FCPS comprehensive boundary review

[Anonymous]

Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

Parent zoned for Lewis here, and I’d be fine with this. It seems like the easiest and least controversial option of all that have been floated thus far.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:One way to limit transfers out/in is to have each HS offer the same set of languages and AP classes regardless of how many students sign up for each. It would make offerings equal in each HS. The only differences would be how many classes of each are offered.

It’s also been proposed that some languages be offered on-line.

Currently some schools have to spend large amounts on their budgets on ESOL and others spend money on foreign languages not offered at other schools. If you’re a non-ESOL kid at the former you simply don’t have access to the same opportunities. You might be able to pupil place but that means arranging your own transportation, which isn’t feasible for a lot of families.

online offerings are not equivalent to in person. I think the answer is large schools where there are enough students to justify offerings at multiple levels. West Potomac and Herndon have high farms percentages and manage to have robust course catalogs because they are massive.

Herndon isn’t massive. It has a below-average enrollment for an FCPS high school.

But Langley, Madison, and Marshall have an even lower enrollment. Herndon looks under enrolled because they gave it a massive expansion to make up for the lack of a Western High School.

Those are two different issues. Herndon has a below-average enrollment for an FCPS high school. And it also has a lot of excess capacity now, which they may take advantage of in connection with the ongoing boundary study.

Only if they split feeder cooper. HMS doesn’t have capacity, now or in the future.

Yeah, they could make Cooper a split feeder if they needed to. Or they could put a modular at HMS, if that avoids having hundreds of empty seats at HHS for years.

The misalignment between MS and HS within a pyramid isn't just limited to the Herndon pyramid. They don't and won't any time soon have a perfect solution that aligns with the goals of using available capacity and minimizing commuting distances while avoiding split feeders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

Yeah, Herndon HS and Falls Church HS also got pretty renovations yet Forestville and Mantua parents are going nuclear over the possibility of being moved there. It doesn’t seem like a good investment when there are so many empty seats between South County, Mount Vernon, and West Potomac.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yes offer the unusual languages online to cut down on transfers out even further.

Online is not as effective nor anywhere near an equivalent to an in person class with classmates and live teachers.

Language involves not just speech and hearing but body language and nuances that are unavailable online.

Keep the obscure languages throughout the county.

Take advantage of Lewis's low enrollment to renovate and fix its multiple building and facility issues that make the campus sub par to the other high schools, while taking a deep dive into what is failing and what can be fixed academically.

Then, when Lewis is in a similar physical condition to the rest of the FCPS, revisit if there is a need for rezoning during the 2031 cycle.

After all, rezoning every 5 years gives the school board plenty of time to work on the issues that make transferring to Lewis unpalatable to many of its neighbors, not just its WSHS neighbors but its South County, Lake Braddock, Hayfield and even its Edison neighbors.

You can have a strong school in a cramped, sub par, unrenovated building with rutted sports fields, and people will happily send their kids there if the academics are good.

You can have a middling school in a beautiful, newly renovated building, and people will send their kids there without a fuss.

You can have an exceptional school in a beautiful facility, and people will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids there.

What you can't have is a poorly performing school in a run down, neglected building at a terrible location with aging, low quality sports fields that is by far the most neglected physical campus in the entire county. People will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids out of there.

If fcps rezones kids into the failing school with the neglected campus, they won't send their kids there. They will pull them for private school or find a transfer loophole and we will end up in the same place for Lewis.

But if FCPS gives Lewis a beautiful renovation so it at least looks like the other high schools, they will have better chance of turning that school around and making it less of a pariah.

Online classes can have classmates and a live teacher. We have technology why not be creative wth it?

Tell us you don't have a kid in school and haven't had a kid in school since 2020.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yes offer the unusual languages online to cut down on transfers out even further.

Online is not as effective nor anywhere near an equivalent to an in person class with classmates and live teachers.

Language involves not just speech and hearing but body language and nuances that are unavailable online.

Keep the obscure languages throughout the county.

Take advantage of Lewis's low enrollment to renovate and fix its multiple building and facility issues that make the campus sub par to the other high schools, while taking a deep dive into what is failing and what can be fixed academically.

Then, when Lewis is in a similar physical condition to the rest of the FCPS, revisit if there is a need for rezoning during the 2031 cycle.

After all, rezoning every 5 years gives the school board plenty of time to work on the issues that make transferring to Lewis unpalatable to many of its neighbors, not just its WSHS neighbors but its South County, Lake Braddock, Hayfield and even its Edison neighbors.

You can have a strong school in a cramped, sub par, unrenovated building with rutted sports fields, and people will happily send their kids there if the academics are good.

You can have a middling school in a beautiful, newly renovated building, and people will send their kids there without a fuss.

You can have an exceptional school in a beautiful facility, and people will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids there.

