McLean to Explore Separating from FC & FCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if fairfax water could charge McLean residents a high enough rate to make up for all of the lost tax revenue. I also wonder where they’ll locate their landfill - I doubt fairfax will continue to offer up theirs

Of course they will.

why on earth would they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if fairfax water could charge McLean residents a high enough rate to make up for all of the lost tax revenue. I also wonder where they’ll locate their landfill - I doubt fairfax will continue to offer up theirs

Of course they will.

why on earth would they?

You don't think this can be worked out by contracting? Why on earth wouldn't they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im confused. Does McLean want to become a city just like Fairfax City, City of Falls Church, or just break off their own schools? Because this seems to be to be all about schools vs any other municipal services.

I guess my first question would be why you expect Fairfax County to just give you its school buildings/properties/other municipal buildings if you are going to secede from the county? These properties(Ie the land they are built on) are worth millions!

The county has no way to unlock that value without investing many millions more in school facilities elsewhere. That is why such facilities are often ceded to seceding jurisdictions - the county would actually be relieved of the obligations associated with their existing dedicated use. If you think it would be a bad deal for the county, you are acknowledging the county benefits by treating McLean as a cash cow without providing a reciprocal level of services.

Why would Fairfax County give the land away though? Regardless of whats housed there—schools or parks or a warehouse, its land the county owns. Why would it give this land to a seceding jurisdiction?

Because the net worth associated with the land isn't what you think it is - there are liabilities (in terms of future obligations) inextricably linked to those properties.

there are no liabilities if they just sell the land to developers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if fairfax water could charge McLean residents a high enough rate to make up for all of the lost tax revenue. I also wonder where they’ll locate their landfill - I doubt fairfax will continue to offer up theirs

Actually most of McLean's trash is handled by private companies who contract with the dumps. So that would not be a service that the new City of McLean would have to provide. Fairfax water is a non-profit and could not profit on its water sales to provide additional revenue to the county.

Great ideas though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think maybe we disagree on what public schools mean in a fundamental way if you believe that the price of the house a child's family can afford should directly determine the quality of their public school education. Maybe you should get a cheaper house and pay for private school.

what is your understanding of it?

DP. Public school is for all people, not just the stellar students, the bright kids, the academically inclined. Or the rich. That's why my kids go to public school.

im trying to understand how PP thinks that people who pay into public schools should not expect decent schools and some semblance of competence ... unless they're poor?

are you saying that McLean residents do not get decent schools and competence? because they do. they also complain a lot.

You consider dilapidated trailers decent?

Schools are not buildings. They are teachers and students.

Nice buildings are nice. But old buildings are fine. And they'll be renovated on their schedule.

And this is the reason those tax dollars should be kept within McLean's boundaries. You basically just said give over those tax dollars and f*ck off until we decide your children shouldnt be educated in trailers that are falling apart.

I didn't say that. I said that I believe in public schools. And my kids go to public school.

A lot of parents choose McLean for the public schools and send their kids there. Others live in McLean and send their kids to private school, so they do not believe in public school.

I don't think the reasons put forward for this are great ones, but I do not live in McLean. They may think differently.

Yes, perhaps you have not have the experience that McLean residents have had of being lied to, ignored by, and intermittently scolded by FCPS officials and School Board members. It's not like we have any reason to believe things will get better with the current direction of the School Board, so we want to start actively pursuing the many steps that would be required to separate from the county when it is again legally feasible to pursue that option.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if fairfax water could charge McLean residents a high enough rate to make up for all of the lost tax revenue. I also wonder where they’ll locate their landfill - I doubt fairfax will continue to offer up theirs

Of course they will.

why on earth would they?

You don't think this can be worked out by contracting? Why on earth wouldn't they?

not many municipalities are eager to take other municipalities' trash. Most of the arrangements date from times before people cared. There will also be political pressure to not help McLean

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im confused. Does McLean want to become a city just like Fairfax City, City of Falls Church, or just break off their own schools? Because this seems to be to be all about schools vs any other municipal services.

I guess my first question would be why you expect Fairfax County to just give you its school buildings/properties/other municipal buildings if you are going to secede from the county? These properties(Ie the land they are built on) are worth millions!

The county has no way to unlock that value without investing many millions more in school facilities elsewhere. That is why such facilities are often ceded to seceding jurisdictions - the county would actually be relieved of the obligations associated with their existing dedicated use. If you think it would be a bad deal for the county, you are acknowledging the county benefits by treating McLean as a cash cow without providing a reciprocal level of services.

Why would Fairfax County give the land away though? Regardless of whats housed there—schools or parks or a warehouse, its land the county owns. Why would it give this land to a seceding jurisdiction?

What purpose would it serve to retain ownership of the school buildings and land without the ability to tax the residents? Sounds like a tough piece of real estate to maintain without real estate taxes from McLean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder if fairfax water could charge McLean residents a high enough rate to make up for all of the lost tax revenue. I also wonder where they’ll locate their landfill - I doubt fairfax will continue to offer up theirs

Actually most of McLean's trash is handled by private companies who contract with the dumps. So that would not be a service that the new City of McLean would have to provide. Fairfax water is a non-profit and could not profit on its water sales to provide additional revenue to the county.

