MM Is Dead

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Imagine what the world would be if sometime hundreds of years ago people decided that people should only live where they already are.

Thousands of years ago settling where they were allowed for the expansion of communities and growth of economies. This was enabled Neolithic agricultural advances. From this we built strong societies that traded with other advanced societies.

I know that’s not terribly relevant, but maybe more so than what you said. People are welcome to move wherever they want. It doesn’t mean that they get to live wherever they choose.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

[Anonymous]

Pro-MM people are losers. They lost, so by definition they are losers, but they are also losers in every other sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pro-MM people are losers. They lost, so by definition they are losers, but they are also losers in every other sense.

That's an unhelpful sentiment, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was false-flag. I doubt they are lost from their perspective, and I'm sure that most are not "losers" (which would describe a person who lost a thing, rather than someone lost, themselves). They may be callous to their efforts, when poorly considered, causing others to lose.

[Anonymous]

I think this guy has a lot of good suggestions, including realistic parking allocation, adjustments to encourage "missing" housing sizes instead of apartment buildings, and location-specific zoning along transit corridors.

https://eliresidential.com/blog/my-reaction-to-the-missing-middle-lawsuit-ruling

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think this guy has a lot of good suggestions, including realistic parking allocation, adjustments to encourage "missing" housing sizes instead of apartment buildings, and location-specific zoning along transit corridors.

https://eliresidential.com/blog/my-reaction-to-the-missing-middle-lawsuit-ruling

lol. where are all the new 2000 sq ft sfh going to go?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

I’m not sure why this is so hard for people to accept: we have a massive housing shortage in this country and the “modest” homes that were affordable 30 yrs ago are no longer affordable. a dual fed family cannot buy a sf home most places in Arlington anymore (much less even a townhome). maybe your view is just that people have the right to preserve zoning in amber and that new housing shouldn’t be built. but stop pretending that people are somehow chosing not to buy affordable housing. it doesn’t exist.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

I’m not sure why this is so hard for people to accept: we have a massive housing shortage in this country and the “modest” homes that were affordable 30 yrs ago are no longer affordable. a dual fed family cannot buy a sf home most places in Arlington anymore (much less even a townhome). maybe your view is just that people have the right to preserve zoning in amber and that new housing shouldn’t be built. but stop pretending that people are somehow chosing not to buy affordable housing. it doesn’t exist.

Stop pretending MM is affordable housing - it isn’t. That was how they tried to sell the whole idea. But it has been made clear over and over again, that it is Expanded Housing Options for $1million dollar condos and a $1.5 million dollar townhouses. And the small number isn’t going to make a dent in housing prices.

[Anonymous]

As someone who bought a "teardown" and put a ton of work into the house to make it nice, I'll say that MM is driving developers to tear down more affordable housing to put in more expensive housing. The number of units isn't enough to drive down prices, but allowing developers to knock down older homes to put in shiny new builds is absolutely driving up prices.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

I’m not sure why this is so hard for people to accept: we have a massive housing shortage in this country and the “modest” homes that were affordable 30 yrs ago are no longer affordable. a dual fed family cannot buy a sf home most places in Arlington anymore (much less even a townhome). maybe your view is just that people have the right to preserve zoning in amber and that new housing shouldn’t be built. but stop pretending that people are somehow chosing not to buy affordable housing. it doesn’t exist.

That’s not what PP was saying, and you’re ignoring. The County has admitted that MM will not produce affordable housing, certainly not the type that a dual fed couple would opt to purchase and inhabit. When people complain there isn’t “affordable” housing, they mean they don’t want to sacrifice by living in the 3 bed 1 bath home that is affordable (by Arlington standards) and less expensive than anything MM will produce and would rather move out to Haymarket for the new build McMansion there at the same price. Developers are only buying what’s left of the current affordable housing stock (meaning it costs less than any new MM build) because they aren’t being outbid by eager people who want to live in that “sh** shack,” when they think they also deserve a McMansion. MM isn’t going to cure that. It will add more apartments, and not enough to really bring down the cost of rent or buying a condo, and it’s not what is missing from the market either.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

I’m not sure why this is so hard for people to accept: we have a massive housing shortage in this country and the “modest” homes that were affordable 30 yrs ago are no longer affordable. a dual fed family cannot buy a sf home most places in Arlington anymore (much less even a townhome). maybe your view is just that people have the right to preserve zoning in amber and that new housing shouldn’t be built. but stop pretending that people are somehow chosing not to buy affordable housing. it doesn’t exist.

