South Arlington elementary school boundary adjustments 2019

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^ on the Montessori point, my child is in the Drew program and got in as a preschooler. At the time we applied, it was my understanding that entrance as a 3 year old was the only way to guarantee access to Montessori as an elementary student. That hasn't changed and I don't know why it would change simply because Montessori is going to a new building. I don't think there's anything being "designed" to retain preschoolers more than in prior years, unless maybe people think that the Henry location is more convenient and therefore are less likely to re-route their kids to their home elem starting in K. Frankly, I was confused as to why so many parents seemed to think otherwise at the Montessori meeting the other night.

That said, I also think it's pretty clear from the Montessori meeting and from the reality of Arlington's school-age population that the Montessori program will expand once located at Henry. They have done projections to expand it out to 700+ students, from its current status at around 460 students. It's not going to happen next year, so doesn't do parents of current private/sattelite Montessori programs any good, but it seems inevitable that it will expand down the line.

Good luck!
Henry's capacity is about 500. Right now there are 685 kids and it is incredibly crowded. I've heard that another trailer will be added once Montessori moves in. It's going on the blacktop. So the plan is to add more kids? And you're okay with that?
Don't forget they will be sharing their field space and parking lot with the newly expanded (1500 +800) Career Center and the Arlington Tech (800+), Arlington Community High School (300?) an the Library.
What a shitshow that will be. As I said before, good luck.

I’m not trying to be rude, but what is your point? No one is thrilled with the “relocatables” that are all over APS schools, but the school age population is booming and there is currently no budget to build more buildings (much less to complete the magical-thinking type of projects some parents suggest at these meetings - let’s just move the parking lot underground and build a couple new stories on top of Henry!). I was reporting that the Staff has projected up to 700+ kids at Henry over the next several years. That’s a fact. Am I a fan of it? Not really, but I think it’s going to happen.

And yes, I’ve been to meetings about that site generally. It will be a shitshow and I feel badly for the folks living around there.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They're not going to do any of this. You cray. Certainly not any sort of tracking or "school within a school." Just move already. That's what they're going to tell you.

Not cray. This is exactly what they did on the north side 25 years ago. It’s been done before.

Go watch the SB meeting where the department of instruction basically said this (meaning tracking) was a huge mistake of the previous generation that won't be repeated. FFS, unless the Super and all his staff and at least 3/5 SB members leave in the next 6 months you're on a fool's errand. Randolph has IB, but it's for every student at the school not just some in a special program. They're not going to force out the neighborhood kids who can walk from the "Barcroft" Apartments onto buses over to a school outside of their neighborhood on the other side of Columbia Pike. I don't know what on earth you're smoking, but it's some pretty good stuff.

And I will add, right now the area I’m discussing crosses George Mason. They cross a major road right now. There are still plenty of apartments that would still be zoned to the school.

They are in the Randolph walk zone. They are not in the Barcroft walk zone.

No they don't. Walk zones are entirely determined by the physical location of the school and it's surrounding streets.

So you can have overlapping walk zones.

They are not moving kids who walk to Randolph on an established and safe walking route over to Barcroft, which is further away. There's literally no reason that they would do this. The kids live in Douglas Park. They go to school in Douglas Park. The end.

Half of Douglas Park doesn’t go to Randolph. The neighborhood is split right now. What I’m saying makes much more sense than what is currently happening. Half the neighborhood is buses now. If this change were to happen everyone would be a walker.
This really isn’t a outlandish idea.

And the buses go to which school?

Right now the buses go to Hoffman Boston

I'm looking at the map right now and I only see a section of DP that goes to Henry. None that go Hoffman Boston. Are you sure those kids aren't just in the pre-K program there? That area of DP looks like it will be pulled into the Drew boundary.

Randolph, with its current boundary, has no buses. This is exactly how they want it, so I would expect too much to change.

