APS Closing Nottingham

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Enjoying these comments from Nottingham parents suddenly concerned with equity when in the past other schools problems didn't bother them at all and in fact they have been more than enthusiastic to burn other schools down if it would solve their own problems. Suddenly though they want a kumbaya moment and everyone to hold hands!

Na, I'm good.

You’re proving our point. Let’s all burn each other to the ground over some perceived sleight from six years ago by a group of parents that has long since left. Cool.

The Nottingham parents have entirely the same entitled, oblivious, and burn-down-their-neighbors-schools-if-it-could-help-them Weltanschauung as their forbears. Have you read any of this thread? Asking for neighbors to support one another only when it benefits them is Nottingham's tell. Note that this swing space plan actually does benefit other neighbors in Arlington who need school renovations that would run longer than 3 months -- but that sacrifice is too much for Nottingham.

Come on, Nottingham -- why won't YOU support others in the community who need swing space that your school is perfect for, because it is underenrolled, and surrounding schools could take your kids without that much difficulty -- and meanwhile APS would not need to spend exorbitant amounts of money to retrofit some other building into a school? Why can't you just be a good citizen? Why is that so hard?

“Perfect for”? Ha.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:No one want to join Nottingham. Even in N Arlington. You’ve alienated just about everyone with your prior and current style Of “advocacy.”

In that case, you should want us to stay at our own school. Because otherwise we’ll be coming to your’s! Help us advocate to keep Nottingham open so that our abhorrent values and alienating nature don’t infiltrate the whole of North Arlington.

Oh, that's clearly never going to happen! You'd sooner move to Montana than come to my kids' schools south of 50. Of course, the rest of your comment indicates you don't consider south Arlington part of the picture anyway. But you'd probably do better to solicit south Arlington support, if south Arlington schools end up being the ones destined for the swing space. They're your best bet arguing about the inconvenient and unfeasible location.

So we are on the same page!

NP. I'm in SA and our school desperately needs a reno, and I think the proposal is the best and most cost-efficient way to improve our school and the others that need it. I fully support this plan and would have no problem moving locations for one year, even if it's not that convenient. It would be better than staying in our building through construction, noise, and dust.

What if, as an alternative, you could go to Fairlington? Do you wonder if APS seriously considered that as an option? Or what if you could go to a state of the art classroom at Amazon? Aren’t you curious whether APS placed a call to them to ask? Or maybe Syphax would be closer and more convenient? Does it make you wonder whether it’s anything other than APS’s office-work policy that shut down that option?

It’s not Nottingham or nothing, and you ought to press your elected leaders to get a little more creative in their thinking. You say it’s the best choice but you history have no idea… APS doesn’t either. And that’s the point. They were so laser focused on closing a north Arlington school that they literally didn’t try to find any other solution.

For the umpteenth time, Fairlington is not available to APS until the County makes it available and they are not interested in doing so.
They chose a NA school because of its enrollment amid multiple neighboring NA schools also with below-capacity enrollments.
It is far FASTER and CHEAPER to re-use an existing operating elementary school as an elementary school than to renovate a community center (that isn't even in APS' authority to use) or to find another location for central admin and the SB and convert that LEASED space into swing space that can accommodate preschool and elementary school.

I think their idea is fine. I don't believe it's actually going to happen because APS won't have its crap together to proceed with school renovations by the time the NES proposal is to take effect. By the time they're actually ready to begin using swing space, there probably won't be enough capacity in NW to do what they're currently proposing to do. On that point, it might end up being just as feasible from a timeframe standpoint to find some empty office buildings and do some other major renovations to create a swing space. But it will cost a LOT more. A LOT. Then the complaints will be that APS is wasting too much money creating a temporary space. And those complaints would probably be justified.

How do you know the County won’t help? How do you know APS has even asked? Spoiler alert: they haven’t.

Well then someone should ask them. Have YOU?

[Anonymous]

Page 160 of this thread is filled with 6 anti-Nottingham replies within a 5 minute period. This is clearly one Nottingham-hating parent with nothing better to do on a Sunday afternoon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To update, They have put in 4 way stops in those places where people were tragically hit, though if they were there in the 1st place, it wouldn’t have happened

Nottingham doesn’t want to talk about the two different 4-way stops that have been added within 2 blocks in either direction of the school. Not consistent with their narrative that MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE if Nottingham doesn’t keep its ridiculously underenrolled school jus the way it is now.

