Which universities have gone DOWN in stature over the years?

[Anonymous]

UVA

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Crest University. Now totally eclipsed by Colgate.

Colgate has risen so fast. I’m hearing acceptance rate is around 12% for 2026.

Did you not recognize the sarcasm in that post...? Crest....Colgate...

[Anonymous]

Syracuse

The Newhouse school has backslid quite a bit and I’m surprised that it’s still a T75 university

[Anonymous]

Regional state universities and small liberal arts colleges that were founded before air travel became prevalent. Once that happened, nobody need to stick to their hometown college.

[Anonymous]

Miami University (the one in Ohio)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Syracuse

The Newhouse school has backslid quite a bit and I’m surprised that it’s still a T75 university

Wrong.

[Anonymous]

school of mines

[Anonymous]

Stevens Institute

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Crest University. Now totally eclipsed by Colgate.

Colgate has risen so fast. I’m hearing acceptance rate is around 12% for 2026.

Did you not recognize the sarcasm in that post...? Crest....Colgate...

Colgate's appeal is cresting. . .

[Anonymous]

University of New Hampshire
University of Maine

[Anonymous]

Bard

[Anonymous]

Boulder

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M is an obvious answer.

Ranking drop from 32 -> 38.
Acceptance rate went from 33% to 42%, higher than large publics like UT Austin and UMD. While large publics like Berkeley are reaching single-digit acceptance rates, W&M's is increasing.

Student enrollment has increased.

Their law school has gone completely downhill.

W&M used to be more difficult to get into than UVA, due to a smaller number seats. It had higher SAT scores than UVA, the highest among publics comparable to Berkley. It was compared to the smaller Ivies like Dartmouth/Brown and SLACs like Swarthmore. It attracted out-of-staters and wealthy internationals that would never consider a large public for OOS tuition, but would consider W&M due to the size and feel.

Nowadays, UVA is far more tougher to get in, has far higher SAT scores and far great national and international reach.

Per most recent CDS:

UVA 25th/75th percentile SAT - 1330-1490
W&M 25th/75th percentile SAT - 1360-1520

both have average GPAs of 4.3.

Perhaps W&M’s higher acceptance rate is a function of some other factor other than the caliber of students they attract. Maybe since UVA and has more prominent sports and a better college town and is bigger it appeals to more kids who apply that are more borderline. W&M is bit more niche in that it a very small public, so more like a SLAC. Williamsburg is pretty sleepy too.

Maybe, just maybe, acceptance rate is not a good indication of how good a school is at any rate.

NNo they don't., the GPA of the actual class that enrolled at UVA last fall had a 4.52 at the 75th percentile, a 4.39 at the median and a 4.23 for the bottom 25th percentile. W&M's student profile runs lower: 4.50 at the 75th, 4.30 at the 50th and a 4.08 at the bottom 25th.


UVA also beats W&M wiht ACT scores, the 74th/50th/30th percentiles are 35/34/32 for UVA and for W&M the ACTSare 34/33/31

At the 75th percentile, SAT score/GPA is 1520/4.50 at W&M and 1510/4.52 at UVA. Virtually the same. The difference in the last couple of years has been at the lower half, with UVA higher. It used to be the opposite if you look at SCHEV historical data. When W&M had higher average SAT scores than UVA, I did not think UVA is in decline. I just think there are trends that play out over some period of time and then new trends emerge. W&M needs to get more applicants to better fill out the bottom half stats.

In USNEWS rankings, both UVA and W&M have been hurt by the inclusion of the social mobility metrics based on Pell Grant recipients. Both schools are relatively low in percentage of students receiving Pell Grants particularly compared to schools in other states like the UC universities. Outside of that, the big movers in USNWR in my recollection have been private universities (Chicago, Vanderbilt, Northeastern, etc.) They seem to have more levers to pull in rankings than public schools.

They are not virtually the same. UVA is higher in 8 categories than W&M. Also you conveniently didn't address the ACT issue. ACT scores get exponentially more difficult to get closer to the top of the pyramid. A 36 is achieved by only 3,655 - 4,4,044 (changes every year) of the 1.6M taking the test, or .313% of the students taking it. A 35 is only 11,983 students .925% of test applicants nationwide. The fact that the 75th percentile of enrolled student at UVA has a 35 or better is astounding. W&M can boast only a 34 taps into a different level below. Here's the chart


ACT Score # of Students Percentage of All Test Takers
36 4,055 0.313%
35 11,983 0.925%
34 15,875 1.226%
33 18,424 1.422%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M is an obvious answer.

Ranking drop from 32 -> 38.
Acceptance rate went from 33% to 42%, higher than large publics like UT Austin and UMD. While large publics like Berkeley are reaching single-digit acceptance rates, W&M's is increasing.