Please look at the map again. Part of the neighborhood is very clearly zoned HOFFMAN BOSTON. Look at the corner or 4 mile and Walter reed.
And nowhere have I stayed buses would GO TO Randolph.
What I am proposing keeps everyone as a walker.

I see what you're saying now. That area look like it would be moved to Drew. I'm not following how those kids could be walkers to Barcroft though.

[Anonymous]

What if the immersion program moved into the Carlin Springs building and Claremont became a neighborhood school?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They're not going to do any of this. You cray. Certainly not any sort of tracking or "school within a school." Just move already. That's what they're going to tell you.

Not cray. This is exactly what they did on the north side 25 years ago. It’s been done before.

Go watch the SB meeting where the department of instruction basically said this (meaning tracking) was a huge mistake of the previous generation that won't be repeated. FFS, unless the Super and all his staff and at least 3/5 SB members leave in the next 6 months you're on a fool's errand. Randolph has IB, but it's for every student at the school not just some in a special program. They're not going to force out the neighborhood kids who can walk from the "Barcroft" Apartments onto buses over to a school outside of their neighborhood on the other side of Columbia Pike. I don't know what on earth you're smoking, but it's some pretty good stuff.

And I will add, right now the area I’m discussing crosses George Mason. They cross a major road right now. There are still plenty of apartments that would still be zoned to the school.

They are in the Randolph walk zone. They are not in the Barcroft walk zone.

No they don't. Walk zones are entirely determined by the physical location of the school and it's surrounding streets.

So you can have overlapping walk zones.

They are not moving kids who walk to Randolph on an established and safe walking route over to Barcroft, which is further away. There's literally no reason that they would do this. The kids live in Douglas Park. They go to school in Douglas Park. The end.

Half of Douglas Park doesn’t go to Randolph. The neighborhood is split right now. What I’m saying makes much more sense than what is currently happening. Half the neighborhood is buses now. If this change were to happen everyone would be a walker.
This really isn’t a outlandish idea.

And the buses go to which school?

Right now the buses go to Hoffman Boston

I'm looking at the map right now and I only see a section of DP that goes to Henry. None that go Hoffman Boston. Are you sure those kids aren't just in the pre-K program there? That area of DP looks like it will be pulled into the Drew boundary.

Randolph, with its current boundary, has no buses. This is exactly how they want it, so I would expect too much to change.

Please look at the map again. Part of the neighborhood is very clearly zoned HOFFMAN BOSTON. Look at the corner or 4 mile and Walter reed.
And nowhere have I stayed buses would GO TO Randolph.
What I am proposing keeps everyone as a walker.

I see what you're saying now. That area look like it would be moved to Drew. I'm not following how those kids could be walkers to Barcroft though.

Drew? Why? They are out of the walk zone for Drew. that’s unlikely and not what I’m proposing.

I’m saying that slice of Douglas Park goes back to Randolph. The kids on the other side of the neighborhood are crossing a major road no matter what. The kids currently zoned H-B, if redirected to Randolph would entirely be within the residential neighborhood. No crossing of major roads.

It’s approx . 2 mile diffenence either way for both groups. But my proposal keeps everyone currently a walker as a walker and adds more walkers. My proposal gets rid of buses.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They're not going to do any of this. You cray. Certainly not any sort of tracking or "school within a school." Just move already. That's what they're going to tell you.

Not cray. This is exactly what they did on the north side 25 years ago. It’s been done before.

Go watch the SB meeting where the department of instruction basically said this (meaning tracking) was a huge mistake of the previous generation that won't be repeated. FFS, unless the Super and all his staff and at least 3/5 SB members leave in the next 6 months you're on a fool's errand. Randolph has IB, but it's for every student at the school not just some in a special program. They're not going to force out the neighborhood kids who can walk from the "Barcroft" Apartments onto buses over to a school outside of their neighborhood on the other side of Columbia Pike. I don't know what on earth you're smoking, but it's some pretty good stuff.

And I will add, right now the area I’m discussing crosses George Mason. They cross a major road right now. There are still plenty of apartments that would still be zoned to the school.

