Leaving DC for a lower COL area

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in Providence, RI and have a bunch of friends who moved here from NYC or the Bay area because you can afford to buy a house here.

Sounds lovely. What type of careers do you and most of your friends have? What kind of industry?

Meds and Eds is the quick description for the economy here. I know a bunch of people working in the healthcare sector, some providers and some in management, many people working in higher ed, one fed who works for the EPA out of Boston, a few people working for tech companies that have offices here, one person in biotech. I'm a non-profit fundraiser. I think there's a shortage of engineers and people with the skills to work in advanced manufacturing.

And an excess of talented baristas and mixologists with man buns who play banjo and create performance art on the side.

Uh. I'm from Rhode Island originally. And there is a world class culinary school in Pvd, plus a top art school - so yeah, there is a good restaurant scene and a good arts scene. Are you suggesting that having food and art is somehow a bad quality in a city?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All-- My spouse and I considered moving from the DC area for Portland, Oregon, which we had recently visited for the first time. If you can stomach the rain for a few months in the winter, I literally can't think of a better city as an alternative to DC in terms of COL, job opportunities, outdoor activities, public schools, and of course, most folks there are staunchly anti-Trump

I can't sing Portland's tune loud enough and it's really attractive in terms of COL - for $700k in DC, you're getting a 2 bedroom condo in a bad school district. For the same price in NW or SW Portland, you're getting a 3.500 square foot northwest modern home in a public school that's rated a 9 or 10. A large fancy daycare center for infants is literally a thousand dollars less than it is in DC. Unlike Seattle, Portland is still affordable. A lot of the retail giants headquarters are based in Portland (i.e., Nike), a lot of tech companies and startups (Portland isn't called Silicon Forest for nothing), and some consulting firms.

OP--you mentioned that both of your careers are tied to government so it may be difficult for you to find work outside of the DC area. I'd encourage you to think more broadly about your skill sets in your current roles, as opposed to the industry you're in, when thinking about what you have to offer a new employer. Research, accounting, consulting, advocacy, policy analysis, etc. are all useful skills in multiple industries. Just be prepared to talk about your contributions in terms of your competencies as opposed to what agency/non-profit/elected official you currently work for. People successfully make this kind of career move all the time.

Good luck to all of you - I hope that your journeys to find a balanced lifestyle take you to new and cool places!

Haha, no. I am from there, grew up there. The rain begins in mid to late October and DOES NOT STOP until June. Sure, you will get a clear day here and there, but the ground is soaked. I had friends who moved to Oregon from California and almost lost their minds in the non-stop rain and gray. Also, once the clocks move back in November it will be pitch dark by 4:30 in the afternoon every day and the sun does not fully rise until 8 a.m. because of the latitude. I'm not saying to avoid Portland. I'm just saying "a few months" is not accurate.

Rain isn't so bad in Portland, as they say. It only rains once.... from October to June

[Anonymous]

We've tried, and failed. Our learning was that it's really hard if you're not a Doctor. One thing upstate NY needs is Docs and Nurses, because that's literally the only industry left. In Rochester, where I'm from, the University is the largest employer in town, and all of the jobs are healthcare, taking care of a large sick / aging population. I tried looking at some small startups, and they were honestly a joke. The talent level isn't there and they can't complete. Mid-sized companies like PayChex are all well and good but they only hire from inside the community, and no one leaves jobs because there are no other jobs they're qualified for in the whole city... and that's Rochester. Smaller towns are much worse. By the way, ROC has lost 10-15% of its school-age population in the past decade, and the drain is continuing, a couple points a year, for the foreseeable future... and taxes are really high. Your only hope is to get your DC employer to agree to let you work remotely. I've seen that work, but not always... or you could pray for that needle in a haystack one good job.

[Anonymous]

If you can find work, it seems like all pros for your family. We left before the kids started elementary and it has been really positive. We started actively seeking employment opportunities outside of DC a year after our youngest was born, after we realized that raising children in Arlington wasn’t what we wanted to do. Husband found a good job (slightly better salary and similar trajectory) and we found a really great house in a really great neighborhood.

