Plane crash DCA?

[Anonymous]

Women and men can both at fault. However it doesn't mean she is at fault because she is a happen. Anyone can make the same mistake. Wouldn't matter if it was her or the other pilot who was a man. They paid with their lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:The female pilot is believed to have been commanding the helicopter, her name is being intentionally withheld

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

Per family request.

They are no doubt worried about death threats and other violence.

I'm a female pilot. Given the tone from our government leaders and the witch hunts taking place online ... if I were involved in an accident, knowing I'd likely be the only female crew member from either airplane, I would want my family protected from the media as long as possible. I don't blame them for trying to shield her memory and reputation until more is known about the actual events of the crash.

That’s a superficial response.

You withhold information when yours covering something up or hiding something. They can go hang out at a mountain house and let the name come out.

The pilot Bo doubt has a stellar education, background, top of their class, best training and track record of success. Otherwise how would you continually get to the point where you’re flying a $6m helicopter.

It’s a rationed response. Unfortunately the president doesn’t see that she was as qualified or more so than the men, which is unfortunately why we’re here.

Then shut it down and show her 20 year track record. Put some peer side by sides there too.

It does not matter. I don’t think people understand how much it does not matter. The US president already stoked the idea that someone of people are to blame because they have an immutable trait. Not a single GOP senator pushed back on that highly offensive narrative. I didn’t see any military members protesting that service men missing limbs deserved to work in the FAA because they were competent, not because they were a diversity matter.

This woman’s family will receive death threats, no matter how accomplished she was, no matter that two other white males were in the plane and saw no problem with flying too high, or off course.

She will be blamed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The female pilot is believed to have been commanding the helicopter, her name is being intentionally withheld

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

Per family request.

They are no doubt worried about death threats and other violence.

I'm a female pilot. Given the tone from our government leaders and the witch hunts taking place online ... if I were involved in an accident, knowing I'd likely be the only female crew member from either airplane, I would want my family protected from the media as long as possible. I don't blame them for trying to shield her memory and reputation until more is known about the actual events of the crash.

That’s a superficial response.

You withhold information when yours covering something up or hiding something. They can go hang out at a mountain house and let the name come out.

The pilot Bo doubt has a stellar education, background, top of their class, best training and track record of success. Otherwise how would you continually get to the point where you’re flying a $6m helicopter.

It’s a rationed response. Unfortunately the president doesn’t see that she was as qualified or more so than the men, which is unfortunately why we’re here.

Then shut it down and show her 20 year track record. Put some peer side by sides there too.

Maybe her family just doesn't want to deal with this kind of witch hunt while they are grieving. Her record will be known to the military and the NTSB, which is enough.

Families of the male pilots chose to make their names public. That's their choice, and understandable since people don't immediately start screaming demands to see a "20 year track record" when they hear a male name - there's a unstated assumption that he's qualified, nobody questions it. People don't give the female pilot that benefit of doubt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The CRJ was banking to the left so the helicopter was seeing the bottom of the plane where there are far fewer lights.

I think this is just a case of human error. They were looking at another plane, didn't see this one as it was coming from a different direction and flew into it. Human error is always a possible risk and that is why air spaces need to be as safe as possible and have as many contingencies as possible to account for human error and prevent tragedy. Which is usually what happens and is what happened the day before.

The investigation won't necessarily be about assigning blame but what changes need to happen to prevent this happening again.

I agree with the bolded and generally with the the idea that this is likely a case of human error for which we need to better insulate the system.

However I disagree that we can know what the helicopter pilot saw or why they did what they did at this point. I know many people, including many fellow pilots, are eager to say that this was an understandable mistake based on visibility in that corridor at this time of night. I think it is important those perspectives are heard and accounted for -- that may indeed have been what happened.

But we don't KNOW that's what happened. There are other factors here, including the helicopter's last minute maneuvers that brought it directly into collision with the airplane (veering SW and rising over 100 ft in altitude in a short period of time). To be clear, I do NOT think this is evidence that it was intentional. I just think it's weird and it's not explained by the speculation that the helicopter could not see the plane. If this were just a question of the helicopter not seeing the plane, presumably they would have maintained their current trajectory, right? The only direction they received from ATC was to go behind the plan, which even if they thought it was further away, "behind" a plane approaching either runway at National would mean moving to the east, not to the west.

There are too many unanswered questions for us to conclude what happened based on the commentary of other helicopter pilots who have flown that route. Their input is very helpful but not a full answer.