They are in the Randolph walk zone. They are not in the Barcroft walk zone.

No they don't. Walk zones are entirely determined by the physical location of the school and it's surrounding streets.

So you can have overlapping walk zones.

They are not moving kids who walk to Randolph on an established and safe walking route over to Barcroft, which is further away. There's literally no reason that they would do this. The kids live in Douglas Park. They go to school in Douglas Park. The end.

Half of Douglas Park doesn’t go to Randolph. The neighborhood is split right now. What I’m saying makes much more sense than what is currently happening. Half the neighborhood is buses now. If this change were to happen everyone would be a walker.
This really isn’t a outlandish idea.

And the buses go to which school?

Right now the buses go to Hoffman Boston

I'm looking at the map right now and I only see a section of DP that goes to Henry. None that go Hoffman Boston. Are you sure those kids aren't just in the pre-K program there? That area of DP looks like it will be pulled into the Drew boundary.

Randolph, with its current boundary, has no buses. This is exactly how they want it, so I would expect too much to change.

Please look at the map again. Part of the neighborhood is very clearly zoned HOFFMAN BOSTON. Look at the corner or 4 mile and Walter reed.
And nowhere have I stayed buses would GO TO Randolph.
What I am proposing keeps everyone as a walker.

I see what you're saying now. That area look like it would be moved to Drew. I'm not following how those kids could be walkers to Barcroft though.

Drew? Why? They are out of the walk zone for Drew. that’s unlikely and not what I’m proposing.

I’m saying that slice of Douglas Park goes back to Randolph. The kids on the other side of the neighborhood are crossing a major road no matter what. The kids currently zoned H-B, if redirected to Randolph would entirely be within the residential neighborhood. No crossing of major roads.

It’s approx . 2 mile diffenence either way for both groups. But my proposal keeps everyone currently a walker as a walker and adds more walkers. My proposal gets rid of buses.

I think it's possible that they could go Randolph rather than Drew, but I don't think they'd move the other area out of Randolph. Because they are walkers to Randolph.

[Anonymous]

^^ but also within the walk zone for Barcroft...

[Anonymous]

I don't know where folks have gotten the impression that Alcova Heights is lobbying hard to be redistricted to Fleet. As an active Alcova resident, I've not heard any discussion of it and there certainly has been no formal discussion or advocacy effort from the civic association. There are some Barcroft students south of Columbia Pike who are also districted to Jefferson; so Alcova Heights kids are not the only ones from Barcroft attending Jefferson as their neighborhood school. Alcova has always been within the walk-zone for Patrick Henry. Clearly that has not guaranteed Alcova's inclusion in the Henry boundary. In fact, its location right between Arlington Heights and Barcroft makes it prime for being moved to either school at any time. In fact, I would argue Alcova is more in the walk zone for the existing PH building than the future Fleet building. Middle schoolers walk to Jefferson; but the current Henry building is more "walkable" for the youngest elementary students in terms of safety and proximity.

Re some previously posted comments regarding Barcroft Elementary, as a current Barcroft parent I can assure everyone the modified school calendar remains in effect this year and next. Whether admin has a plan to eliminate it or not beyond that or to coincide with the new 2019 boundaries is another matter; but there has been ZERO indication of such a plan brought to the Barcroft school community. And that calendar has advantages for everyone regardless of social class or language proficiency, and there are many middle class white families for whom it works well and who will lament its loss. Nevertheless, the alternative calendar could have been more effective from an academic standpoint if it had received full support from APS over the years.

One other comment: I understand people not wanting to attend the Drew neighborhood program as it has been in the past several years. But I do not understand the intensity of the fear of being districted to the new Drew in 2019. Perhaps the first few years will be transitional - but it will be an essentially brand new student body. The majority of students will be students currently attending other schools. Unless, of course, the SB once again screws up the opportunity to make a good boundary decision and allows Drew to have a 40, 50, 60% FRL rate.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Hide the lousy scores? Have you looked at Barcroft and Randolph's scores? I don't think anyone is hiding the fact that they are significantly below the county average.