Ok great! Now the neighborhood is safer based on CURRENT TRAFFIC PATTERNS. A swing space upends every thing we know already about traffic in the area. It is a huge fundamental change to neighborhood traffic going from a school that is overwhelmingly walkable to 100 pct driving.

I’m sorry you can’t understand that.

You do realize you're then making the case that NO pLACE can be swing space, right? You Notties certainly can't go advocating for somewhere else to take the fall. In fact, you're saying the whole idea is just too dangerous. So, no accelerated renos anywhere, right?

No, it’s a lack of a traffic study to see if/what can be done to make the streets safer. Some streets and neighborhoods are inherently safer than others based on factors outside of the control of APS. Width? Sidewalks? Stop signs? Hills?

On that basis, I think your neighborhood around NES is far more suitable than most others - esp in central/south arlington - since you have far more space and far less traffic and far less density of people.

Agreed. I think some of these NES parents have never witnessed the buzz of cars, buses, and general humanity at an elementary school drop off/pickup south of 50.

Thank you for making our point for us! We don’t want that nor can Nottingham accommodate that.

But what’s the issue with APS taking a breath and actually studying the issue? The whole argument is APS is moving too fast without supporting data and study. Making decisions like this is how we got into this mess in the first place.

Honey, you’re missing the point. The “buzz of cars, busses, and general humanity” is an acceptable state of being during school drop off/pick up.

You don’t want that? Doesn’t matter. Move to the country or go private.

And if we lose a few kids or other pedestrians in the meantime, no problem! Cost of doing business!

Please stop this. People all over the county are concerned about the safety of their kids.

No. Posters have made it very clear on this very thread that they DO NOT CARE about the safety of kids around Nottingham.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Page 160 of this thread is filled with 6 anti-Nottingham replies within a 5 minute period. This is clearly one Nottingham-hating parent with nothing better to do on a Sunday afternoon.

Sorry, I jumped the gun, make that *10*

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To update, They have put in 4 way stops in those places where people were tragically hit, though if they were there in the 1st place, it wouldn’t have happened

Nottingham doesn’t want to talk about the two different 4-way stops that have been added within 2 blocks in either direction of the school. Not consistent with their narrative that MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE if Nottingham doesn’t keep its ridiculously underenrolled school jus the way it is now.

Ok great! Now the neighborhood is safer based on CURRENT TRAFFIC PATTERNS. A swing space upends every thing we know already about traffic in the area. It is a huge fundamental change to neighborhood traffic going from a school that is overwhelmingly walkable to 100 pct driving.

I’m sorry you can’t understand that.

You do realize you're then making the case that NO pLACE can be swing space, right? You Notties certainly can't go advocating for somewhere else to take the fall. In fact, you're saying the whole idea is just too dangerous. So, no accelerated renos anywhere, right?

No, it’s a lack of a traffic study to see if/what can be done to make the streets safer. Some streets and neighborhoods are inherently safer than others based on factors outside of the control of APS. Width? Sidewalks? Stop signs? Hills?

On that basis, I think your neighborhood around NES is far more suitable than most others - esp in central/south arlington - since you have far more space and far less traffic and far less density of people.

Agreed. I think some of these NES parents have never witnessed the buzz of cars, buses, and general humanity at an elementary school drop off/pickup south of 50.

Thank you for making our point for us! We don’t want that nor can Nottingham accommodate that.

But what’s the issue with APS taking a breath and actually studying the issue? The whole argument is APS is moving too fast without supporting data and study. Making decisions like this is how we got into this mess in the first place.

Honey, you’re missing the point. The “buzz of cars, busses, and general humanity” is an acceptable state of being during school drop off/pick up.

You don’t want that? Doesn’t matter. Move to the country or go private.

And if we lose a few kids or other pedestrians in the meantime, no problem! Cost of doing business!

Please stop this. People all over the county are concerned about the safety of their kids.

Exactly, that’s the point. This isn’t NA v SA. We all want our kids to be safe. That’s why we all should want a traffic study.

PP wants NA to feel the pain the way they say SA does. What if we just demanded that it be better and safer for all of us, rather than demonizing each other?

Nice thought. So were you out demanding and advocating on behalf of other schools, especially SA schools all these years. Or just now that NES is the victim?

