What’s up with parents not wearing masks at the playground?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

re you seriously questioning whether masks are necessary in schools. Multiple studies have supported that masks and other mitigation strategies are the key to safely keeping schools open. And we need schools to stay open.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/sci...ssion_k_12_schools.html#ftn-50

"When mitigation strategies – especially mask use and physical distancing – are consistently and correctly used, the risk of transmission in the school environment is decreased.50 CDC’s school guidance for COVID-19 emphasizes 5 key mitigation strategies: consistent and correct use of masks, physical distancing, handwashing and respiratory etiquette, cleaning and ventilation, and contact tracing in combination with isolation and quarantine. Use of multiple strategies – sometimes called layered mitigation – provides greater protection in breaking transmission chains than implementing a single strategy.51 The guidance recommends layering two or more mitigation strategies, with particular emphasis on universal use of masks and physical distancing."

That doesn’t separate the effectiveness of individual NPIs or compare outcomes in mask vs. mask optional schools. We have had worse outcomes than countries that don’t expect students to mask.

- Pediatricians in Canada advise against kids wearing masks for the school day.

https://www.sickkids.ca/siteassets/news/news-archive/2020/covid19-recommendations-for-school-reopening-sickkids.pdf

- Denmark and Sweden haven’t required students to mask

- Norway requires masks during passing periods

- Germany didn’t require them when windows were open

We know some schools in Florida are mask optional. Florida has done no worse than California, where extended school closures continue to harm students.

Kids in Sweden have attended maskless, and this was prior to teacher vaccination.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2026670

Data from the Public Health Agency of Sweden (published report5 and personal communication) showed that fewer than 10 preschool teachers and 20 schoolteachers in Sweden received intensive care for Covid-19 up until June 30, 2020 (20 per 103,596 schoolteachers, which is equal to 19 per 100,000). As compared with other occupations (excluding health care workers), this corresponded to sex- and age-adjusted relative risks of 1.10 (95% confidence interval [CI], 0.49 to 2.49) among preschool teachers and 0.43 (95% CI, 0.28 to 0.68) among schoolteachers

But for secondary school teachers there was increased risk of illness without the masks.

So mask kids 12+ like Denmark. Masking 2-7 year olds al day long is cruel. Pediatricians in Canada agree.

I agree. I don’t know why we can’t have some middle ground here- some states have ditched masks altogether while here we force toddlers to wear them despite it being developmentally inappropriate and when it’s been shown transmission among young kids is low.

+1. Your daycare kids are going to have some funny looking ears. And I cannot understand why people think it’s fine for toddlers and preschoolers to go 5 days per week for an entire year, without seeing facial expressions. One day we will look back at our treatment of children during this pandemic with horror.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

re you seriously questioning whether masks are necessary in schools. Multiple studies have supported that masks and other mitigation strategies are the key to safely keeping schools open. And we need schools to stay open.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/more/sci...ssion_k_12_schools.html#ftn-50

"When mitigation strategies – especially mask use and physical distancing – are consistently and correctly used, the risk of transmission in the school environment is decreased.50 CDC’s school guidance for COVID-19 emphasizes 5 key mitigation strategies: consistent and correct use of masks, physical distancing, handwashing and respiratory etiquette, cleaning and ventilation, and contact tracing in combination with isolation and quarantine. Use of multiple strategies – sometimes called layered mitigation – provides greater protection in breaking transmission chains than implementing a single strategy.51 The guidance recommends layering two or more mitigation strategies, with particular emphasis on universal use of masks and physical distancing."

That doesn’t separate the effectiveness of individual NPIs or compare outcomes in mask vs. mask optional schools. We have had worse outcomes than countries that don’t expect students to mask.

- Pediatricians in Canada advise against kids wearing masks for the school day.

https://www.sickkids.ca/siteassets/news/news-archive/2020/covid19-recommendations-for-school-reopening-sickkids.pdf

- Denmark and Sweden haven’t required students to mask

- Norway requires masks during passing periods

- Germany didn’t require them when windows were open

We know some schools in Florida are mask optional. Florida has done no worse than California, where extended school closures continue to harm students.

Kids in Sweden have attended maskless, and this was prior to teacher vaccination.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2026670

Data from the Public Health Agency of Sweden (published report5 and personal communication) showed that fewer than 10 preschool teachers and 20 schoolteachers in Sweden received intensive care for Covid-19 up until June 30, 2020 (20 per 103,596 schoolteachers, which is equal to 19 per 100,000). As compared with other occupations (excluding health care workers), this corresponded to sex- and age-adjusted relative risks of 1.10 (95% confidence interval [CI], 0.49 to 2.49) among preschool teachers and 0.43 (95% CI, 0.28 to 0.68) among schoolteachers

But for secondary school teachers there was increased risk of illness without the masks.