You don’t understand how APS looks at it. They are accredited. They aren’t being taken over by the state=they are fine.

In the 4 years since I bought my house, the scores have dropped at Barcroft. We used them to choose between Barcroft or Randolph. If someone only has that to go on and really wanted to stay in this area, it would be enough to dissuade them from Barcroft. That, the the lack of any houses under $500K! I mean, what are we doing wrong here? We've gentrified the area - how are we still doing this poorly for those kids, not to mention the UMC ones.

No we haven’t. Sure, the single family homes are full of wealthy people, but Barcroft Apartments is still there...

They aren't the problem. That is mostly zoned for Randolph. It's Arlington Mill and the other buildings that I think changed the scores.

Barcroft has a LOT of kids from Barcroft apartments. As a parent at Barcroft the past several years, I can attest to many outstanding teachers -- especially the RTG (Resource Teacher for the Gifted) who, fortunately or unfortunately, has moved into a different role this academic year. I can also suggest that the focus and efforts under the most recent former principle shifted significantly from how Miriam Hughey-Guy approached administering the school - and that shift included some positive changes but a number of negative changes as well. Enrollment has dropped significantly over each of the past few years and there is yet another affordable housing project in its boundaries that will open in 2019. My impression from our years there is that there was an uptick in MC families choosing to stay...until a year or two into the new principal's tenure. But Barcroft is now under the administration of a very beloved APS principal from Ashlawn. Again, many changes even in her first year and we will see if/how her approaches that were successful at Ashlawn succeed at Barcroft.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^ on the Montessori point, my child is in the Drew program and got in as a preschooler. At the time we applied, it was my understanding that entrance as a 3 year old was the only way to guarantee access to Montessori as an elementary student. That hasn't changed and I don't know why it would change simply because Montessori is going to a new building. I don't think there's anything being "designed" to retain preschoolers more than in prior years, unless maybe people think that the Henry location is more convenient and therefore are less likely to re-route their kids to their home elem starting in K. Frankly, I was confused as to why so many parents seemed to think otherwise at the Montessori meeting the other night.

That said, I also think it's pretty clear from the Montessori meeting and from the reality of Arlington's school-age population that the Montessori program will expand once located at Henry. They have done projections to expand it out to 700+ students, from its current status at around 460 students. It's not going to happen next year, so doesn't do parents of current private/sattelite Montessori programs any good, but it seems inevitable that it will expand down the line.

Good luck!
Henry's capacity is about 500. Right now there are 685 kids and it is incredibly crowded. I've heard that another trailer will be added once Montessori moves in. It's going on the blacktop. So the plan is to add more kids? And you're okay with that?
Don't forget they will be sharing their field space and parking lot with the newly expanded (1500 +800) Career Center and the Arlington Tech (800+), Arlington Community High School (300?) an the Library.





What a shitshow that will be. As I said before, good luck.

I’m not trying to be rude, but what is your point? No one is thrilled with the “relocatables” that are all over APS schools, but the school age population is booming and there is currently no budget to build more buildings (much less to complete the magical-thinking type of projects some parents suggest at these meetings - let’s just move the parking lot underground and build a couple new stories on top of Henry!). I was reporting that the Staff has projected up to 700+ kids at Henry over the next several years. That’s a fact. Am I a fan of it? Not really, but I think it’s going to happen.

And yes, I’ve been to meetings about that site generally. It will be a shitshow and I feel badly for the folks living around there.

I guess I'm wondering why 700 kids at Montessori is okay, if it's not okay for the current kids at Henry. Why does APS think this is going to work? At 680+ kids now, Henry is at about 125% capacity. They are fixing one problem and creating another. I just don't understand how APS is getting away with this.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They're not going to do any of this. You cray. Certainly not any sort of tracking or "school within a school." Just move already. That's what they're going to tell you.

