Leaving DC for a lower COL area

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Problem with lower COL areas is that the job market is not as robust. Yes, "everybody" know someone who moved to Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee and found a good position and cheap housing but there is nowhere near the opportunities found in growing areas. Also, lower COL places tend to be insular. You are competing with people who went to local schools, married someone from there, and will never leave there. They pick their own when an opening occurs.

That's ...wrong on just about every level. Dallas and Houston are the same size as DC, with an even better economy, record low unemployment rate and much better COL. I've lived in both and wouldn't describe either as "insular." People are pouring in from other states. And the idea a company like Toyota or AT&T is picking executives based on the neighborhood they grew up in, that's just ludicrous.

SInce when are Dallas and Houston = Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee?

Dallas and Houston have incredible economies but are very hot and 100% sprawl. No charm, history, or walkability.

Yeah right. Dallas has Deep Ellum, Bishop Arts, Lower Greenville, Uptown ...areas with as much walkability as anything you'll find in the District. And several have a funkier vibe than the
manufactured cool of many gentrifying DC neighborhoods. And yeah ...it's hot. But you can also sit outside on the patio in February and don't have to dig out from a blizzard every other year.

You've named areas in Dallas that are much like Atlanta's Five Points/Virginia Highlands -- highly industrialized with a glut of retail/restaurants in one place but they aren't walkable communities with mixed-use density that including housing and amenities artfully imposed together. Basically those are the places you take an Uber to to bar hop for happy hour but you don't live on that street or next to that restaurant nor can you walk to those grocery stores (not unless you want to cross a parking lot which can fit a couple 100 cars easily first). In other words, the Whole Foods is in a shopping plaza.

Huge difference. Basically living there is nothing like D.C.

+1000000. PP obviously has never lived in a real city. Five points in Atlanta is a perfect example. You may be able to walk to bars and restaurants from your house. But on a daily basis walk to work, walk your kids to school and run 90% of your errands on foot? No way. Especially given the hot weather. Dallas is a city built around the automobile. Even in the areas in Dallas claiming to be walkable, the parking lots are HUGE which in itself demonstrates it’s not really a walkable area.

Whereas I live in DC and almost always walk to the grocery store, combo walk and bus to work, and only use my car on the weekend for an errand or going somewhere outside of DC. I can’t imagine many families in Dallas are only using their cars on the weekend.

Meh. You still live in DC, which is full of boring people who are bland AF.

As opposed to whom? Do you live in NY or LA, perhaps?

My DC neighbors work in a variety of pretty interesting professions. I assume you’re thinking everyone’s a fed, but on my block, there are people in medicine, finance, research, education, a museum director, etc. Really runs the gamut.

I live in a small city outside of DC and it's the same as in my neighborhood.

Stay in DC if you want to but you're being ridiculous if you think the "quality" of DC people is better than anywhere else. Lots of places have interesting people in them. No, not Supreme Court justices - that is unique to DC - but people who work in all these intellectual and creative fields. Many interesting people have left high cost cities, in fact, because it's too hard to keep yourself going in one of the more interesting professions. One reason my smaller city has such a good restaurant scene is that it's affordable enough that chefs can come experiment here. We have a great arts scene for largely the same reason. We have tons of writers here. (I am one of them.)

You keep think this is true, but it’s not. Most of the talent and intellect in this country is located in big cities. Sad, but true.

All of you are so ignorant

Google where the Fortune 500 companies are I'll wait

Here you go

New York NY 42
Houston TX 24
Dallas TX 12
Atlanta GA 10
Minneapolis MN 10
Chicago IL 9
St. Louis MO 8
San Francisco CA 7
Charlotte NC 6
Cincinnati OH 6
Columbus OH 6
Milwaukee WI 6
Englewood CO 5
Irving TX 5
Los Angeles CA 5
Omaha NE 5
Philadelphia PA 5
Pittsburgh PA 5
Richmond VA 5

All of these places are great places to live and in many you can be just as successful for half the cost or more vs DC

It's disturbing to me that anyone that isn't a liberal progressive is somehow less than for many of you.

That's a common knock on democrats in general. Yall need to work on that.

DC is the only place in the country that is so imbalanced politically yall need to get out of your bubbles

Only someone from a flyover city would actually think being a Fortune 500 company means something. It doesn’t. Working for a Fortune 500 company is the dream for someone in Dallas.

LOL, as opposed to what? The "policy analyst" in DC?

No. Perhaps:

Private equity
Hedge fund
Medical doctor
Think tank
Lobbyist
Research scientist
Entertainment industry
Attorney

I could go on...look, a Fortune 500 company is great if you live in Minneapolis. But it’s not where someone living in dc, ny, la etc aspires to work.