Only “con” is the condescending attitudes from people who insist that nothing of value can be found outside of Boston/NY/DC (you all know the type, they frequent DCUM).

We love our friends and have saved boat loads of money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I moved 7 years ago when my kids were 3 & 5. Small city in PA.
Advantages:
1. Lower cost of living. There is NO WAY I could afford the home I have now in DC. Or near DC. Or even not so near to DC. 4000 sq ft SFH, ½ acre backing to forest, in ground heated pool in a very nice neighborhood for under $400k.
2. Very little traffic. Parking is not an issue.
3. Activities for the kids are not hyper competitive.
4. DC, Baltimore, Philadelphia all 90 min – 2 hr drive. Can take train to NYC.
Disadvantages:
1. Not as many things to do ( I guess this can be an advantage – slower pace of life – but it takes time to get used to)
2. Not as many great restaurants. There are still diverse restraunts, so chances are whatever ethnic cuisine you want, you can find… but just not that many “wow!” restaurants.
3. Most people seem to have their set friendships from when they were younger, in college, etc. Hard for transplants to break into social scene. Most of my friends are not from the city I now live in (all transplants like me).

I’m in IT, go in with the federal government. Started as an 11 (foot in door), quickly picked up a 13 (based on previous experience, not TIG), now a 14.
The neighborhood I live in reminds me of my childhood – kids running around the neighborhood, no need for playdates – just walk outside. A lot of the kids in the neighborhood are on the same teams / clubs, so it’s very easy to carpool. Often, it’s now even planned –“hey, I can take Travis home if you want…”
The small city I am in does have a lot of ethnic diversity. It’s not a liberal bastion, but not conservative either – its moderate; HRC won in my district. It’s always very close in elections.
Is it perfect? No. It really took time to get used to small city mentality. The first couple years we traveled to DC and Baltimore and Philadelphia a lot. But as I embraced the slower pace of life, we stopped traveling to the cities as often. That and soccer season taking up the weekends (lol).
It is nice not to sit in traffic for hours. And to be able to buy a home instead of rent a townhome.

State College, the ‘Sanctuary City for Paedophiles’?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We've tried, and failed. Our learning was that it's really hard if you're not a Doctor. One thing upstate NY needs is Docs and Nurses, because that's literally the only industry left. In Rochester, where I'm from, the University is the largest employer in town, and all of the jobs are healthcare, taking care of a large sick / aging population. I tried looking at some small startups, and they were honestly a joke. The talent level isn't there and they can't complete. Mid-sized companies like PayChex are all well and good but they only hire from inside the community, and no one leaves jobs because there are no other jobs they're qualified for in the whole city... and that's Rochester. Smaller towns are much worse. By the way, ROC has lost 10-15% of its school-age population in the past decade, and the drain is continuing, a couple points a year, for the foreseeable future... and taxes are really high. Your only hope is to get your DC employer to agree to let you work remotely. I've seen that work, but not always... or you could pray for that needle in a haystack one good job.

Just to clarify, you're saying you tried to find jobs to allow you to relocate and failed? Or you actually relocated and it didn't work out?

[Anonymous]

I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I moved 7 years ago when my kids were 3 & 5. Small city in PA.
Advantages:
1. Lower cost of living. There is NO WAY I could afford the home I have now in DC. Or near DC. Or even not so near to DC. 4000 sq ft SFH, ½ acre backing to forest, in ground heated pool in a very nice neighborhood for under $400k.
2. Very little traffic. Parking is not an issue.
3. Activities for the kids are not hyper competitive.
4. DC, Baltimore, Philadelphia all 90 min – 2 hr drive. Can take train to NYC.
Disadvantages:
1. Not as many things to do ( I guess this can be an advantage – slower pace of life – but it takes time to get used to)
2. Not as many great restaurants. There are still diverse restraunts, so chances are whatever ethnic cuisine you want, you can find… but just not that many “wow!” restaurants.
3. Most people seem to have their set friendships from when they were younger, in college, etc. Hard for transplants to break into social scene. Most of my friends are not from the city I now live in (all transplants like me).