Great ideas though.

access to that landfill is controlled by Fairfax County and so is Fairfax water. The landfill is for the county and entities the county contracts with

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im confused. Does McLean want to become a city just like Fairfax City, City of Falls Church, or just break off their own schools? Because this seems to be to be all about schools vs any other municipal services.

I guess my first question would be why you expect Fairfax County to just give you its school buildings/properties/other municipal buildings if you are going to secede from the county? These properties(Ie the land they are built on) are worth millions!

The county has no way to unlock that value without investing many millions more in school facilities elsewhere. That is why such facilities are often ceded to seceding jurisdictions - the county would actually be relieved of the obligations associated with their existing dedicated use. If you think it would be a bad deal for the county, you are acknowledging the county benefits by treating McLean as a cash cow without providing a reciprocal level of services.

Why would Fairfax County give the land away though? Regardless of whats housed there—schools or parks or a warehouse, its land the county owns. Why would it give this land to a seceding jurisdiction?

What purpose would it serve to retain ownership of the school buildings and land without the ability to tax the residents? Sounds like a tough piece of real estate to maintain without real estate taxes from McLean.

the land could be sold

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im confused. Does McLean want to become a city just like Fairfax City, City of Falls Church, or just break off their own schools? Because this seems to be to be all about schools vs any other municipal services.

I guess my first question would be why you expect Fairfax County to just give you its school buildings/properties/other municipal buildings if you are going to secede from the county? These properties(Ie the land they are built on) are worth millions!

The county has no way to unlock that value without investing many millions more in school facilities elsewhere. That is why such facilities are often ceded to seceding jurisdictions - the county would actually be relieved of the obligations associated with their existing dedicated use. If you think it would be a bad deal for the county, you are acknowledging the county benefits by treating McLean as a cash cow without providing a reciprocal level of services.

Why would Fairfax County give the land away though? Regardless of whats housed there—schools or parks or a warehouse, its land the county owns. Why would it give this land to a seceding jurisdiction?

Because the net worth associated with the land isn't what you think it is - there are liabilities (in terms of future obligations) inextricably linked to those properties.

there are no liabilities if they just sell the land to developers

That won't happen. If it were prior to a split FCPS would have to pay more to build new schools and a split won't occur unless the new city knows title is transferring.

FWIW they did think about selling off Marshall in the early 90s and they are very lucky they didn't go forward with that idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think maybe we disagree on what public schools mean in a fundamental way if you believe that the price of the house a child's family can afford should directly determine the quality of their public school education. Maybe you should get a cheaper house and pay for private school.

Or maybe you should acknowledge that FCPS short-changes the public schools in McLean and then takes credit for the high achievement of their students that is a result of the additional resources that the parents there have to fork over on their own.

+1

No one wants McLean schools to get more than other schools in FCPS. They want to be treated equally. I’m not sure you understand what goes on. FCPS regularly puts money into schools in poorer areas and then expects McLean schools to do without. For example, fields at poorer schools are regularly funded by FCPS. If McLean needs money for fields, they are required to fundraise for them. The county will not pay for them. That is just one example.

Citizens of mclean just want to be treated equally, not better than. But they are constantly being treated less than all others in the county because they assume the citizens will just fund it themselves.

But then FCPS is perfectly ready to take credit for the high test scores that come out of the underfunded schools. Even though it is the parents and students that actually are responsible for those phenomenal test scores.

Ummm... maybe the teachers helped also. But they don't live in McLean, I guess.

Sorry - I don't disagree that the teachers help. But McLean is not provided with better teachers than the rest of the county. You can't say that the teachers at McLean/Langley are so much better than the teachers at South Lakes can you? So much so that it makes the difference in all the test scores?

[Anonymous]

All the posts tossing out creative ideas about how the county could hold McLean hostage underscores the kidnapping has already occurred.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All the posts tossing out creative ideas about how the county could hold McLean hostage underscores the kidnapping has already occurred.

you can also say that the posts assuming McClean would continue to have access to county services after leaving show just how entitled people are

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All the posts tossing out creative ideas about how the county could hold McLean hostage underscores the kidnapping has already occurred.

you can also say that the posts assuming McClean would continue to have access to county services after leaving show just how entitled people are

access through contracting... not as residents of FC

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Im confused. Does McLean want to become a city just like Fairfax City, City of Falls Church, or just break off their own schools? Because this seems to be to be all about schools vs any other municipal services.

I guess my first question would be why you expect Fairfax County to just give you its school buildings/properties/other municipal buildings if you are going to secede from the county? These properties(Ie the land they are built on) are worth millions!

The county has no way to unlock that value without investing many millions more in school facilities elsewhere. That is why such facilities are often ceded to seceding jurisdictions - the county would actually be relieved of the obligations associated with their existing dedicated use. If you think it would be a bad deal for the county, you are acknowledging the county benefits by treating McLean as a cash cow without providing a reciprocal level of services.

Why would Fairfax County give the land away though? Regardless of whats housed there—schools or parks or a warehouse, its land the county owns. Why would it give this land to a seceding jurisdiction?

What purpose would it serve to retain ownership of the school buildings and land without the ability to tax the residents? Sounds like a tough piece of real estate to maintain without real estate taxes from McLean.

There would be a shitload of hard feelings over this. Why wouldnt Fairfax County just sell it to a developer. Why would they want to help the City of McLean?