You think there are no attorneys in Minneapolis? No medical doctors? Research scientists? Investment bankers? Oh my god. I mean- how is it possible to be this dumb?

lol. This is going to blow her pea sized mind, but I worked as a research scientist FOR a Fortune 500 company! Gasp! I wonder who, exactly, she thinks works for companies like Ecoloab and Medtronic? (to name two Fortune 500s located in Minneapolis). Who are the people working for major research universities like the University of Minnesota or liberal arts colleges like Macalester? Are the lawyers there just figments of their own imaginations?

Also, Minneapolis has the highest theater concentration capita in the entire country.

I agree that the stupidity is mind boggling.

[Anonymous]

I love when be tell me that I have to be "open and tolerant" of people who don't believe in my basic humanity or that who secretly (or not so) believe that I am inferior because I am AA. No thank you. I do not have to be tolerant of it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Problem with lower COL areas is that the job market is not as robust. Yes, "everybody" know someone who moved to Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee and found a good position and cheap housing but there is nowhere near the opportunities found in growing areas. Also, lower COL places tend to be insular. You are competing with people who went to local schools, married someone from there, and will never leave there. They pick their own when an opening occurs.

That's ...wrong on just about every level. Dallas and Houston are the same size as DC, with an even better economy, record low unemployment rate and much better COL. I've lived in both and wouldn't describe either as "insular." People are pouring in from other states. And the idea a company like Toyota or AT&T is picking executives based on the neighborhood they grew up in, that's just ludicrous.

SInce when are Dallas and Houston = Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee?

Dallas and Houston have incredible economies but are very hot and 100% sprawl. No charm, history, or walkability.

Yeah right. Dallas has Deep Ellum, Bishop Arts, Lower Greenville, Uptown ...areas with as much walkability as anything you'll find in the District. And several have a funkier vibe than the
manufactured cool of many gentrifying DC neighborhoods. And yeah ...it's hot. But you can also sit outside on the patio in February and don't have to dig out from a blizzard every other year.

You've named areas in Dallas that are much like Atlanta's Five Points/Virginia Highlands -- highly industrialized with a glut of retail/restaurants in one place but they aren't walkable communities with mixed-use density that including housing and amenities artfully imposed together. Basically those are the places you take an Uber to to bar hop for happy hour but you don't live on that street or next to that restaurant nor can you walk to those grocery stores (not unless you want to cross a parking lot which can fit a couple 100 cars easily first). In other words, the Whole Foods is in a shopping plaza.

Huge difference. Basically living there is nothing like D.C.

+1000000. PP obviously has never lived in a real city. Five points in Atlanta is a perfect example. You may be able to walk to bars and restaurants from your house. But on a daily basis walk to work, walk your kids to school and run 90% of your errands on foot? No way. Especially given the hot weather. Dallas is a city built around the automobile. Even in the areas in Dallas claiming to be walkable, the parking lots are HUGE which in itself demonstrates it’s not really a walkable area.

Whereas I live in DC and almost always walk to the grocery store, combo walk and bus to work, and only use my car on the weekend for an errand or going somewhere outside of DC. I can’t imagine many families in Dallas are only using their cars on the weekend.

Meh. You still live in DC, which is full of boring people who are bland AF.

I prefer to think of them as intelligent people with a myriad of experiences and opinions. I was so glad to get out of the deep South where every conversation is Church or football. When I walk out my door in D.C. I can talk to a Senator's COS or a Defense official or a Smithsonian curator or run into my SCOTUS justice (which has happened).

I consider none of those individual's bland and I'm grateful for all the people who enrich my life here - culturally, personally, and professionally.

Maybe not bland - but self important

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Problem with lower COL areas is that the job market is not as robust. Yes, "everybody" know someone who moved to Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee and found a good position and cheap housing but there is nowhere near the opportunities found in growing areas. Also, lower COL places tend to be insular. You are competing with people who went to local schools, married someone from there, and will never leave there. They pick their own when an opening occurs.

That's ...wrong on just about every level. Dallas and Houston are the same size as DC, with an even better economy, record low unemployment rate and much better COL. I've lived in both and wouldn't describe either as "insular." People are pouring in from other states. And the idea a company like Toyota or AT&T is picking executives based on the neighborhood they grew up in, that's just ludicrous.

SInce when are Dallas and Houston = Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee?

Dallas and Houston have incredible economies but are very hot and 100% sprawl. No charm, history, or walkability.

