Do students at universities form social groups based on family income levels?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two active threads on this topic is two too many. Your kids will be fine and won’t even think about this.

It does come up. When they are upperclassmen and in a position where they have to choose underclassmen for sororities, fraternities, clubs, replace themselves for various officer positions in different organizations, etc. some some ugliness around who gets voted on to get in or out and by whom and why absolutely crops up.

And they deal with it and learn lessons and move on, but it most certainly crops up.

Rarely. If there are huge differences it may come through but otherwise these things are usually based on factors other than income. Some kids may benefit in a positive way (“oh his dad is CFO of X”, etc) but even then it is maybe the tenth factor on the list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two active threads on this topic is two too many. Your kids will be fine and won’t even think about this.

It does come up. When they are upperclassmen and in a position where they have to choose underclassmen for sororities, fraternities, clubs, replace themselves for various officer positions in different organizations, etc. some some ugliness around who gets voted on to get in or out and by whom and why absolutely crops up.

And they deal with it and learn lessons and move on, but it most certainly crops up.

Rarely. If there are huge differences it may come through but otherwise these things are usually based on factors other than income. Some kids may benefit in a positive way (“oh his dad is CFO of X”, etc) but even then it is maybe the tenth factor on the list.

And some kids get dinged in a negative way with ugly comments made about their wardrobes or possessions or hair cuts. Socioeconomic status and it's markers are part of the conversation. That is reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two active threads on this topic is two too many. Your kids will be fine and won’t even think about this.

It does come up. When they are upperclassmen and in a position where they have to choose underclassmen for sororities, fraternities, clubs, replace themselves for various officer positions in different organizations, etc. some some ugliness around who gets voted on to get in or out and by whom and why absolutely crops up.

And they deal with it and learn lessons and move on, but it most certainly crops up.

Rarely. If there are huge differences it may come through but otherwise these things are usually based on factors other than income. Some kids may benefit in a positive way (“oh his dad is CFO of X”, etc) but even then it is maybe the tenth factor on the list.

And some kids get dinged in a negative way with ugly comments made about their wardrobes or possessions or hair cuts. Socioeconomic status and it's markers are part of the conversation. That is reality.

Read again. I said “if there are huge differences it may come through.” Focusing on the tails of the distribution is not the same as saying kids group by income level, especially when the middle runs a wide range at the types of schools discussed regularly here and those kids all intermix easily (like kids from $150k HHIs depending on cost of living area to, say, a couple of million).

[Anonymous]

This has absolutely never been an issue at my kids' schools. They all chose schools where Greek life is 20% or less, and none had any interest in it. Maybe that's why no one cared about anyone's family income. Normal people don't discuss their family's finances.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been thinking a lot about what 'prestige' really means in college admissions. From what I’ve observed, many mc parents are fixated on elite private schools — likely because they want to feel part of an exclusive group, and are drawn to features like smaller student-to-teacher ratios. But when it comes to actual education quality, there’s no significant difference between top public and private schools. What really sets these elite institutions apart is the concentration of wealth, which creates the illusion of prestige. Ironically, though, middle-class students often can’t afford to participate in the exclusive networks and activities of their wealthier peers.

A so-called elite school can actually be cheaper because they are able to offer significant aid even to middle class students. That is absolutely one of the reasons they are so competitive. And then the financial burden of paying tuition exists for every college from the bottom to the top.. so people want to use that money to go to the highest quality institution they can access.

I still don't see a significant financial advantage in attending a private elite university over a state flagship. The only real difference I’ve noticed is greater access to faculty (student/teacher ratio)

My kid (middle income) attend a Private Elite. He graduated with a startup he formed with 2 other wealthy kids. He would have never been able to do it without his close wealthy friends who bankrolled. He was the 50% brains behind it. They just got their 2nd round and it has been great. This would have never happened at my other kid’s public….it has nothing to do with education. But the network for a Private Elite is on another level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For example, do wealthy students often stick together — they tend to hang out on luxury private islands and build their own exclusive networks?

Yes, this was true at my Ivy back in the day. IDK if they were hanging out on luxury private islands, but they definitely hung out together at school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For example, do wealthy students often stick together — they tend to hang out on luxury private islands and build their own exclusive networks?

They do not hang out in wealth groups at either of my DCs ivies. There are highly aided students in the same groups as the moderately to very wealthy. New and old money. International and not.

[Anonymous]

They take entirely different classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been thinking a lot about what 'prestige' really means in college admissions. From what I’ve observed, many mc parents are fixated on elite private schools — likely because they want to feel part of an exclusive group, and are drawn to features like smaller student-to-teacher ratios. But when it comes to actual education quality, there’s no significant difference between top public and private schools. What really sets these elite institutions apart is the concentration of wealth, which creates the illusion of prestige. Ironically, though, middle-class students often can’t afford to participate in the exclusive networks and activities of their wealthier peers.