I agree, it is all speculation at this point. However those with expertise can speculate in a more informed way than the rest of us so if I am going to read speculation, I would rather hear from those with more experience and expertise. No one knows for sure what happened at all yet. That answer will be months away and may never be fully answered.

The examination of the path that I was reading by pilots was that there was no sudden SW manouever, they just adjusted from Route 1 to Route 4. Many of the released graphics in the news are inaccurate according to the pilots. Much of the pilot discussion is more technical than I can understand but they did not see any manouever of concern and had many explanations for the change in altitude that were mundane.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:That POS president has taken away her family, her friends, the public's right to mourn her. Shame on him! He needs to go back to h#ll where he came from.

I'm no trump supporter but he hasn't done that. Her family chose to hide this information from the public who have a right to know. More importantly, the families of those killed because of her error (if it was actually unintentional), deserve to know who caused them to lose their family member. Her mistake cost lives and saying it would affect her family doesn't cut it.

So you’re assuming it was just her error, and hers alone. Go away, you miserable excuse for a human being.

DP. We don’t know whose “fault” is was, but when the military helicopter you are flying is flown directly into a commercial jet, killing 64 people, you aren’t owed privacy, especially when the other two in the helicopter have been named

Sorry. You’re wrong.

The family does not deserve death threats from your crazy maga colleagues scared of DEI and brown skin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That POS president has taken away her family, her friends, the public's right to mourn her. Shame on him! He needs to go back to h#ll where he came from.

I'm no trump supporter but he hasn't done that. Her family chose to hide this information from the public who have a right to know. More importantly, the families of those killed because of her error (if it was actually unintentional), deserve to know who caused them to lose their family member. Her mistake cost lives and saying it would affect her family doesn't cut it.

So you’re assuming it was just her error, and hers alone. Go away, you miserable excuse for a human being.

DP. We don’t know whose “fault” is was, but when the military helicopter you are flying is flown directly into a commercial jet, killing 64 people, you aren’t owed privacy, especially when the other two in the helicopter have been named

+1 Exactly! And it suggests that they know it was her fault.

Seizure?
Passed out?
Bad spasms?

I mean what happened!?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:My BIL works for Southwest and they are known to have a super Trumpy culture amongst pilots, I wonder what they are thinking these days with all of his nonsense.

Most of my fellow pilots lean right. Some far right. Many of them have been spouting the DEI nonsense in aviation for years. I guarantee you all of them will lay this on the tower controllers and the controllers union for making it difficult for the govt to hire/fire controllers. As someone who is more center of the road there is more than a small amount of truth to this.

I've posted this earlier but there is an ongoing class action lawsuit precisely bc the ATC created a biographical questionnaire that screened out white men in favor of women and poc. As far I know its no longer being used and I don't think DEI has anything to do with this particular incident, but it did happen and qualified white men--who had already spent ten of thousands of dollars of their own money to got to ATC school-- were turned away based on that questionnaire alone. It's Brigida v DoT and it's been making it's way through the courts for like 10 years now...there's another system that could use an overhaul.

ATC also dropped the college aviation degree prerequisite the last 10 years. We had friends with college loans to do that program, they graduated and then poof, didn’t matter!

Trump administration actually added additional DEI hiring requirements in 2019, though he likely has no idea. There has never been a political puppet quite like this clown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There’s absolutely no way they did not see this plane. Goggles or not. Look at this angle. The light from the plane is illuminating strongly enough to be captured in this manner.

https://www.nbcnews.com/video/security-footage-shows-new-angles-of-d-c-crash-230772805611

That is the clearest video I have seen so far. And you are right, no way in h*** they didn't see that plane. Adds to my belief that this was intentional.

Wow super clear footage. It says it was from a security camera; I wonder which building.

You have no idea the perspective of the helicopter from that video. The plane banked to land on a different runway. When you're driving down a street with no divider you are assuming the cars coming at you are going to stay in their lane. When instead they decide to turn into a business on your side of the street, you can be taken aback.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The female pilot is believed to have been commanding the helicopter, her name is being intentionally withheld

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

Per family request.

They are no doubt worried about death threats and other violence.

I'm a female pilot. Given the tone from our government leaders and the witch hunts taking place online ... if I were involved in an accident, knowing I'd likely be the only female crew member from either airplane, I would want my family protected from the media as long as possible. I don't blame them for trying to shield her memory and reputation until more is known about the actual events of the crash.

