UVA info session today said “most rigorous in ALL 5 core subjects.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

That's why you max the rigor in your school. If AP Calc BC is offered at your high school, you take it. If Multivariable Calc is offered at your high school, you take it. If Linear Algebra is offered at your high school, you take it.

If it isn't, you take it at a community college.

Why not just get your degree from community college, at that rate? And go to UVA for grad school? That’s what you’re advocating, in practical terms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

I mean, what’s “post AP” at one school might not be post AP at another school.

They mean the classes you are eligible for after taking the AP year: as in Spanish literature only allowed after AP Span, Organic chemistry after AP chem, vector calc after AP calc BC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

You are wrong. Yale explicitly says on their website that DE, IB and AP are considered equally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

Half of math majors, not overall STEM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

You are wrong. Yale explicitly says on their website that DE, IB and AP are considered equally.

Yale is just saying that generically. For some high schools it could be similar . For many it is not nearly as rigorous. DE is completely fine in schools that do not offer the AP or IB equivalent. Maggie Walker considers AP to be superior. They strongly steer the top kids that way. They know what they are doing. They are the ones writing the counselor letter to colleges: the high school determines relative rigor and makes it clear to colleges what is top. At MGLWS, you’d better have AP calc not DE, and AP chem not DE, etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

Half of math majors, not overall STEM.

Itis overall stem. The schools have said it to parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

The acceptance rate for top public and independent schools into Ivies far exceeds that of public schools. It is not even close. Why is it okay for these students to take post-BC math but not a lowly regular public school attendee??

It seems to be a great equalizer, no? A typical public school ends math at Calc BC The exceptional students who want to take Multi/Linear Alg/Diff Equations and does so at the local community college are somehow going to be harmed by that? No, quite the contrary. They will benefit by it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

You are wrong. Yale explicitly says on their website that DE, IB and AP are considered equally.

Yale is just saying that generically. For some high schools it could be similar . For many it is not nearly as rigorous. DE is completely fine in schools that do not offer the AP or IB equivalent. Maggie Walker considers AP to be superior. They strongly steer the top kids that way. They know what they are doing. They are the ones writing the counselor letter to colleges: the high school determines relative rigor and makes it clear to colleges what is top. At MGLWS, you’d better have AP calc not DE, and AP chem not DE, etc

OP here. This was my clearest takeaway. That the HS guidance counselor making $75k year has a very outsize influence over the application. So cross your fingers that your kid's counselor thinks their courseload is "most rigorous"!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why this is so hard to grasp, or why this needs to be parsed nine ways to Sunday:

1) UVA is a competetive school for which to be admitted.

2) Given 1), the way to make yourself stand out is to have a stellar résumé.

3) The way to have a stellar résumé is to take the most challenging classes your school offers and do well in them.

4) And yes, that may include pursuing a foreign language as far as you can.

That's it, that's the formula.

But why a foreign language, why not take another 5th class as far as you can?

It is not foreign language over another core. It is in addition. Many high schools allow 6 core courses: the kids take the 5 main ones then “double up “ with a second science or second history. There are top10 colleges that expect this and say it in their literature, if it is an option at the high school. Prep schools have over 1/3 of students doing this starting 10th grade. The governors schools and the stem magnets have 6 core courses taken by many students. Foreign language for all 4 yrs of HS is not eliminating the option to double something else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

The acceptance rate for top public and independent schools into Ivies far exceeds that of public schools. It is not even close. Why is it okay for these students to take post-BC math but not a lowly regular public school attendee??

It seems to be a great equalizer, no? A typical public school ends math at Calc BC The exceptional students who want to take Multi/Linear Alg/Diff Equations and does so at the local community college are somehow going to be harmed by that? No, quite the contrary. They will benefit by it.

of course they are not harmed! It just is not necessary because the colleges will not expect ot like they do from a school where ot is offered. Yes absolutely an exceptional math student should do it if they can because once they are at the ivy/+ they will realize they are on par with others rather than behind a large chunk

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1/4 of Harvard students take beyond Calc BC, more than 1/4 of Princeton students take beyond Calc BC.

