Common Core question for proponents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
It's not the standardized testing; it's the high stakes nature of it and it being (potentially) based on a set of "national" standards that make it different from how it has been in the past.

1.) What's different from the past is that there's an expectation of accountability. How individual districts choose to take on that accountability is more the problem than the fact that there is more accountability. Blaming and firing the current teacher for the failings of prior teachers is certainly a problem, but not one that Common Core or NCLB ever mandated, that's stupidity on the part of individual districts and their administrators. Blaming standardized testing and standards for that is thus misguided and doesn't get at your problem, because even if you get rid of standards and testing, you still have stupid administrators.

2.) What exactly is your problem with national standards? Why exactly should Alabama have different reading and math standards than Connecticut? I have yet to hear an educationally sound explanation for that.

[Anonymous]

What data are you looking for?

The real feedback from the teachers. It surely must be compiled somewhere. Did they send out surveys--or just request comment. Did any teachers actual try these standards for a year?

[Anonymous]

What data are you looking for?

The actual research data that supposedly supported the standards.

[Anonymous]

^ The standards were compiled from pre-existing state standards that had been in place for years prior...

Did you not know that?

[Anonymous]

1.) What's different from the past is that there's an expectation of accountability. How individual districts choose to take on that accountability is more the problem than the fact that there is more accountability. Blaming and firing the current teacher for the failings of prior teachers is certainly a problem, but not one that Common Core or NCLB ever mandated, that's stupidity on the part of individual districts and their administrators. Blaming standardized testing and standards for that is thus misguided and doesn't get at your problem, because even if you get rid of standards and testing, you still have stupid administrators.

Which is why the solutions must be more local.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

1.) What's different from the past is that there's an expectation of accountability. How individual districts choose to take on that accountability is more the problem than the fact that there is more accountability. Blaming and firing the current teacher for the failings of prior teachers is certainly a problem, but not one that Common Core or NCLB ever mandated, that's stupidity on the part of individual districts and their administrators. Blaming standardized testing and standards for that is thus misguided and doesn't get at your problem, because even if you get rid of standards and testing, you still have stupid administrators.

Which is why the solutions must be more local.

The solutions have to be local, because of stupid administrators? I don't get it. Do Florida's stupid administrators require different solutions from New Hampshire's stupid administrators?

[Anonymous]

^ The standards were compiled from pre-existing state standards that had been in place for years prior...

Did you not know that?

They claim research will also be used. What data supports the selection of those standards. There is no supporting data available to the public.

[Anonymous]

The people who put out the standards have to be held accountable. No one is above accountability. Account for how the standards were decided on. We need an educationally sound explanation for these CC standards in particular. Where did each one come from if they were pre-existing in certain states? Detail each standard and the rationale behind it and where it came from if it pre-existed. Were they just considered "good" because someone thought so or was there data to justify their soundness. If teachers are to be evaluated on data from these standards, the makers of the standards should be held to some quantifiable accountability as well (or are some people in the process above that while others are not?).

[Anonymous]

The solutions have to be local, because of stupid administrators? I don't get it. Do Florida's stupid administrators require different solutions from New Hampshire's stupid administrators?

Most likely. Happy families are all alike. Every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

1.) What's different from the past is that there's an expectation of accountability. How individual districts choose to take on that accountability is more the problem than the fact that there is more accountability. Blaming and firing the current teacher for the failings of prior teachers is certainly a problem, but not one that Common Core or NCLB ever mandated, that's stupidity on the part of individual districts and their administrators. Blaming standardized testing and standards for that is thus misguided and doesn't get at your problem, because even if you get rid of standards and testing, you still have stupid administrators.

Which is why the solutions must be more local.

LMAO! Read again. The "local solution" has for decades been to hire stupid administrators who would fire the 9th grade teacher for having 9th grade students who can't read at grade level because the elementary school teachers didn't adequately teach phonics. That's a massive fail at the "local solution" level. MASSIVE fail. Do you not understand that, does it go over your head?

[Anonymous]

LMAO! Read again. The "local solution" has for decades been to hire stupid administrators who would fire the 9th grade teacher for having 9th grade students who can't read at grade level because the elementary school teachers didn't adequately teach phonics. That's a massive fail at the "local solution" level. MASSIVE fail. Do you not understand that, does it go over your head?

Not either PP, but that is absolutely not true. It is far more likely with the current NCLB and CC solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The solutions have to be local, because of stupid administrators? I don't get it. Do Florida's stupid administrators require different solutions from New Hampshire's stupid administrators?

Most likely. Happy families are all alike. Every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way.

But actually Tolstoy (who didn't know much about happy families) was wrong about this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

LMAO! Read again. The "local solution" has for decades been to hire stupid administrators who would fire the 9th grade teacher for having 9th grade students who can't read at grade level because the elementary school teachers didn't adequately teach phonics. That's a massive fail at the "local solution" level. MASSIVE fail. Do you not understand that, does it go over your head?

Not either PP, but that is absolutely not true. It is far more likely with the current NCLB and CC solution.

Oh, it's DEFINITELY true. The original fail has always been with things like the ES teachers who are putting more energy into sight words which end up crippling students, as opposed to teaching phonics. NCLB and testing expose those existing problems, they didn't create those problems. It seems to me that you are utterly confused on what is the symptom, versus what is the disease, let alone what the cure might be.

The only real question remaining is the cure - how to address those problems - but again, NCLB leaves it up to the local solution to figure out how to address those problems. Some school districts do it the stupid way, by indiscriminately firing the wrong teachers, whereas other school districts address it by going back and looking at their curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Oh, it's DEFINITELY true. The original fail has always been with things like the ES teachers who are putting more energy into sight words which end up crippling students, as opposed to teaching phonics. NCLB and testing expose those existing problems, they didn't create those problems. It seems to me that you are utterly confused on what is the symptom, versus what is the disease, let alone what the cure might be.

This would be funny if you weren't so clueless. FWIW, elementary teachers do teach phonics and have been for years. The problem starts long before first grade.

[Anonymous]

This would be funny if you weren't so clueless. FWIW, elementary teachers do teach phonics and have been for years. The problem starts long before first grade.

+10000

It's scary to think that this person might work for the DOE!