A so-called elite school can actually be cheaper because they are able to offer significant aid even to middle class students. That is absolutely one of the reasons they are so competitive. And then the financial burden of paying tuition exists for every college from the bottom to the top.. so people want to use that money to go to the highest quality institution they can access.

I still don't see a significant financial advantage in attending a private elite university over a state flagship. The only real difference I’ve noticed is greater access to faculty (student/teacher ratio)

If your family income is less than $250,000 per year and you have "typical family assets," you are not going to get a tuition bill from Princeton University if you can get yourself in there. That is what a lot of people would call a significant financial advantage.

Fixed it for you. I've run the net price calculator and we would be full pay at Princeton with a HHI of $150k. Not boo-hooing having assets, but this misconception drives me crazy.

+1

If you are full pay at Princeton at $150k HHI, it’s because your assets show that you are rich. Full stop. No ordinary family with that HHI would be full pay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yes. my dd is at Wisconsin and there's probably private school cliques but more common would be friend groups where the kids are from public schools (or maybe Catholic) in...say...McLean, New Canaan, Larchmont, Wellesley, Winnetka, Bethesda, La Jolla, Bryn Mawr, and Short Hills. Not the kids who are private yachting for spring break and flying out to Aspen to ski on the weekends but definitely similar life experiences being UMC in major metro areas. they're going out to eat together, they always new clothing/outfits for formals or themed parties, Ubers, that kind of thing.

This is wealthier than UMC. New Canaan and La Jolla, based upon personal experience, are wealthy places, and I suspect the other communities, mentioned here are as well.

Perhaps, not traveling abroad on breaks wealth, but still wealthy. A lot of UMC kids aren’t getting generous, if any, aid, and have to spend prudently with the funds their parents can provide and what they have earned. They aren’t often buying new outfits for formals or themed parties.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve been thinking a lot about what 'prestige' really means in college admissions. From what I’ve observed, many mc parents are fixated on elite private schools — likely because they want to feel part of an exclusive group, and are drawn to features like smaller student-to-teacher ratios. But when it comes to actual education quality, there’s no significant difference between top public and private schools. What really sets these elite institutions apart is the concentration of wealth, which creates the illusion of prestige. Ironically, though, middle-class students often can’t afford to participate in the exclusive networks and activities of their wealthier peers.

A so-called elite school can actually be cheaper because they are able to offer significant aid even to middle class students. That is absolutely one of the reasons they are so competitive. And then the financial burden of paying tuition exists for every college from the bottom to the top.. so people want to use that money to go to the highest quality institution they can access.

I still don't see a significant financial advantage in attending a private elite university over a state flagship. The only real difference I’ve noticed is greater access to faculty (student/teacher ratio)

If your family income is less than $250,000 per year and you have "typical family assets," you are not going to get a tuition bill from Princeton University if you can get yourself in there. That is what a lot of people would call a significant financial advantage.

Fixed it for you. I've run the net price calculator and we would be full pay at Princeton with a HHI of $150k. Not boo-hooing having assets, but this misconception drives me crazy.

+1

If you are full pay at Princeton at $150k HHI, it’s because your assets show that you are rich. Full stop. No ordinary family with that HHI would be full pay.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This has absolutely never been an issue at my kids' schools. They all chose schools where Greek life is 20% or less, and none had any interest in it. Maybe that's why no one cared about anyone's family income. Normal people don't discuss their family's finances.

This! Same. My kid’s friends at an Ivy are diverse. There is no way you would know the uber rich kid in the group was from $—so low key.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This has absolutely never been an issue at my kids' schools. They all chose schools where Greek life is 20% or less, and none had any interest in it. Maybe that's why no one cared about anyone's family income. Normal people don't discuss their family's finances.

This! Same. My kid’s friends at an Ivy are diverse. There is no way you would know the uber rich kid in the group was from $—so low key.

.

I would say the same except that they do segregate by type of high school. The private school kids (from DC, NYC, Boston, Northern California) tend to hang out together in a pretty tight group. They're all only spring freshman so maybe this will change over time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This has absolutely never been an issue at my kids' schools. They all chose schools where Greek life is 20% or less, and none had any interest in it. Maybe that's why no one cared about anyone's family income. Normal people don't discuss their family's finances.

This! Same. My kid’s friends at an Ivy are diverse. There is no way you would know the uber rich kid in the group was from $—so low key.

.

I would say the same except that they do segregate by type of high school. The private school kids (from DC, NYC, Boston, Northern California) tend to hang out together in a pretty tight group. They're all only spring freshman so maybe this will change over time.

Agree on the private school thing. Everyone knew everyone else before school even started.

[Anonymous]

Can you recommend any colleges in the top 50 where this does not happen? Maybe at large state flagships? I think my DC would not like this environment, current junior. We are donut hole family.