Not cray. This is exactly what they did on the north side 25 years ago. It’s been done before.

Go watch the SB meeting where the department of instruction basically said this (meaning tracking) was a huge mistake of the previous generation that won't be repeated. FFS, unless the Super and all his staff and at least 3/5 SB members leave in the next 6 months you're on a fool's errand. Randolph has IB, but it's for every student at the school not just some in a special program. They're not going to force out the neighborhood kids who can walk from the "Barcroft" Apartments onto buses over to a school outside of their neighborhood on the other side of Columbia Pike. I don't know what on earth you're smoking, but it's some pretty good stuff.

And I will add, right now the area I’m discussing crosses George Mason. They cross a major road right now. There are still plenty of apartments that would still be zoned to the school.

They are in the Randolph walk zone. They are not in the Barcroft walk zone.

No they don't. Walk zones are entirely determined by the physical location of the school and it's surrounding streets.

So you can have overlapping walk zones.

They are not moving kids who walk to Randolph on an established and safe walking route over to Barcroft, which is further away. There's literally no reason that they would do this. The kids live in Douglas Park. They go to school in Douglas Park. The end.

Half of Douglas Park doesn’t go to Randolph. The neighborhood is split right now. What I’m saying makes much more sense than what is currently happening. Half the neighborhood is buses now. If this change were to happen everyone would be a walker.
This really isn’t a outlandish idea.

And the buses go to which school?

Right now the buses go to Hoffman Boston

I'm looking at the map right now and I only see a section of DP that goes to Henry. None that go Hoffman Boston. Are you sure those kids aren't just in the pre-K program there? That area of DP looks like it will be pulled into the Drew boundary.

Randolph, with its current boundary, has no buses. This is exactly how they want it, so I would expect too much to change.

Please look at the map again. Part of the neighborhood is very clearly zoned HOFFMAN BOSTON. Look at the corner or 4 mile and Walter reed.
And nowhere have I stayed buses would GO TO Randolph.
What I am proposing keeps everyone as a walker.

I see what you're saying now. That area look like it would be moved to Drew. I'm not following how those kids could be walkers to Barcroft though.

Drew? Why? They are out of the walk zone for Drew. that’s unlikely and not what I’m proposing.

I’m saying that slice of Douglas Park goes back to Randolph. The kids on the other side of the neighborhood are crossing a major road no matter what. The kids currently zoned H-B, if redirected to Randolph would entirely be within the residential neighborhood. No crossing of major roads.

It’s approx . 2 mile diffenence either way for both groups. But my proposal keeps everyone currently a walker as a walker and adds more walkers. My proposal gets rid of buses.

Some area from the Randolph zone is getting pulled into Drew. That much is clear from the stakeholders meeting around hiring a new principal at Drew. Looking at a map, that is the area that is geographically closest to Drew, hence my speculation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^^ on the Montessori point, my child is in the Drew program and got in as a preschooler. At the time we applied, it was my understanding that entrance as a 3 year old was the only way to guarantee access to Montessori as an elementary student. That hasn't changed and I don't know why it would change simply because Montessori is going to a new building. I don't think there's anything being "designed" to retain preschoolers more than in prior years, unless maybe people think that the Henry location is more convenient and therefore are less likely to re-route their kids to their home elem starting in K. Frankly, I was confused as to why so many parents seemed to think otherwise at the Montessori meeting the other night.

That said, I also think it's pretty clear from the Montessori meeting and from the reality of Arlington's school-age population that the Montessori program will expand once located at Henry. They have done projections to expand it out to 700+ students, from its current status at around 460 students. It's not going to happen next year, so doesn't do parents of current private/sattelite Montessori programs any good, but it seems inevitable that it will expand down the line.

Good luck!
Henry's capacity is about 500. Right now there are 685 kids and it is incredibly crowded. I've heard that another trailer will be added once Montessori moves in. It's going on the blacktop. So the plan is to add more kids? And you're okay with that?
Don't forget they will be sharing their field space and parking lot with the newly expanded (1500 +800) Career Center and the Arlington Tech (800+), Arlington Community High School (300?) an the Library.