Where was SA back when NA schools were ridiculously overcrowded? I don't recall help from SA at all.

It goes both ways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s not an thriving school. It’s a school that is atrophying. People have left it in droves for private. It only has 50 in Kindergarten. This makes a ton of sense.

88% is hardly under enrolled.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one want to join Nottingham. Even in N Arlington. You’ve alienated just about everyone with your prior and current style Of “advocacy.”

In that case, you should want us to stay at our own school. Because otherwise we’ll be coming to your’s! Help us advocate to keep Nottingham open so that our abhorrent values and alienating nature don’t infiltrate the whole of North Arlington.

Oh, that's clearly never going to happen! You'd sooner move to Montana than come to my kids' schools south of 50. Of course, the rest of your comment indicates you don't consider south Arlington part of the picture anyway. But you'd probably do better to solicit south Arlington support, if south Arlington schools end up being the ones destined for the swing space. They're your best bet arguing about the inconvenient and unfeasible location.

So we are on the same page!

NP. I'm in SA and our school desperately needs a reno, and I think the proposal is the best and most cost-efficient way to improve our school and the others that need it. I fully support this plan and would have no problem moving locations for one year, even if it's not that convenient. It would be better than staying in our building through construction, noise, and dust.

What if, as an alternative, you could go to Fairlington? Do you wonder if APS seriously considered that as an option? Or what if you could go to a state of the art classroom at Amazon? Aren’t you curious whether APS placed a call to them to ask? Or maybe Syphax would be closer and more convenient? Does it make you wonder whether it’s anything other than APS’s office-work policy that shut down that option?

It’s not Nottingham or nothing, and you ought to press your elected leaders to get a little more creative in their thinking. You say it’s the best choice but you history have no idea… APS doesn’t either. And that’s the point. They were so laser focused on closing a north Arlington school that they literally didn’t try to find any other solution.

For the umpteenth time, Fairlington is not available to APS until the County makes it available and they are not interested in doing so.
They chose a NA school because of its enrollment amid multiple neighboring NA schools also with below-capacity enrollments.
It is far FASTER and CHEAPER to re-use an existing operating elementary school as an elementary school than to renovate a community center (that isn't even in APS' authority to use) or to find another location for central admin and the SB and convert that LEASED space into swing space that can accommodate preschool and elementary school.

I think their idea is fine. I don't believe it's actually going to happen because APS won't have its crap together to proceed with school renovations by the time the NES proposal is to take effect. By the time they're actually ready to begin using swing space, there probably won't be enough capacity in NW to do what they're currently proposing to do. On that point, it might end up being just as feasible from a timeframe standpoint to find some empty office buildings and do some other major renovations to create a swing space. But it will cost a LOT more. A LOT. Then the complaints will be that APS is wasting too much money creating a temporary space. And those complaints would probably be justified.

How do you know the County won’t help? How do you know APS has even asked? Spoiler alert: they haven’t.

Well then someone should ask them. Have YOU?

In fact, I have. Thanks for playing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not an thriving school. It’s a school that is atrophying. People have left it in droves for private. It only has 50 in Kindergarten. This makes a ton of sense.

That’s because of the boundaries, not because of anything specific to Nottingham.

So they redraw the boundaries and split the NES students among the surrounding schools. Ta-da!

They should redraw the boundaries! We agree. They should move people north incrementally. They shouldn’t close Nottingham.

They aren’t closing it. No one’s saying they’re closing it.

Redraw the boundaries and use NES as swing space.

Of course they are. The neighborhood school is CLOSING. Are you dense?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not an thriving school. It’s a school that is atrophying. People have left it in droves for private. It only has 50 in Kindergarten. This makes a ton of sense.

That’s because of the boundaries, not because of anything specific to Nottingham.

So they redraw the boundaries and split the NES students among the surrounding schools. Ta-da!

They should redraw the boundaries! We agree. They should move people north incrementally. They shouldn’t close Nottingham.

They aren’t closing it. No one’s saying they’re closing it.

Redraw the boundaries and use NES as swing space.

Say what, now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To update, They have put in 4 way stops in those places where people were tragically hit, though if they were there in the 1st place, it wouldn’t have happened

Nottingham doesn’t want to talk about the two different 4-way stops that have been added within 2 blocks in either direction of the school. Not consistent with their narrative that MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE if Nottingham doesn’t keep its ridiculously underenrolled school jus the way it is now.