Yeah right. Dallas has Deep Ellum, Bishop Arts, Lower Greenville, Uptown ...areas with as much walkability as anything you'll find in the District. And several have a funkier vibe than the
manufactured cool of many gentrifying DC neighborhoods. And yeah ...it's hot. But you can also sit outside on the patio in February and don't have to dig out from a blizzard every other year.

You've named areas in Dallas that are much like Atlanta's Five Points/Virginia Highlands -- highly industrialized with a glut of retail/restaurants in one place but they aren't walkable communities with mixed-use density that including housing and amenities artfully imposed together. Basically those are the places you take an Uber to to bar hop for happy hour but you don't live on that street or next to that restaurant nor can you walk to those grocery stores (not unless you want to cross a parking lot which can fit a couple 100 cars easily first). In other words, the Whole Foods is in a shopping plaza.

Huge difference. Basically living there is nothing like D.C.

+1000000. PP obviously has never lived in a real city. Five points in Atlanta is a perfect example. You may be able to walk to bars and restaurants from your house. But on a daily basis walk to work, walk your kids to school and run 90% of your errands on foot? No way. Especially given the hot weather. Dallas is a city built around the automobile. Even in the areas in Dallas claiming to be walkable, the parking lots are HUGE which in itself demonstrates it’s not really a walkable area.

Whereas I live in DC and almost always walk to the grocery store, combo walk and bus to work, and only use my car on the weekend for an errand or going somewhere outside of DC. I can’t imagine many families in Dallas are only using their cars on the weekend.

Meh. You still live in DC, which is full of boring people who are bland AF.

As opposed to whom? Do you live in NY or LA, perhaps?

My DC neighbors work in a variety of pretty interesting professions. I assume you’re thinking everyone’s a fed, but on my block, there are people in medicine, finance, research, education, a museum director, etc. Really runs the gamut.

I live in a small city outside of DC and it's the same as in my neighborhood.

Stay in DC if you want to but you're being ridiculous if you think the "quality" of DC people is better than anywhere else. Lots of places have interesting people in them. No, not Supreme Court justices - that is unique to DC - but people who work in all these intellectual and creative fields. Many interesting people have left high cost cities, in fact, because it's too hard to keep yourself going in one of the more interesting professions. One reason my smaller city has such a good restaurant scene is that it's affordable enough that chefs can come experiment here. We have a great arts scene for largely the same reason. We have tons of writers here. (I am one of them.)

You keep think this is true, but it’s not. Most of the talent and intellect in this country is located in big cities. Sad, but true.

All of you are so ignorant

Google where the Fortune 500 companies are I'll wait

Here you go

New York NY 42
Houston TX 24
Dallas TX 12
Atlanta GA 10
Minneapolis MN 10
Chicago IL 9
St. Louis MO 8
San Francisco CA 7
Charlotte NC 6
Cincinnati OH 6
Columbus OH 6
Milwaukee WI 6
Englewood CO 5
Irving TX 5
Los Angeles CA 5
Omaha NE 5
Philadelphia PA 5
Pittsburgh PA 5
Richmond VA 5

All of these places are great places to live and in many you can be just as successful for half the cost or more vs DC

It's disturbing to me that anyone that isn't a liberal progressive is somehow less than for many of you.

That's a common knock on democrats in general. Yall need to work on that.

DC is the only place in the country that is so imbalanced politically yall need to get out of your bubbles

Only someone from a flyover city would actually think being a Fortune 500 company means something. It doesn’t. Working for a Fortune 500 company is the dream for someone in Dallas.

LOL, as opposed to what? The "policy analyst" in DC?

No. Perhaps:

Private equity
Hedge fund
Medical doctor
Think tank
Lobbyist
Research scientist
Entertainment industry
Attorney

I could go on...look, a Fortune 500 company is great if you live in Minneapolis. But it’s not where someone living in dc, ny, la etc aspires to work.

You think there are no attorneys in Minneapolis? No medical doctors? Research scientists? Investment bankers? Oh my god. I mean- how is it possible to be this dumb?

lol. This is going to blow her pea sized mind, but I worked as a research scientist FOR a Fortune 500 company! Gasp! I wonder who, exactly, she thinks works for companies like Ecoloab and Medtronic? (to name two Fortune 500s located in Minneapolis). Who are the people working for major research universities like the University of Minnesota or liberal arts colleges like Macalester? Are the lawyers there just figments of their own imaginations?

Also, Minneapolis has the highest theater concentration capita in the entire country.

I agree that the stupidity is mind boggling.