It is not unreasonable for seniors applying to UVA to have taken Calculus beyond Calc BC.

It is over half of entering freshman in Engineering and other stem majors at Princeton who have taken post-BC calc , same with Penn.
Most of them took it as a part of the normal high school curriculum. That is a widely taken path at top public and private day and boarding schools in NY NJ MA , and additionally very common for internationals (a large segment of engineering at these two schools). Thus these students are not taking random CC classes to get to post- BC: they are just taking the highest math path offered at their high school. It is in Virginia too as a normal path, but seems to be offered at only a few scattered schools. No college expects students to take rigor not offered at the high school: completely unnecessary.

Half of math majors, not overall STEM.

Itis overall stem. The schools have said it to parents.

Math majors, not overall STEM. There was a thread on this: "Half of Ivy League math majors took MV Calc and Linear Algebra in high school" https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1218951.page

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why this is so hard to grasp, or why this needs to be parsed nine ways to Sunday:

1) UVA is a competetive school for which to be admitted.

2) Given 1), the way to make yourself stand out is to have a stellar résumé.

3) The way to have a stellar résumé is to take the most challenging classes your school offers and do well in them.

4) And yes, that may include pursuing a foreign language as far as you can.

That's it, that's the formula.

But why a foreign language, why not take another 5th class as far as you can?

It is not foreign language over another core. It is in addition. Many high schools allow 6 core courses: the kids take the 5 main ones then “double up “ with a second science or second history. There are top10 colleges that expect this and say it in their literature, if it is an option at the high school. Prep schools have over 1/3 of students doing this starting 10th grade. The governors schools and the stem magnets have 6 core courses taken by many students. Foreign language for all 4 yrs of HS is not eliminating the option to double something else.

True, but its difficult if you also take 4 years of say, Choir or Band. Which ALSO look good on college apps. Also makes you look well-rounded and shows dedication to something artsy. In the end, its a bit of a crapshoot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is what we were told by our private college counselor. There are several “must” APs if your child is in FCPS and is applying to the UVA College of Arts and Sciences:

AP Lang
AP Calc - at least AB
APUSH (and avoid Online APUSH)
AP World Language

+ a science, like AP Bio, AP Chem or AP Physics.

Then add at least two or three more APs of your choice. Avoid DE classes in your core classes. Don’t try to take core classes from the online campus.

OP here. The same admissions officer I mentioned in my post claims that DE is viewed “equally” to AP. Take that how you will.

Maggie walker tells the top kids it is not considered equal unless it is post-AP. Admission results confirm the preference that not only UVA but ivies have strong AP preference. Maybe our DE just is not as good as other schools?

You are wrong. Yale explicitly says on their website that DE, IB and AP are considered equally.

Yale is just saying that generically. For some high schools it could be similar . For many it is not nearly as rigorous. DE is completely fine in schools that do not offer the AP or IB equivalent. Maggie Walker considers AP to be superior. They strongly steer the top kids that way. They know what they are doing. They are the ones writing the counselor letter to colleges: the high school determines relative rigor and makes it clear to colleges what is top. At MGLWS, you’d better have AP calc not DE, and AP chem not DE, etc

OP here. This was my clearest takeaway. That the HS guidance counselor making $75k year has a very outsize influence over the application. So cross your fingers that your kid's counselor thinks their courseload is "most rigorous"!

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know why this is so hard to grasp, or why this needs to be parsed nine ways to Sunday:

1) UVA is a competetive school for which to be admitted.

2) Given 1), the way to make yourself stand out is to have a stellar résumé.

3) The way to have a stellar résumé is to take the most challenging classes your school offers and do well in them.

4) And yes, that may include pursuing a foreign language as far as you can.

That's it, that's the formula.

But why a foreign language, why not take another 5th class as far as you can?

Why not a foreign language? It doesn’t seem any more or less worthy than the other topics on the list.

DP here. I think that’s the point. Why can’t kids develop “sufficient rigor” in a variety of ways? Why is there only one accepted path to “most rigorous” when so many schools offer so many AP options.

Presumably because they want kids to demonstrate rigor across a variety of subjects, including ones that they aren’t naturally inclined towards, rather than already specializing in high school.