grammatically incorrect, and fair or unfair, is a burden in mainstream society.

You are one of several idiots who is missing the nuances of the discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only AA on this board who is intellectually honest enough to admit that to say "ax" when you mean "ask" is grammatically incorrect, and fair or unfair, is a burden in mainstream society.

You are one of several idiots who is missing the nuances of the discussion.

Nuance? Enlighten us. The only one trying to drive nuance into this is one angry poster with a huge linguistic chip on her shoulder.

[Anonymous]

PP, you're not alone. This AA understands exactly what you mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Am I the only AA on this board who is intellectually honest enough to admit that to say "ax" when you mean "ask" is grammatically incorrect, and fair or unfair, is a burden in mainstream society.

You are one of several idiots who is missing the nuances of the discussion.

Nuance? Enlighten us. The only one trying to drive nuance into this is one angry poster with a huge linguistic chip on her shoulder.

There are several posters in this thread who have explained the underlying issues of this discussion, but if you refer to a scientific field of study as a "huge linguistic chip on [the] shoulder," I don't think you're intellectually capable of participating in this debate.

Instead of asking someone to enlighten you, feel free to reread the last ten pages of this thread. Both sides of the debate have raised several issues and discussed them in-depth. If you still need someone to "enlighten" you after having read the past ten or so pages, please just find another thread to participate in, because you are hopelessly lost in this one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, you're not alone. This AA understands exactly what you mean.

Hey, c'mon now! The Great White Linguist has got this one for you.

Weaving the soft bigotry of low expections...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, you're not alone. This AA understands exactly what you mean.

Hey, c'mon now! The Great White Linguist has got this one for you.

Weaving the soft bigotry of low expections...

Sure, the linguist is the bigoted person in this discussion. Did she even mention her race?

Please read Lisa J. Green's African American English: a linguistic introduction. By dismissing AAVE as you have, you are showing your own bigotry. I hope you aren't a black person descended from American slaves. If you are, I'm sad that you don't know your own history.

[Anonymous]

Ok, I think I've had enough of being scolded by some pointy-head. Later.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ok, I think I've had enough of being scolded by some pointy-head. Later.

No, don't leave. With such mature, intelligent responses as "pointy-head," I'm sure you have many interesting points to add the discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hey dumbass, it's used VERY frequently in the rust belt, including where I grew up in PA (in an all white neighborhood. Hell, all-white county, pretty much). It's not just present in "ebonics"; the word features in many dialects.

And for those who are going on and on about "proper English," you don't sound educated -- quite the contrary, in fact. I have a grad degree in linguistics, and much like the PP waaaay at the beginning of the thread mentioned, /aks/ is a perfectly legitimate pronunciation for "ask." I'm sorry if you don't like that perfectly valid dialects of modern English exist, and I'm sorry if you've made up your mind to follow only proscriptive grammar rules, but "proper English" is a myth. Whatever the dominant socioeconomic class in a given region or at a given time determines is "proper" does not make it so. Other forms of expression and pronunciation have just as much right to exist and be used as the dialect of American English you choose to speak.

Now, the dialect of English your DC speaks can and does indicate the regional or cultural influences they experience. So, if you'd prefer to have them pronounce it /ask/, just tell your child so. No need to shit all over anyone else's dialect and pretend their way of speaking (and their background) is for some reason wholesale inferior to yours.

Hi.

When some of us questioned the credibility of the "ax as legitimate alternative pronunciation to ask"? It was only a matter of time before we were labelled racists. (Well, duh!)

In the meantime, the most "articulate" (a stretch) counterargument was attempted by someone who can't speak English without being vulgar.

At the end of the day, it makes no logical sense. A fool is trying to use vulgar English to justify vulgar English.

It's a free country, so as long as her influence is marginalized that's all good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hey dumbass, it's used VERY frequently in the rust belt, including where I grew up in PA (in an all white neighborhood. Hell, all-white county, pretty much). It's not just present in "ebonics"; the word features in many dialects.

And for those who are going on and on about "proper English," you don't sound educated -- quite the contrary, in fact. I have a grad degree in linguistics, and much like the PP waaaay at the beginning of the thread mentioned, /aks/ is a perfectly legitimate pronunciation for "ask." I'm sorry if you don't like that perfectly valid dialects of modern English exist, and I'm sorry if you've made up your mind to follow only proscriptive grammar rules, but "proper English" is a myth. Whatever the dominant socioeconomic class in a given region or at a given time determines is "proper" does not make it so. Other forms of expression and pronunciation have just as much right to exist and be used as the dialect of American English you choose to speak.

Now, the dialect of English your DC speaks can and does indicate the regional or cultural influences they experience. So, if you'd prefer to have them pronounce it /ask/, just tell your child so. No need to shit all over anyone else's dialect and pretend their way of speaking (and their background) is for some reason wholesale inferior to yours.

Hi.

When some of us questioned the credibility of the "ax as legitimate alternative pronunciation to ask"? It was only a matter of time before we were labelled racists. (Well, duh!)

In the meantime, the most "articulate" (a stretch) counterargument was attempted by someone who can't speak English without being vulgar.

At the end of the day, it makes no logical sense. A fool is trying to use vulgar English to justify vulgar English.

It's a free country, so as long as her influence is marginalized that's all good.

Yes! But I'm afraid your post will simply elicit another psuedo-intellectual response in an attempt not to be marginalized. It's a never ending cycle. Let's disarm. Pens down!

[Anonymous]

Wow, this discussion is pretty insane. My DH and I both have advanced degrees and consider ourselves pretty successful. Our kids are in a great loving daycare with wonderful teachers -- most of whom are AA. Some of the teachers say "axs" I guess and some say "mines" instead of "mine". Sometimes my older child says that too. I am sooooo not stressing about it. DC will figure out "proper" pronunciation.

I'm sure we all picked up mispronunciation ticks from parents, grandparents, caregivers when we were kids. And, we probably outgrew them as we entered the larger world. We might even slip back into those ticks when we are with our families, and that is ok too.

I can't believe someone would think to correct a teacher on a minor pronunciation issue like that. She probably say it correctly when teaching and mispronounces in more informal speech. Your child may have learned it from other kids, not just the teacher.