I'm not sure what pp supposes is the difference between a biglaw partner and a Fortune 500 executive

[Anonymous]

Omg. Stop using the Quote function. These long blue boxes are redunkulous and should be deleted already.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Problem with lower COL areas is that the job market is not as robust. Yes, "everybody" know someone who moved to Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee and found a good position and cheap housing but there is nowhere near the opportunities found in growing areas. Also, lower COL places tend to be insular. You are competing with people who went to local schools, married someone from there, and will never leave there. They pick their own when an opening occurs.

That's ...wrong on just about every level. Dallas and Houston are the same size as DC, with an even better economy, record low unemployment rate and much better COL. I've lived in both and wouldn't describe either as "insular." People are pouring in from other states. And the idea a company like Toyota or AT&T is picking executives based on the neighborhood they grew up in, that's just ludicrous.

SInce when are Dallas and Houston = Cleveland/Detroit/Milwaukee?

Dallas and Houston have incredible economies but are very hot and 100% sprawl. No charm, history, or walkability.

Yeah right. Dallas has Deep Ellum, Bishop Arts, Lower Greenville, Uptown ...areas with as much walkability as anything you'll find in the District. And several have a funkier vibe than the
manufactured cool of many gentrifying DC neighborhoods. And yeah ...it's hot. But you can also sit outside on the patio in February and don't have to dig out from a blizzard every other year.

You've named areas in Dallas that are much like Atlanta's Five Points/Virginia Highlands -- highly industrialized with a glut of retail/restaurants in one place but they aren't walkable communities with mixed-use density that including housing and amenities artfully imposed together. Basically those are the places you take an Uber to to bar hop for happy hour but you don't live on that street or next to that restaurant nor can you walk to those grocery stores (not unless you want to cross a parking lot which can fit a couple 100 cars easily first). In other words, the Whole Foods is in a shopping plaza.

Huge difference. Basically living there is nothing like D.C.

+1000000. PP obviously has never lived in a real city. Five points in Atlanta is a perfect example. You may be able to walk to bars and restaurants from your house. But on a daily basis walk to work, walk your kids to school and run 90% of your errands on foot? No way. Especially given the hot weather. Dallas is a city built around the automobile. Even in the areas in Dallas claiming to be walkable, the parking lots are HUGE which in itself demonstrates it’s not really a walkable area.

Whereas I live in DC and almost always walk to the grocery store, combo walk and bus to work, and only use my car on the weekend for an errand or going somewhere outside of DC. I can’t imagine many families in Dallas are only using their cars on the weekend.

Meh. You still live in DC, which is full of boring people who are bland AF.

As opposed to whom? Do you live in NY or LA, perhaps?

My DC neighbors work in a variety of pretty interesting professions. I assume you’re thinking everyone’s a fed, but on my block, there are people in medicine, finance, research, education, a museum director, etc. Really runs the gamut.

I live in a small city outside of DC and it's the same as in my neighborhood.

Stay in DC if you want to but you're being ridiculous if you think the "quality" of DC people is better than anywhere else. Lots of places have interesting people in them. No, not Supreme Court justices - that is unique to DC - but people who work in all these intellectual and creative fields. Many interesting people have left high cost cities, in fact, because it's too hard to keep yourself going in one of the more interesting professions. One reason my smaller city has such a good restaurant scene is that it's affordable enough that chefs can come experiment here. We have a great arts scene for largely the same reason. We have tons of writers here. (I am one of them.)

You keep think this is true, but it’s not. Most of the talent and intellect in this country is located in big cities. Sad, but true.

All of you are so ignorant

Google where the Fortune 500 companies are I'll wait

Here you go

New York NY 42
Houston TX 24
Dallas TX 12
Atlanta GA 10
Minneapolis MN 10
Chicago IL 9
St. Louis MO 8
San Francisco CA 7
Charlotte NC 6
Cincinnati OH 6
Columbus OH 6
Milwaukee WI 6
Englewood CO 5
Irving TX 5
Los Angeles CA 5
Omaha NE 5
Philadelphia PA 5
Pittsburgh PA 5
Richmond VA 5

All of these places are great places to live and in many you can be just as successful for half the cost or more vs DC

It's disturbing to me that anyone that isn't a liberal progressive is somehow less than for many of you.

That's a common knock on democrats in general. Yall need to work on that.

DC is the only place in the country that is so imbalanced politically yall need to get out of your bubbles

Only someone from a flyover city would actually think being a Fortune 500 company means something. It doesn’t. Working for a Fortune 500 company is the dream for someone in Dallas.

LOL, as opposed to what? The "policy analyst" in DC?

No. Perhaps:

Private equity
Hedge fund
Medical doctor
Think tank
Lobbyist
Research scientist
Entertainment industry
Attorney

I could go on...look, a Fortune 500 company is great if you live in Minneapolis. But it’s not where someone living in dc, ny, la etc aspires to work.