What a shitshow that will be. As I said before, good luck.

I’m not trying to be rude, but what is your point? No one is thrilled with the “relocatables” that are all over APS schools, but the school age population is booming and there is currently no budget to build more buildings (much less to complete the magical-thinking type of projects some parents suggest at these meetings - let’s just move the parking lot underground and build a couple new stories on top of Henry!). I was reporting that the Staff has projected up to 700+ kids at Henry over the next several years. That’s a fact. Am I a fan of it? Not really, but I think it’s going to happen.

And yes, I’ve been to meetings about that site generally. It will be a shitshow and I feel badly for the folks living around there.

I guess I'm wondering why 700 kids at Montessori is okay, if it's not okay for the current kids at Henry. Why does APS think this is going to work? At 680+ kids now, Henry is at about 125% capacity. They are fixing one problem and creating another. I just don't understand how APS is getting away with this.

They are kicking the can. It won't be 700 kids to start, but if it does grow it will outgrow the space at Henry and will need an addition.

[Anonymous]

The problem with several of the previous posters' arguments is that transitions that take a "couple of years" can be 1/3 to 1/2 of your child's elementary education. I think it's great that Drew or Barcroft may eventually improve in terms of the long term impacts on the neighborhoods and the education of ALL children. But if I have the resources to leave or the choice to sit it and while that "transition" occurs, that is the choice I will make. Ultimately, I am in this for my children's education. That has to take precedence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The problem with several of the previous posters' arguments is that transitions that take a "couple of years" can be 1/3 to 1/2 of your child's elementary education. I think it's great that Drew or Barcroft may eventually improve in terms of the long term impacts on the neighborhoods and the education of ALL children. But if I have the resources to leave or the choice to sit it and while that "transition" occurs, that is the choice I will make. Ultimately, I am in this for my children's education. That has to take precedence.

Okay, but if you're expecting all the rest of the county to help you keep your kid(s) in the school you prefer, you're wasting your time. That's all anyone is pointing out. The precedent with the boundary decisions has been set that they are tightening the geographic areas around neighborhood schools. If you happen to live in an area that has a strange boundary (where you're going to a school that isn't the one closest to your house), a holdover from the time when the county cared about segregation, consider yourself warned. And plan accordingly.

[Anonymous]

Oh agreed. Eyes wide open. I get worried when others argue that schools are improving and famillies should just go all in on "improving schools." Because a 3-4 year improvement timeline does not work for a child who is in elementary school now or just about to start. It's great for future property values and for future kids. But not today's kids. They have to get out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem with several of the previous posters' arguments is that transitions that take a "couple of years" can be 1/3 to 1/2 of your child's elementary education. I think it's great that Drew or Barcroft may eventually improve in terms of the long term impacts on the neighborhoods and the education of ALL children. But if I have the resources to leave or the choice to sit it and while that "transition" occurs, that is the choice I will make. Ultimately, I am in this for my children's education. That has to take precedence.

Okay, but if you're expecting all the rest of the county to help you keep your kid(s) in the school you prefer, you're wasting your time. That's all anyone is pointing out. The precedent with the boundary decisions has been set that they are tightening the geographic areas around neighborhood schools. If you happen to live in an area that has a strange boundary (where you're going to a school that isn't the one closest to your house), a holdover from the time when the county cared about segregation, consider yourself warned. And plan accordingly.

Drew and Henry are both, according to Google Maps “walk”, 0.8 miles away from my house. I’m not sure how the original zoning decision was made due to the equidistance. When Henry moves, Drew will be, by default, closer. I completely understand that. It is just frustrating to go from a known entity to an unknown entity that very likely won’t be comparable in the near term (I mean, I highly doubt Drew is going to be the next Henry). I really hope I’m wrong! But my faith in the SB is slim at this point.