I’m in IT, go in with the federal government. Started as an 11 (foot in door), quickly picked up a 13 (based on previous experience, not TIG), now a 14.
The neighborhood I live in reminds me of my childhood – kids running around the neighborhood, no need for playdates – just walk outside. A lot of the kids in the neighborhood are on the same teams / clubs, so it’s very easy to carpool. Often, it’s now even planned –“hey, I can take Travis home if you want…”
The small city I am in does have a lot of ethnic diversity. It’s not a liberal bastion, but not conservative either – its moderate; HRC won in my district. It’s always very close in elections.
Is it perfect? No. It really took time to get used to small city mentality. The first couple years we traveled to DC and Baltimore and Philadelphia a lot. But as I embraced the slower pace of life, we stopped traveling to the cities as often. That and soccer season taking up the weekends (lol).
It is nice not to sit in traffic for hours. And to be able to buy a home instead of rent a townhome.

State College, the ‘Sanctuary City for Paedophiles’?

Your tone is what is the problem with DC boosters. You sneer and make derogatory comments about other cities while proclaiming DC to be the New Jerusalem (and in this case ignoring the plenty of sexual abuse, crime and pedophilia that has happened in DC over the years).

Anyway, the poster you mocked later revealed that he/she lives in Harrisburg.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

Then you've never looked into the cost of living in Upstate New York.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

The real difference between DC and other cities in COL is cost of housing. You get a lot more housing for your money (bigger, better, nicer neighborhood) up to a certain threshold. And it's often more affordable for young people and easier to get on the property ladder.

The other differences between DC and a provincial city are going to be soft factors. Quality/length of commutes for example. While this isn't true for everywhere it can be easier for more people to have a more low key, less stressful and relaxed lifestyle in the provincial cities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

Then you've never looked into the cost of living in Upstate New York.

True. But most of the thread isn’t about upstate New York. More like Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland, Philadelphia

These are not LCOL areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

Then you've never looked into the cost of living in Upstate New York.

True. But most of the thread isn’t about upstate New York. More like Minneapolis, Chicago, Portland, Philadelphia

These are not LCOL areas.

Compared to DC they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in Providence, RI and have a bunch of friends who moved here from NYC or the Bay area because you can afford to buy a house here.

Sounds lovely. What type of careers do you and most of your friends have? What kind of industry?

Meds and Eds is the quick description for the economy here. I know a bunch of people working in the healthcare sector, some providers and some in management, many people working in higher ed, one fed who works for the EPA out of Boston, a few people working for tech companies that have offices here, one person in biotech. I'm a non-profit fundraiser. I think there's a shortage of engineers and people with the skills to work in advanced manufacturing.

And an excess of talented baristas and mixologists with man buns who play banjo and create performance art on the side.

Uh. I'm from Rhode Island originally. And there is a world class culinary school in Pvd, plus a top art school - so yeah, there is a good restaurant scene and a good arts scene. Are you suggesting that having food and art is somehow a bad quality in a city?

It was a joke. Here's 5 minutes of quintessential Providence from this past weekend: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eMN3q9Calc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t feel like many of the cities mentioned are actually that much lower COL.

The real difference between DC and other cities in COL is cost of housing. You get a lot more housing for your money (bigger, better, nicer neighborhood) up to a certain threshold. And it's often more affordable for young people and easier to get on the property ladder.

The other differences between DC and a provincial city are going to be soft factors. Quality/length of commutes for example. While this isn't true for everywhere it can be easier for more people to have a more low key, less stressful and relaxed lifestyle in the provincial cities.

It just housing! My Nashville private school tuition is a good 30 discount. Vet bills- half! And so on. It’s not like it’s free compared to dc but we experience a lot more savings than just housing.

[Anonymous]

We thought about moving to Atlanta or Chicago and did some recon. Turns out the places we wanted to live in those cities were just as expensive as dc so it was a wash.

Its apples to apples when you are comparing DC to other hot cities/neighborhoods in the country.. prices are very similar.

Apples to oranges when you are comparing hot DC to a sleepy town or suburbs in a lower COL area. COL of living will obvi be lower but quality of life will be vastly different.