So mask kids 12+ like Denmark. Masking 2-7 year olds al day long is cruel. Pediatricians in Canada agree.

I agree. I don’t know why we can’t have some middle ground here- some states have ditched masks altogether while here we force toddlers to wear them despite it being developmentally inappropriate and when it’s been shown transmission among young kids is low.

+1. Your daycare kids are going to have some funny looking ears. And I cannot understand why people think it’s fine for toddlers and preschoolers to go 5 days per week for an entire year, without seeing facial expressions. One day we will look back at our treatment of children during this pandemic with horror.

The kids 5 and under won’t even remember this year. Funny looking ears? Do you hear yourself? wtf is wrong with you

[Anonymous]

But for secondary school teachers there was increased risk of illness without the masks.


So mask kids 12+ like Denmark. Masking 2-7 year olds al day long is cruel. Pediatricians in Canada agree.


I agree. I don’t know why we can’t have some middle ground here- some states have ditched masks altogether while here we force toddlers to wear them despite it being developmentally inappropriate and when it’s been shown transmission among young kids is low.


+1. Your daycare kids are going to have some funny looking ears. And I cannot understand why people think it’s fine for toddlers and preschoolers to go 5 days per week for an entire year, without seeing facial expressions. One day we will look back at our treatment of children during this pandemic with horror.


The kids 5 and under won’t even remember this year. Funny looking ears? Do you hear yourself? wtf is wrong with you

What does not remembering it have to do with being harmful to their development? They aren’t getting something that’s of value most of their waking hours during the week? Are you going to argue that facial responses of caregivers are not important during early childhood development? There is a reason the WHO recommends against masking kids under 6. Their guidelines are much more thoughtful than CDC’s.

“Surgical masks with ear loops can be harmful to the correct development of the auricle by permanently modifying the cartilage of the concha in growing children.”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7302120/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

But for secondary school teachers there was increased risk of illness without the masks.


So mask kids 12+ like Denmark. Masking 2-7 year olds al day long is cruel. Pediatricians in Canada agree.


I agree. I don’t know why we can’t have some middle ground here- some states have ditched masks altogether while here we force toddlers to wear them despite it being developmentally inappropriate and when it’s been shown transmission among young kids is low.


+1. Your daycare kids are going to have some funny looking ears. And I cannot understand why people think it’s fine for toddlers and preschoolers to go 5 days per week for an entire year, without seeing facial expressions. One day we will look back at our treatment of children during this pandemic with horror.


The kids 5 and under won’t even remember this year. Funny looking ears? Do you hear yourself? wtf is wrong with you

What does not remembering it have to do with being harmful to their development? They aren’t getting something that’s of value most of their waking hours during the week? Are you going to argue that facial responses of caregivers are not important during early childhood development? There is a reason the WHO recommends against masking kids under 6. Their guidelines are much more thoughtful than CDC’s.

“Surgical masks with ear loops can be harmful to the correct development of the auricle by permanently modifying the cartilage of the concha in growing children.”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7302120/

Just sew elastics that go around their heads. Not that hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Next time I’ll wave to you OP! I’m definitely a maskless mom at the playground. I know you find this shocking but it has absolutely nothing to do with you.

NP. I do not give a damn if you and everyone of your entire family get covid and die but you have no right to endanger the lives of anyone else!

Are you...familiar with how correlated with age the outcomes on this are? The death ratios for 5-17 year-olds are 1/7,900 that of 85+ year-olds. Children without health conditions have basically zero risk of dying. Even for young and middle-aged adults, it's very low. If you're old or sick enough that your life is at risk in any substantive way, I have good news for you about vaccine availability.

The data from Israel show 20-30% of infected children have long haul symptoms. Hopefully you understand that some parents don’t want their kids saddled with chronic fatigue or breathing issues. That really affects your quality of life, and we are probably a few years out from understanding the pathology of the virus and the proper treatments. My friend works at an ICU and has seen 19 year olds come in with heart failure after an asymptomatic course of illness. Of course you are not in an ICU so you don’t understand close up what the disease does.

[Anonymous]

There is no way in hell I would send my baby to a daycare where the caregivers are masked all day long. That absolutely will have long term effects on these kids. Also putting a mask on a young child and expecting them to wear it all day long is cruel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Next time I’ll wave to you OP! I’m definitely a maskless mom at the playground. I know you find this shocking but it has absolutely nothing to do with you.

NP. I do not give a damn if you and everyone of your entire family get covid and die but you have no right to endanger the lives of anyone else!

Are you...familiar with how correlated with age the outcomes on this are? The death ratios for 5-17 year-olds are 1/7,900 that of 85+ year-olds. Children without health conditions have basically zero risk of dying. Even for young and middle-aged adults, it's very low. If you're old or sick enough that your life is at risk in any substantive way, I have good news for you about vaccine availability.