There are plenty of houses for sale at reasonable prices. Just not in the areas that are attractive to you. Check your racism and look in Anacostia and PG.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As someone who bought a "teardown" and put a ton of work into the house to make it nice, I'll say that MM is driving developers to tear down more affordable housing to put in more expensive housing. The number of units isn't enough to drive down prices, but allowing developers to knock down older homes to put in shiny new builds is absolutely driving up prices.

that’s already happening.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Nimbys are the worst. Seriously. You’re ruining this country.

How is this ruining the country? Because people need to live in areas that comport with their affordability instead of the government trying to get everyone a prize at the expense of current homeowners? No one has a right to live in Arlington. It’s a very nice and expensive place.

I would love a house in Newport Beach. I can’t afford a $8M house so I don’t live there.

because EVERYTHING that is a common good gets opposed by NIMBYs. Preschools, high schools, sidewalks, solar powed, waste treatment plants …

The best thing for the common hood would be for people to understand that if you want something nice in this country you have to sacrifice and work your tail off. In an era of student loan forgiveness, free housing for illegal immigrants, and countless other government giveaways it’s gotten totally out of control.

This is why there is a huge disconnect with some liberals in Arlington, extremely socially liberal, but also believe what you said above that you should work hard to get to where you are and should enjoy the benefits of that hard work. They’re happy to donate their hard earned money to those less fortunate, but don’t want them living next-door.

It’s not surprising that a generation of young people who grew up getting participation trophies would have no shame in thinking they deserve to live in close-in high income neighborhoods. The lack of self awareness is galling.

Devils advocate, why does someone who can’t afford it think they should “deserve” to live in a particular neighborhood?

They were raised as upper middle class kids by boomer parents who worked hard to accomplish a good life for them. Many were in the first generation to earn college degrees and ground through college on the GI bill or through night school, including law school. They wanted their kids to have what they missed and encouraged them to follow their passions. The kids did so but the passion does not pay enough to have the kind of life they had as a kid.

This is so true. Yimbys are a bunch of people with useless degrees and too much student loan debt that made bad life decisions.

there’s nothing more pathetic than an old boomer refusing to change and holding on to his broke down ratty SFH with no sidewalk as if it were Versailles.

DP. This comment shows the entitlement and disdain YIMBYs have for working and middle class SFH homeowners, suggesting that our modest homes are unworthy of existing and are just “tear downs”. For so many of us, this home is our dwelling and an investment in our now and our future. It took us years - for some, decades - to save for these homes. And yet YIMBYs not only mock our homes but demand they have instant access to homes without any of the hard work it takes to save for one.

So much for the YIMBY concern for the middle classes …. The same homeowners the PP mocks above.

YIMBYs and Density Bros are openly ageist, mocking people as the “Olds”, and dismissing their mobility challenges which require driving. I’ve seen long time residents dismissed with “why don’t you move to Leisure World”?

To be fair, many of the "Olds" have mobility challenges because they live in SFHs and drive everywhere. Maybe if they had actually used their legs at any point in the last 50 years, they wouldn't have mobility challenges. And maybe, just maybe, we should stop consigning future generations do early disability by automobile?

You’re an assh***. I hope everyone reads you to filth. Many elderly have mobility challenges for many reasons, as do young DISABLED people, not for reasons having anything to do with how they behaved or lived at any point in their lives. Seriously, you are the worst and your parents must be so ashamed. No wonder they wouldn’t let you move in or help you with a down payment.