What you can't have is a poorly performing school in a run down, neglected building at a terrible location with aging, low quality sports fields that is by far the most neglected physical campus in the entire county. People will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids out of there.

If fcps rezones kids into the failing school with the neglected campus, they won't send their kids there. They will pull them for private school or find a transfer loophole and we will end up in the same place for Lewis.

But if FCPS gives Lewis a beautiful renovation so it at least looks like the other high schools, they will have better chance of turning that school around and making it less of a pariah.

Annandale and McLean are older than Lewis, and both currently rely on modulars, so they deserve to be renovated before Lewis. And none of these schools are likely to get renovated before 2031. Maybe they could start on Annandale, the oldest of the three, but they’ll finish Centreville first unless they completely revamp the CIP.

They could come out with a new renovation queue soon to at least give people comfort that renovations are on the horizon, but that’s about it. If that’s not good enough, they should just close Lewis.

Centerville is a fairly nice school compared to the ones you listed.

Maybe the can bump up the exterior and sports field renovations for those 3 schools, then move them up to the top of the renivation queu before doing any rezoning into them (rezoning out should procede if the schools are very overcrowded like you say McLean is.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

WS won't be so happy. They'd probably have to give up Orange Hunt and Hunt Valley to LBSS and South County so they can take in Crestwood and Lynbrook. Hayfield as well would need to take some poorer neighborhoods. Even closing Lewis would be protested by other pyramids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

Parent zoned for Lewis here, and I’d be fine with this. It seems like the easiest and least controversial option of all that have been floated thus far.

If they do that, then they should turn Lewis into an opt in non traditional high school for new arrivals and older students, with citizenship, English language immersion and US cultural classes as well as a trades magnet and child crare services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

WS won't be so happy. They'd probably have to give up Orange Hunt and Hunt Valley to LBSS and South County so they can take in Crestwood and Lynbrook. Hayfield as well would need to take some poorer neighborhoods. Even closing Lewis would be protested by other pyramids.

You are not reading the room.

No one wants to get rezoned to Lewis in its current state, not even the Edison and Hayfield families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One way to limit transfers out/in is to have each HS offer the same set of languages and AP classes regardless of how many students sign up for each. It would make offerings equal in each HS. The only differences would be how many classes of each are offered.

It’s also been proposed that some languages be offered on-line.

Currently some schools have to spend large amounts on their budgets on ESOL and others spend money on foreign languages not offered at other schools. If you’re a non-ESOL kid at the former you simply don’t have access to the same opportunities. You might be able to pupil place but that means arranging your own transportation, which isn’t feasible for a lot of families.

online offerings are not equivalent to in person. I think the answer is large schools where there are enough students to justify offerings at multiple levels. West Potomac and Herndon have high farms percentages and manage to have robust course catalogs because they are massive.

Herndon isn’t massive. It has a below-average enrollment for an FCPS high school.

But Langley, Madison, and Marshall have an even lower enrollment. Herndon looks under enrolled because they gave it a massive expansion to make up for the lack of a Western High School.

Those are two different issues. Herndon has a below-average enrollment for an FCPS high school. And it also has a lot of excess capacity now, which they may take advantage of in connection with the ongoing boundary study.

Only if they split feeder cooper. HMS doesn’t have capacity, now or in the future.

Yeah, they could make Cooper a split feeder if they needed to. Or they could put a modular at HMS, if that avoids having hundreds of empty seats at HHS for years.

The misalignment between MS and HS within a pyramid isn't just limited to the Herndon pyramid. They don't and won't any time soon have a perfect solution that aligns with the goals of using available capacity and minimizing commuting distances while avoiding split feeders.

In the western part of the county, there’s actually a surplus of middle school seats compared to high school seats because they’re missing a high school. They would be better off kicking South Lakes and Oakton out of Carson and making Carson a split feeder between Westfield and the silver line corridor of Herndon. Get Westfield out of Franklin so it only feeds Chantilly and Oakton. That takes care of 2 of the 3 tri-feeders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

WS won't be so happy. They'd probably have to give up Orange Hunt and Hunt Valley to LBSS and South County so they can take in Crestwood and Lynbrook. Hayfield as well would need to take some poorer neighborhoods. Even closing Lewis would be protested by other pyramids.

You are not reading the room.

No one wants to get rezoned to Lewis in its current state, not even the Edison and Hayfield families.

Right. No one will be totally happy with any outcome, but this seems like a win for most, especially with PP’s idea to repurpose the building for ESL, childcare, trade, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

WS won't be so happy. They'd probably have to give up Orange Hunt and Hunt Valley to LBSS and South County so they can take in Crestwood and Lynbrook. Hayfield as well would need to take some poorer neighborhoods. Even closing Lewis would be protested by other pyramids.

Lewis borders 6 other high school zones, with WSHS nor even the closest neighboring school.

Lewis sends way more kids to Lake Braddock than WSHS whoch is closed to transfers.