The data from Israel show 20-30% of infected children have long haul symptoms. Hopefully you understand that some parents don’t want their kids saddled with chronic fatigue or breathing issues. That really affects your quality of life, and we are probably a few years out from understanding the pathology of the virus and the proper treatments. My friend works at an ICU and has seen 19 year olds come in with heart failure after an asymptomatic course of illness. Of course you are not in an ICU so you don’t understand close up what the disease does.

Source, please? I don’t believe for a second the nineteen year olds you are describing were previously healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is no way in hell I would send my baby to a daycare where the caregivers are masked all day long. That absolutely will have long term effects on these kids. Also putting a mask on a young child and expecting them to wear it all day long is cruel.

I blame the CDC, not the parents. They are lacking in common sense, but honestly trying to follow public health guidelines while providing for their families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no way in hell I would send my baby to a daycare where the caregivers are masked all day long. That absolutely will have long term effects on these kids. Also putting a mask on a young child and expecting them to wear it all day long is cruel.

I blame the CDC, not the parents. They are lacking in common sense, but honestly trying to follow public health guidelines while providing for their families.

Yeah, find me a daycare where at least the caregivers aren’t wearing masks. I really wish the CDC would update the guidance for kids though. How can we bring attention to this issue?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no way in hell I would send my baby to a daycare where the caregivers are masked all day long. That absolutely will have long term effects on these kids. Also putting a mask on a young child and expecting them to wear it all day long is cruel.

I blame the CDC, not the parents. They are lacking in common sense, but honestly trying to follow public health guidelines while providing for their families.

Yeah, find me a daycare where at least the caregivers aren’t wearing masks. I really wish the CDC would update the guidance for kids though. How can we bring attention to this issue?

Canada’s pediatricians are bringing it to the attention through public documents like this one:

https://www.sickkids.ca/siteassets/news/news-archive/2020/covid19-recommendations-for-school-reopening-sickkids.pdf

The debate here is so toxic, many are afraid to speak up for children.

[Anonymous]

As long as the parents maintain a healthy distance from other people and refrain from sneezing 🤧 or coughing on others - then it is relatively safe.

Plus it is outdoors.

[Anonymous]

16:01 you are an idiot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:16:01 you are an idiot.

Sorry you see no downsides to masking young children. You’ll come around in 2022.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no way in hell I would send my baby to a daycare where the caregivers are masked all day long. That absolutely will have long term effects on these kids. Also putting a mask on a young child and expecting them to wear it all day long is cruel.

I blame the CDC, not the parents. They are lacking in common sense, but honestly trying to follow public health guidelines while providing for their families.

Yeah, find me a daycare where at least the caregivers aren’t wearing masks. I really wish the CDC would update the guidance for kids though. How can we bring attention to this issue?

Canada’s pediatricians are bringing it to the attention through public documents like this one:

https://www.sickkids.ca/siteassets/news/news-archive/2020/covid19-recommendations-for-school-reopening-sickkids.pdf

The debate here is so toxic, many are afraid to speak up for children.

I’m not afraid to speak up, but when I’ve mentioned it to the county they cite cdc as the reason for the requirement. How do you get cdc to re-evaluate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

But for secondary school teachers there was increased risk of illness without the masks.


So mask kids 12+ like Denmark. Masking 2-7 year olds al day long is cruel. Pediatricians in Canada agree.


I agree. I don’t know why we can’t have some middle ground here- some states have ditched masks altogether while here we force toddlers to wear them despite it being developmentally inappropriate and when it’s been shown transmission among young kids is low.


+1. Your daycare kids are going to have some funny looking ears. And I cannot understand why people think it’s fine for toddlers and preschoolers to go 5 days per week for an entire year, without seeing facial expressions. One day we will look back at our treatment of children during this pandemic with horror.


The kids 5 and under won’t even remember this year. Funny looking ears? Do you hear yourself? wtf is wrong with you

What does not remembering it have to do with being harmful to their development? They aren’t getting something that’s of value most of their waking hours during the week? Are you going to argue that facial responses of caregivers are not important during early childhood development? There is a reason the WHO recommends against masking kids under 6. Their guidelines are much more thoughtful than CDC’s.

“Surgical masks with ear loops can be harmful to the correct development of the auricle by permanently modifying the cartilage of the concha in growing children.”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7302120/

Just sew elastics that go around their heads. Not that hard.

Whenever we’ve tried the elastics around the head they slip down. My toddler still has slippery baby fine hair which probably doesn’t help, but I feel like I’m missing some special trick to make this easier for my 2yo. So many people here don’t seem to have trouble and I feel like an idiot.