You people act like there are no old people anywhere else in the world. Old people exist in places with townhouses and apartments all over the world. They somehow manage to get around without a 5,000 pound SUV parked six feet from their door. What makes Arlington Olds, who I am told are the healthiest, so particularly special that they won't be able to handle walking a little bit?

Why are retirement communities almost entirely built with "Missing Middle" housing? Its actually easier for Olds to get around by foot and golf cart than having them drive into their local grocery store with a giant truck.

None of that is what I was responding to, rather to the attack from someone who blamed being infirm solely on the housing or vehicle choices someone made at some point in their lives.


For what it’s worth, my dream is to retire to a Pre-War in Manhattan. My parents, however, want to leave their home feet first. I’m not sure why you’re intent on making an enemy of people who supports a lot of what you’re talking about without agreeing that all SFH zoning needs to be eliminated. But, take the L I guess.

Let's keep in mind it was the Nimbys that dragged the Olds off their mobility scooters to use as human shields. Let's also keep in mind we just went through a couple years where we sacrificed young people for the sake of the Olds, with disastrous consequences for the nation.

So I'll just ask what do you want young families to do? Live an hour+ from work and never see each other? Live in cramped and run down apartments? What is the logic in having empty nesters in the best housing in the county?

Those empty nesters lived in cramped and Ron down apartments until they saved enough money to buy a cramped and run down house that they improved over the years. Do the same and stop whining

They bought those places at 25 on a single income. Now people might be able to buy them at 40 on two incomes. You don't see that as a problem?

My parents bought their Arlington Forest house when they were in their Arlington Forest house about 30 years ago when I was 9 and they were in their 40s and both were government employees. It was 3 bedrooms, 1 bath, living room, dining room, kitchen unfinished basement and a side porch. They have pictures of them scarping off wall paper, painting, refinishing the floors, doing extensive yard cleanup. Most of their neighbors were the same. They did a main bedroom and bath addition when my grandparents move in with us and finished the basement with another bathroom around the same time so we three kids would have a place to play. I don't see it as a problem. The problem is that the people who want missing middle housing don't want the type of house my parents bought and that my DH and I bought about five years ago. They want a $1.5 M house for $800K and are not willing to do any work. Our neighborhood has many new homes and the people who live there are pretty open in telling us that their friends want to buy our house and tear it down for a new build. We have our old Arlington friends, most of whom did the same things as we did, and we ignore the new neighbors.

I’m not sure why this is so hard for people to accept: we have a massive housing shortage in this country and the “modest” homes that were affordable 30 yrs ago are no longer affordable. a dual fed family cannot buy a sf home most places in Arlington anymore (much less even a townhome). maybe your view is just that people have the right to preserve zoning in amber and that new housing shouldn’t be built. but stop pretending that people are somehow chosing not to buy affordable housing. it doesn’t exist.

There are plenty of houses for sale at reasonable prices. Just not in the areas that are attractive to you. Check your racism and look in Anacostia and PG.

lol talk about racism!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As someone who bought a "teardown" and put a ton of work into the house to make it nice, I'll say that MM is driving developers to tear down more affordable housing to put in more expensive housing. The number of units isn't enough to drive down prices, but allowing developers to knock down older homes to put in shiny new builds is absolutely driving up prices.

Thank you! I bought a teardown 24 years ago, and we worked on it over time and I now have a $2 million home. Isn't that what people used to do. I never thought I was entitled to a huge house and a fancy kitchen at that age. I could have purchased a more updated home farther out, but I opted for a fixer-upper inside the city. It's about choices. It never dawned on me that I was entitled to live anywhere.

[Anonymous]

The Missing Middle crowd overreached. Of course it is possible to add a moderate amount of density in most neighborhoods, but you can't add too much without totally changing the neighborhood. Washington can accommodate a neighborhood like Chevy Chase and one like Navy Yard. Not every neighborhood should be super dense.