Ok great! Now the neighborhood is safer based on CURRENT TRAFFIC PATTERNS. A swing space upends every thing we know already about traffic in the area. It is a huge fundamental change to neighborhood traffic going from a school that is overwhelmingly walkable to 100 pct driving.

I’m sorry you can’t understand that.

You do realize you're then making the case that NO pLACE can be swing space, right? You Notties certainly can't go advocating for somewhere else to take the fall. In fact, you're saying the whole idea is just too dangerous. So, no accelerated renos anywhere, right?

No, it’s a lack of a traffic study to see if/what can be done to make the streets safer. Some streets and neighborhoods are inherently safer than others based on factors outside of the control of APS. Width? Sidewalks? Stop signs? Hills?

On that basis, I think your neighborhood around NES is far more suitable than most others - esp in central/south arlington - since you have far more space and far less traffic and far less density of people.

Agreed. I think some of these NES parents have never witnessed the buzz of cars, buses, and general humanity at an elementary school drop off/pickup south of 50.

Thank you for making our point for us! We don’t want that nor can Nottingham accommodate that.

But what’s the issue with APS taking a breath and actually studying the issue? The whole argument is APS is moving too fast without supporting data and study. Making decisions like this is how we got into this mess in the first place.

3 years is too fast for you?
And as has repeatedly been pointed out, they will do the studies IF they decide to move forward and implement for the start of school two years from now. If they did detailed studies of every potential site before making decisions, people would be complaining it's taking them so long to make a proposal and a decision and they're wasting time and taxpayer money on a bunch of studies that aren't even going to matter. Also, any study they do today will need to be (and would) be re-done when it's time to implement the plan because a study done today will be outdated by then.

There is not one single location - not one - that will not have traffic implications or that does not already have traffic concerns. Not one. Traffic is not going to be the factor that stops NES becoming swing space.

This is where you are wrong. Some locations may have unique factors that then don’t make sense as a 100 percent driveable location. The time to study is before the location is chosen because otherwise you’ve now pigeonholed the site, even if it makes no sense after studies are conducted.

Right. Kenmore didn't become a high school because of, wait for it.... traffic!

Well, sort of. The real reason is APS and Arlington County refuse to try to work with Ffx Co to be able to do what they say they need to do to increase access to the site. Traffic is cited as the reason but it's just a cover for "it's too hard." anytime something requires the cooperation of the County or another entity, APS says it can't be done because they don't have the authority.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not an thriving school. It’s a school that is atrophying. People have left it in droves for private. It only has 50 in Kindergarten. This makes a ton of sense.

88% is hardly under enrolled.

Based on APS own numbers, it isn’t even top 5.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Page 160 of this thread is filled with 6 anti-Nottingham replies within a 5 minute period. This is clearly one Nottingham-hating parent with nothing better to do on a Sunday afternoon.

Hmmm. Clearly you have even more time on your hands to make the effort to count that up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To update, They have put in 4 way stops in those places where people were tragically hit, though if they were there in the 1st place, it wouldn’t have happened

Nottingham doesn’t want to talk about the two different 4-way stops that have been added within 2 blocks in either direction of the school. Not consistent with their narrative that MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE if Nottingham doesn’t keep its ridiculously underenrolled school jus the way it is now.

Ok great! Now the neighborhood is safer based on CURRENT TRAFFIC PATTERNS. A swing space upends every thing we know already about traffic in the area. It is a huge fundamental change to neighborhood traffic going from a school that is overwhelmingly walkable to 100 pct driving.

I’m sorry you can’t understand that.

You do realize you're then making the case that NO pLACE can be swing space, right? You Notties certainly can't go advocating for somewhere else to take the fall. In fact, you're saying the whole idea is just too dangerous. So, no accelerated renos anywhere, right?

No, it’s a lack of a traffic study to see if/what can be done to make the streets safer. Some streets and neighborhoods are inherently safer than others based on factors outside of the control of APS. Width? Sidewalks? Stop signs? Hills?

On that basis, I think your neighborhood around NES is far more suitable than most others - esp in central/south arlington - since you have far more space and far less traffic and far less density of people.

Agreed. I think some of these NES parents have never witnessed the buzz of cars, buses, and general humanity at an elementary school drop off/pickup south of 50.