Lewis is practically next door to Edison.

Why are you singularly focusing your ire on WSHS and ignoring Lewis' 5 other neighboring high schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

Parent zoned for Lewis here, and I’d be fine with this. It seems like the easiest and least controversial option of all that have been floated thus far.

If they do that, then they should turn Lewis into an opt in non traditional high school for new arrivals and older students, with citizenship, English language immersion and US cultural classes as well as a trades magnet and child crare services.

I believe FCPS used to have something like this at one of the alternative HS’s and it was closed during the recession due to lack of funding. That was one of the things that lead to more problems at Lewis (and some other schools, but a lot of recent arrivals landed in Springfield) in terms of student achievement and behavior. I agree, they really need this type of program given the demographics in the county.

And yes, closing Lewis and distributing its feeders was also discussed by Gatehouse at some point, and yes, it would be disruptive to the nearby HS’s that are already on the edge in terms of demographics. You’d close Lewis, but then Annandale, Justice, and Edison would become a lot worse, and the spillover affects would extend to Hayfield, South County, and West Springfield.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Close Lewis, save the renovation costs. Send the current students to the other schools next to them. Problem solved. The current students get an equitable outcome.

WS won't be so happy. They'd probably have to give up Orange Hunt and Hunt Valley to LBSS and South County so they can take in Crestwood and Lynbrook. Hayfield as well would need to take some poorer neighborhoods. Even closing Lewis would be protested by other pyramids.

Lewis borders 6 other high school zones, with WSHS nor even the closest neighboring school.

Lewis sends way more kids to Lake Braddock than WSHS whoch is closed to transfers.

Lewis is practically next door to Edison.

Why are you singularly focusing your ire on WSHS and ignoring Lewis' 5 other neighboring high schools?

Why is your sole focus "WSHS must be rezoned come hell or high water" with a heavy dose of lalalalala stick fingers in ears at any more practical, long term solution?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yes offer the unusual languages online to cut down on transfers out even further.

Online is not as effective nor anywhere near an equivalent to an in person class with classmates and live teachers.

Language involves not just speech and hearing but body language and nuances that are unavailable online.

Keep the obscure languages throughout the county.

Take advantage of Lewis's low enrollment to renovate and fix its multiple building and facility issues that make the campus sub par to the other high schools, while taking a deep dive into what is failing and what can be fixed academically.

Then, when Lewis is in a similar physical condition to the rest of the FCPS, revisit if there is a need for rezoning during the 2031 cycle.

After all, rezoning every 5 years gives the school board plenty of time to work on the issues that make transferring to Lewis unpalatable to many of its neighbors, not just its WSHS neighbors but its South County, Lake Braddock, Hayfield and even its Edison neighbors.

You can have a strong school in a cramped, sub par, unrenovated building with rutted sports fields, and people will happily send their kids there if the academics are good.

You can have a middling school in a beautiful, newly renovated building, and people will send their kids there without a fuss.

You can have an exceptional school in a beautiful facility, and people will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids there.

What you can't have is a poorly performing school in a run down, neglected building at a terrible location with aging, low quality sports fields that is by far the most neglected physical campus in the entire county. People will fight tooth and nail to keep their kids out of there.

If fcps rezones kids into the failing school with the neglected campus, they won't send their kids there. They will pull them for private school or find a transfer loophole and we will end up in the same place for Lewis.

But if FCPS gives Lewis a beautiful renovation so it at least looks like the other high schools, they will have better chance of turning that school around and making it less of a pariah.

Annandale and McLean are older than Lewis, and both currently rely on modulars, so they deserve to be renovated before Lewis. And none of these schools are likely to get renovated before 2031. Maybe they could start on Annandale, the oldest of the three, but they’ll finish Centreville first unless they completely revamp the CIP.

They could come out with a new renovation queue soon to at least give people comfort that renovations are on the horizon, but that’s about it. If that’s not good enough, they should just close Lewis.

Centerville is a fairly nice school compared to the ones you listed.

Maybe the can bump up the exterior and sports field renovations for those 3 schools, then move them up to the top of the renivation queu before doing any rezoning into them (rezoning out should procede if the schools are very overcrowded like you say McLean is.)

Centreville may be very nice, but it's also in the current renovation queue and the CIP for an upcoming renovation. Annandale, McLean, and Lewis aren't, because they'd been renovated before the queue was developed. Those renovations may have been cut-rate compared to later school renovations, but there's little indication FCPS is going to jettison the existing renovation queue to account for that.

I didn't say McLean is very overcrowded. If you take the modular into account, it's modestly overcrowded now, but not at the level that historically got FCPS thinking it needed to adjust boundaries (i.e., over 110% capacity). Its sports fields are also generally in good shape. The major costs associated with renovations are things like building systems that would get revamped, new classrooms, etc.