You think there are no attorneys in Minneapolis? No medical doctors? Research scientists? Investment bankers? Oh my god. I mean- how is it possible to be this dumb?

You missed the entire point. The post was about how the best jobs aren’t for Fortune 500 companies. It wasn’t about location. However, since you’re insecure about where you live you jumped to this conclusion that I must have been saying there aren’t any medical doctors in Minneapolis.

[Anonymous]

^ hey pp - i didn't understand your point. what *were* you saying about medical doctors and private equity and minneapolis?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ hey pp - i didn't understand your point. what *were* you saying about medical doctors and private equity and minneapolis?

Someone responded that Fortune 500 companies are in X cities. I said only people in flyover cities care about Fortune 500 companies. Then someone asked for examples of jobs that aren’t Fortune 500. I provided them

[Anonymous]

You missed the entire point. The post was about how the best jobs aren’t for Fortune 500 companies. It wasn’t about location. However, since you’re insecure about where you live you jumped to this conclusion that I must have been saying there aren’t any medical doctors in Minneapolis.



New PP here. I used to work for a fortune 500 company, now in the Gov regulating the industry. I miss working for the fortune 500 - the drive, innovation, concrete goals, being in charge of a P&L line, camaraderie, doing something. I can't wait to go back after this stint.

The best jobs are for fortune 500. Look at the executive board and see how many consultants from bain, lawyers from biglaw, investment bankers jumped the boat and went In house. That's the goal.
Being the treasurer for Medtronic is the job. Same as the general counsel at Boston Scientific. Even as a CFO / CIO for a smaller public company, the benefits and compensation are enormous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ hey pp - i didn't understand your point. what *were* you saying about medical doctors and private equity and minneapolis?

Someone responded that Fortune 500 companies are in X cities. I said only people in flyover cities care about Fortune 500 companies. Then someone asked for examples of jobs that aren’t Fortune 500. I provided them

So, those are examples of jobs that people in flyover cities don’t care about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ hey pp - i didn't understand your point. what *were* you saying about medical doctors and private equity and minneapolis?

Someone responded that Fortune 500 companies are in X cities. I said only people in flyover cities care about Fortune 500 companies. Then someone asked for examples of jobs that aren’t Fortune 500. I provided them

So, those are examples of jobs that people in flyover cities don’t care about?

And what exactly is the difference between a midwestern Fortune 500 executive and a D.C. Biglaw partner supposed to be

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ hey pp - i didn't understand your point. what *were* you saying about medical doctors and private equity and minneapolis?

Someone responded that Fortune 500 companies are in X cities. I said only people in flyover cities care about Fortune 500 companies. Then someone asked for examples of jobs that aren’t Fortune 500. I provided them

So, those are examples of jobs that people in flyover cities don’t care about?

Yeah I guess I still don't understand? Are you saying that people do these sorts of jobs in Minneapolis or don't do these jobs in Minneapolis - are you saying it's only in DC that you can be a medical doctor or work in private equity?

[Anonymous]

There is no lower cost of living city where I can go as a journalist and have comparable career opportunities and income. Stuck here or gotta go to NYC, Chicago, California.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I assume you’re thinking everyone’s a fed, but on my block, there are people in medicine, finance, research, education, a museum director, etc. Really runs the gamut.

I live in a small city outside of DC and it's the same as in my neighborhood.

Stay in DC if you want to but you're being ridiculous if you think the "quality" of DC people is better than anywhere else. Lots of places have interesting people in them. No, not Supreme Court justices - that is unique to DC - but people who work in all these intellectual and creative fields. Many interesting people have left high cost cities, in fact, because it's too hard to keep yourself going in one of the more interesting professions. One reason my smaller city has such a good restaurant scene is that it's affordable enough that chefs can come experiment here. We have a great arts scene for largely the same reason. We have tons of writers here. (I am one of them.)



Same. I was one of those "interesting" people that a pp described when I lived in DC, and now I live in a small town that is an exurb of a medium-sized city, and my neighbors are as, if not more, interesting than the dime a dozen lobbyists/lawyers that lived in our DC neighborhood. Within a couple of blocks of my house are multiple artists, musicians, a former NYC booking agent who now runs a furniture boutique, a former NFL lineman who is now a successful attorney, a MD who runs a medical practice that employs over 100 doctors, the owner of a hugely successful advertising company, etc. A book that spent almost a year on the NYT best-sellers list was written in the house across the street.

But it's ok. It would be better for all us out here if those of you who are convinced that DC is full of the most fascinating and accomplished people in America stay where you are.

[Anonymous]

I’m an economist, where else can I go? Please!