TJ Falls to 14th in the Nation Per US News

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

The FCPS Board was clear that they wanted the opportunity to attend TJ to extend to more of the county's students. They were not concerned about a slip in rankings and never said they were. It's the crazies on this board that said things like "The admissions changes led to a much stronger student body (by weeding out test preppers, etc.)." They were clearly wrong. Again, they are in denial about that but the FCPS Board was OK with it because the school should serve the full county and every middle school. I'm OK with that but let's not pretend it results in the best and brightest. A trade off that I for one and OK with but I freely admit that Asian students are denied seats they would otherwise have in a true merit-based system in order to further a different, and apparently legal, purpose.

Equity warriors throwing in the towel so soon? Essay Admissions was supposed to uncover the Einsteins from the bottom schools, who apparently are much more advanced in STEM than the prepped Asians with years of enrichment. Now that the silly Essay admissions is doing nothing more than simply letting in 150 Algebra 1 kids each year straight into remedial, it's time to explain away the decline?

The school Board never claimed that was the case. It was opening the door to more of the county's students. They never claimed what the equity warriors wished the case would be. The Board knew, and prepared for, a student body that was not at the academic math level of prior years. They were transparent in this process.

How is admitting 150 algebra1 students to TJ class bottom to struggle with remedial math considered anything but opening door to fail?

Why do some posters keep labeling the Algebra 1 students (taking geometry at TJ) as remedial. Algebra in 8th is still 1 year ahead of normal pacing.

They resent students whose parents didn't splurge on outside enrichment taking up space in these programs. They feel selection should be limited to students from the wealthier schools who have had more opportunities and exposure.

It's funny to me because when I graduated like 49% of the class was in Geometry in 9th, 49% was in Algebra 2/Trig, and like 2% in Pr-Calculus. I know college is supposed to be so much more competitive now, but in terms of being able to do math there was really no difference among the 98% of us not in Pre-Calc. The triply advanced kids truly did stand out.

You have your answer. Now parents think they must be triply advanced in order to stand out for MIT admissions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Can you explain how this works with a race-blind process that is required by law in the US?

The US New rating forumula (which is what PP was talking about) is not governed by US law.

Yes, the lack of diversity at TJ is costing them their ranking.

[Anonymous]

The only reason why Us News and World Report is still in business is their totally made up school and college rankings. At the end of the day your kid is either going to sink or swim based on their academic record.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Can you explain how this works with a race-blind process that is required by law in the US?

The US New rating forumula (which is what PP was talking about) is not governed by US law.

Yes, the lack of diversity at TJ is costing them their ranking.

So, why TJ’s ranking is getting worse not better?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

The way they are ranking the schools have changed in the last couple of years to include underserved including within FCPS. That is the reason even many good elementary and middle schools lost rankings due to this/similar criteria. So looks like FCPS approach was to increase TJ class from 450 to 550 and increase diversity otherwise ranking will tank in future years. In case of TJ as you know there were (and are) very few underserved and those people do struggle with TJ workload unfortunately. Earlier in the thread they talked about what TJ is doing to bring kids to certain level of math including teaching middle school math at TJ. I guess that is what TJ has to do to the underserved community or whoever needs help to get this 10% score in US News. Overall the TJ quality has not dropped.....it is still extremely competitive particularly among kids that came from Feeder schools. End of the day, colleges know the kind of kids that apply from TJ and I don't think they care about whether TJ is 1 or 4 or 14. They know what they are getting.

I have a feeling Basis. Appears so many times. A school with Graduation Rate N/1 is #1 and TJ 100% graduation and 99.8 college readness is #14?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

This is the first year that includes class of 25 data (from their freshman year).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only reason why Us News and World Report is still in business is their totally made up school and college rankings. At the end of the day your kid is either going to sink or swim based on their academic record.

Who cares about US News rankings. Yes, it all comes down to what the student does for colleges to accept them not because of TJ rankings. Whether MIT or Harvard is #1 or #5 does it matter? Do you say don't apply to Harvard because now it is #5 or something. Disregard these rankings. If the kid is in a good school and is challenged that is all matters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Can you explain how this works with a race-blind process that is required by law in the US?

The US New rating forumula (which is what PP was talking about) is not governed by US law.

Yes, the lack of diversity at TJ is costing them their ranking.

So, why TJ’s ranking is getting worse not better?

the county has a large share of black and Hispanic students that are not being fairly represented at TJ

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

This is the first year that includes class of 25 data (from their freshman year).

For rankings they have used 12th grade enrollment during the 2021-2022 - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

This is the first year that includes class of 25 data (from their freshman year).

For rankings they have used 12th grade enrollment during the 2021-2022 - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

They consider all four years of student SOL data not just the senior year. Weather a school should be included in ranking at all, is determined by if that school has at least 15 students in 12th grade. So this data includes 2025 freshman admitted without merit criteria.

"This is the count of public high schools that had a 12th grade enrollment of 15 students or greater, or otherwise had sufficient enrollment in other high school grades, during the 2021-2022 school year to be analyzed. "

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Nice try, but not correct. US News Diversity component includes Asians, who are firmly minority by the way with 6%, much less than Hispanic: 18.5% Black: 12.2%

Read - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

Underserved Student Performance (10%)

This is a measure assessing learning outcomes only among Black, Hispanic and low-income students. This evaluates how well this underserved subgroup scored on state assessments compared with the average for nonunderserved students among schools in the same state. Schools performing above the 50th percentile nationally in this comparison received the highest score, while other schools’ scores decreased the greater the distance between their underserved students and their state’s median for nonunderserved students.

What you are saying is with more Black and Hispanic admissions, TJ should be better that in the old system. However, better the drop in academic performance outweighed the gain in diversity. Hence, TJ’s overall ranking dropped in two consecutive years.

This is the first year that includes class of 25 data (from their freshman year).

For rankings they have used 12th grade enrollment during the 2021-2022 - https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/articles/how-us-news-calculated-the-rankings

They consider all four years of student SOL data not just the senior year. Weather a school should be included in ranking at all, is determined by if that school has at least 15 students in 12th grade. So this data includes 2025 freshman admitted without merit criteria.

"This is the count of public high schools that had a 12th grade enrollment of 15 students or greater, or otherwise had sufficient enrollment in other high school grades, during the 2021-2022 school year to be analyzed. "

Correct but in case of TJ, I was saying they used just 2022 Seniors data

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Diversity in the school (Blacks, Hispanics, Low income) had 10% weightage too and class of 2022 lacked that which could have costed the ranking

Can you explain how this works with a race-blind process that is required by law in the US?

The US New rating forumula (which is what PP was talking about) is not governed by US law.

Yes, the lack of diversity at TJ is costing them their ranking.

So, why TJ’s ranking is getting worse not better?

the county has a large share of black and Hispanic students that are not being fairly represented at TJ

So, why adding more Black and Hispanic students worsens the ranking? It should make the ranking better if your logic is right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only reason why Us News and World Report is still in business is their totally made up school and college rankings. At the end of the day your kid is either going to sink or swim based on their academic record.

Who cares about US News rankings. Yes, it all comes down to what the student does for colleges to accept them not because of TJ rankings. Whether MIT or Harvard is #1 or #5 does it matter? Do you say don't apply to Harvard because now it is #5 or something. Disregard these rankings. If the kid is in a good school and is challenged that is all matters.

Spot on. What is with the perverse obsession with a national ranking?