Thank you for making our point for us! We don’t want that nor can Nottingham accommodate that.

But what’s the issue with APS taking a breath and actually studying the issue? The whole argument is APS is moving too fast without supporting data and study. Making decisions like this is how we got into this mess in the first place.

3 years is too fast for you?
And as has repeatedly been pointed out, they will do the studies IF they decide to move forward and implement for the start of school two years from now. If they did detailed studies of every potential site before making decisions, people would be complaining it's taking them so long to make a proposal and a decision and they're wasting time and taxpayer money on a bunch of studies that aren't even going to matter. Also, any study they do today will need to be (and would) be re-done when it's time to implement the plan because a study done today will be outdated by then.

There is not one single location - not one - that will not have traffic implications or that does not already have traffic concerns. Not one. Traffic is not going to be the factor that stops NES becoming swing space.

This is where you are wrong. Some locations may have unique factors that then don’t make sense as a 100 percent driveable location. The time to study is before the location is chosen because otherwise you’ve now pigeonholed the site, even if it makes no sense after studies are conducted.

Right. Kenmore didn't become a high school because of, wait for it.... traffic!

Well, sort of. The real reason is APS and Arlington County refuse to try to work with Ffx Co to be able to do what they say they need to do to increase access to the site. Traffic is cited as the reason but it's just a cover for "it's too hard." anytime something requires the cooperation of the County or another entity, APS says it can't be done because they don't have the authority.

How about the increase in access needed to reach Nottingham? Can that be done?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To update, They have put in 4 way stops in those places where people were tragically hit, though if they were there in the 1st place, it wouldn’t have happened

Nottingham doesn’t want to talk about the two different 4-way stops that have been added within 2 blocks in either direction of the school. Not consistent with their narrative that MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE if Nottingham doesn’t keep its ridiculously underenrolled school jus the way it is now.

Ok great! Now the neighborhood is safer based on CURRENT TRAFFIC PATTERNS. A swing space upends every thing we know already about traffic in the area. It is a huge fundamental change to neighborhood traffic going from a school that is overwhelmingly walkable to 100 pct driving.

I’m sorry you can’t understand that.

You do realize you're then making the case that NO pLACE can be swing space, right? You Notties certainly can't go advocating for somewhere else to take the fall. In fact, you're saying the whole idea is just too dangerous. So, no accelerated renos anywhere, right?

No, it’s a lack of a traffic study to see if/what can be done to make the streets safer. Some streets and neighborhoods are inherently safer than others based on factors outside of the control of APS. Width? Sidewalks? Stop signs? Hills?

On that basis, I think your neighborhood around NES is far more suitable than most others - esp in central/south arlington - since you have far more space and far less traffic and far less density of people.

Agreed. I think some of these NES parents have never witnessed the buzz of cars, buses, and general humanity at an elementary school drop off/pickup south of 50.

Thank you for making our point for us! We don’t want that nor can Nottingham accommodate that.

But what’s the issue with APS taking a breath and actually studying the issue? The whole argument is APS is moving too fast without supporting data and study. Making decisions like this is how we got into this mess in the first place.

3 years is too fast for you?
And as has repeatedly been pointed out, they will do the studies IF they decide to move forward and implement for the start of school two years from now. If they did detailed studies of every potential site before making decisions, people would be complaining it's taking them so long to make a proposal and a decision and they're wasting time and taxpayer money on a bunch of studies that aren't even going to matter. Also, any study they do today will need to be (and would) be re-done when it's time to implement the plan because a study done today will be outdated by then.

There is not one single location - not one - that will not have traffic implications or that does not already have traffic concerns. Not one. Traffic is not going to be the factor that stops NES becoming swing space.

This is where you are wrong. Some locations may have unique factors that then don’t make sense as a 100 percent driveable location. The time to study is before the location is chosen because otherwise you’ve now pigeonholed the site, even if it makes no sense after studies are conducted.

Right. Kenmore didn't become a high school because of, wait for it.... traffic!

Well, sort of. The real reason is APS and Arlington County refuse to try to work with Ffx Co to be able to do what they say they need to do to increase access to the site. Traffic is cited as the reason but it's just a cover for "it's too hard." anytime something requires the cooperation of the County or another entity, APS says it can't be done because they don't have the authority.

Exactly this. APS doesn’t want to have to work with the county. Ever. Over anything.