That’s a superficial response.

You withhold information when yours covering something up or hiding something. They can go hang out at a mountain house and let the name come out.

The pilot Bo doubt has a stellar education, background, top of their class, best training and track record of success. Otherwise how would you continually get to the point where you’re flying a $6m helicopter.

It’s a rationed response. Unfortunately the president doesn’t see that she was as qualified or more so than the men, which is unfortunately why we’re here.

Then shut it down and show her 20 year track record. Put some peer side by sides there too.

Probably isn’t a 20 yr track record. Hegseth initially said the crew of
Helicopter was a young captain, Warren office, and staff Sargent. The staff Sargent and chief warrant officer have been named. That leaves a female “young captain” with 500 flying hrs. Given rank and flying hours, that is probably 2-3 yrs out of flight school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What a coincidence that Elon used this every example to rail against DEI. To be clear, I disagree with him 110%. But it sure seems like it is one of his personal missions.

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/elon-musk-boeing-dei-diversity-x-posts-pilots-rcna133351

He can’t even grow a real beard.

That aside, he is the one who had the FAA director resign on Jan 20.

Blood is on Musk’s hands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't blame the family for wanting privacy, but it is clearly not only her fault. I do believe the BH was solely at fault but there were three people on board. Who knows what happened or should have happened. It's obvious though that more than one person screwed up.

This.

It seems like a 3-person failure. Not one of them saw the correct plane, despite verbal acknowledgement? That's not a one-person error.

No.

Look at the radar nappi

That was the only plane south of the bridge in their line of sight. The JAZZ 789 had not taken off when they first gave visual confirmation of the CRJ. Something else definitely happened and I am waiting for the black box recordings to be released (but knowing how army covers up everything I doubt we will here it all).

Wasn't there another plane coming in? I live in Alexandria, and can see the line of planes coming from the south. I thought some were saying the BH had eyes on the plane behind the one they were about to hit.

No.

Look at the radar mapping.

Runway 1 line was way south of Winston bridge in a line. Airbuses and 737s

Runway 3 planes, regional jets, swing East over Maryland a bit and then cut over the river by DCA on an angle to land.

There was the CRJ on the slight left/east of the BH doing its runway 3 approach, 10s of seconds away. And then way south was the runway 1 plane queue, minutes away.

Wrong

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The female pilot is believed to have been commanding the helicopter, her name is being intentionally withheld

https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

Per family request.

They are no doubt worried about death threats and other violence.

I'm a female pilot. Given the tone from our government leaders and the witch hunts taking place online ... if I were involved in an accident, knowing I'd likely be the only female crew member from either airplane, I would want my family protected from the media as long as possible. I don't blame them for trying to shield her memory and reputation until more is known about the actual events of the crash.

That’s a superficial response.

You withhold information when yours covering something up or hiding something. They can go hang out at a mountain house and let the name come out.

The pilot Bo doubt has a stellar education, background, top of their class, best training and track record of success. Otherwise how would you continually get to the point where you’re flying a $6m helicopter.

It’s a rationed response. Unfortunately the president doesn’t see that she was as qualified or more so than the men, which is unfortunately why we’re here.

Then shut it down and show her 20 year track record. Put some peer side by sides there too.

Maybe her family just doesn't want to deal with this kind of witch hunt while they are grieving. Her record will be known to the military and the NTSB, which is enough.

Families of the male pilots chose to make their names public. That's their choice, and understandable since people don't immediately start screaming demands to see a "20 year track record" when they hear a male name - there's a unstated assumption that he's qualified, nobody questions it. People don't give the female pilot that benefit of doubt.

Stop conflating things.

Deliberately hiding information when 70 died in a horrific accident is a bad look. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does it mean that the help requested visual separation. What other options were available?

Many experts have stated “visual separation” means the helo is assuming full responsibility for staying away from the plane. Helo pilot does this twice.

Please watch the info videos. This has been explained countless times.

So ATC could have denied the request, knowing how closely the paths were crossing. Did they grant the request because they were understaffed and allowed a too risky situation?

Why did the ATC grant visual separation if the BH was flying 100 ft over maximum altitude? Doesn’t the radar show how high they are flying?

In the last few seconds before impact, the helicopter increased altitude suddenly, causing the collision. This can be seen on all the radar and traffic. At the time ATC asked for visual separation, the chopper was at 200 feet. And then it went higher, and that’s really the biggest mystery here.