Student enrollment has increased.

Their law school has gone completely downhill.

W&M used to be more difficult to get into than UVA, due to a smaller number seats. It had higher SAT scores than UVA, the highest among publics comparable to Berkley. It was compared to the smaller Ivies like Dartmouth/Brown and SLACs like Swarthmore. It attracted out-of-staters and wealthy internationals that would never consider a large public for OOS tuition, but would consider W&M due to the size and feel.

Nowadays, UVA is far more tougher to get in, has far higher SAT scores and far great national and international reach.

Per most recent CDS:

UVA 25th/75th percentile SAT - 1330-1490
W&M 25th/75th percentile SAT - 1360-1520

both have average GPAs of 4.3.

Perhaps W&M’s higher acceptance rate is a function of some other factor other than the caliber of students they attract. Maybe since UVA and has more prominent sports and a better college town and is bigger it appeals to more kids who apply that are more borderline. W&M is bit more niche in that it a very small public, so more like a SLAC. Williamsburg is pretty sleepy too.

Maybe, just maybe, acceptance rate is not a good indication of how good a school is at any rate.

NNo they don't., the GPA of the actual class that enrolled at UVA last fall had a 4.52 at the 75th percentile, a 4.39 at the median and a 4.23 for the bottom 25th percentile. W&M's student profile runs lower: 4.50 at the 75th, 4.30 at the 50th and a 4.08 at the bottom 25th.


UVA also beats W&M wiht ACT scores, the 74th/50th/30th percentiles are 35/34/32 for UVA and for W&M the ACTSare 34/33/31

At the 75th percentile, SAT score/GPA is 1520/4.50 at W&M and 1510/4.52 at UVA. Virtually the same. The difference in the last couple of years has been at the lower half, with UVA higher. It used to be the opposite if you look at SCHEV historical data. When W&M had higher average SAT scores than UVA, I did not think UVA is in decline. I just think there are trends that play out over some period of time and then new trends emerge. W&M needs to get more applicants to better fill out the bottom half stats.

In USNEWS rankings, both UVA and W&M have been hurt by the inclusion of the social mobility metrics based on Pell Grant recipients. Both schools are relatively low in percentage of students receiving Pell Grants particularly compared to schools in other states like the UC universities. Outside of that, the big movers in USNWR in my recollection have been private universities (Chicago, Vanderbilt, Northeastern, etc.) They seem to have more levers to pull in rankings than public schools.

They are not virtually the same. UVA is higher in 8 categories than W&M. Also you conveniently didn't address the ACT issue. ACT scores get exponentially more difficult to get closer to the top of the pyramid. A 36 is achieved by only 3,655 - 4,4,044 (changes every year) of the 1.6M taking the test, or .313% of the students taking it. A 35 is only 11,983 students .925% of test applicants nationwide. The fact that the 75th percentile of enrolled student at UVA has a 35 or better is astounding. W&M can boast only a 34 taps into a different level below. Here's the chart


ACT Score # of Students Percentage of All Test Takers
36 4,055 0.313%
35 11,983 0.925%
34 15,875 1.226%
33 18,424 1.422%

The PP said they are virtually the same at the 75th percentile for SAT and GPA. You are missing or ignoring that point.

[Anonymous]

It's important to recognize that the concept of "stature" as it's thrown around on this site often has little to do with educational quality.

Small liberal arts colleges have been hurt (generally) in "stature" - not quality - by the bias of the stupid USNWR rankings towards large research universities. Which has led to the ghettoization of SLACs like Williams and Amherst on a separate list and the under-ranking of low-research "universities" like Dartmouth and Brown -- notwithstanding that the best of these are generally assessed as offering a better undergraduate educational experience. Those undergraduate-focused schools aren't hurting - they're growing their programs and endowment, they continue to turn away 8.5 or 9 applicants for every one they accept, more than half the students who are admitted chose to attend them, and their alums continue to out-earn those from bigger undergraduate diploma mills. But all that said, in terms of "stature" or "prestige" or the other dumb non-educational 'popularity/buzz' measures that DCUM airheads and uninformed chatter about endlessly, the smaller schools have come to be perceived as being somehow less prestigious (admittedly to a population of idiots), and less likely to attract common apps from families (because let's be honest, parents are a big part of the problem here) that are more focused on prestige/stature and rankings than on education quality.

A generation ago, it was harder (and reasonably so) to get into Amherst and Williams than into most Ivies; now it's easier to get into Williams than it is to get into Rice or USC (or fraudulent Columbia), which is simply bizarre and indefensible if we're talking about the quality of an undergraduate education. And another example of how the inventors/perpetrators of the USNWR ranking scheme have done great harm to US higher education and its users and should, if there's any justice, forever rot in hell.