Five weeks in. RTO is literally killing me!

[Anonymous]

When I get worn down from RTO or anything else at work, I think "300 people who got RIFd from here would love to have this problem".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The traffic; the schedule; the hardship on my family (my kids!!). This is just awful.

How can trump do this to us?? I mean, just WHY??!?

Reading this sounds exhausting. I always worked opposite of traffic and for low wages. Didn't take long to replace my low income with passive income and stop working.
I sit at home and chill while they are at school. Both are old enough to get to school without me. Life is awesome finally.

What’s your passive income from?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:RTO has been a disaster for us, productivity is down because people were using those extra non commuting hours to work extra. Now most are just doing the standard 8 hours and not one minute more.

On the plus side, I no longer feel guilty of i don't finish up my work by the end of the day, quitting time is quitting time and now I have a clear demarcation of hours that are my time. No more working unpaid overtime, no more working on weekends here and there.

I'm also using sick leave more because I don't want to go into the office sick, and I have an invisible autoimmune disorder which makes it easier for me to catch viruses, with everyone else coming into work half sick. It is what it is.

Of course I am looking for a remote position on my lunch break, so time to get back to the search!

What’s a RA?

Get an RA! Seriously. Even if you are in government. I can’t believe how people sacrifice their health for their jobs. I have an RA and I am still remote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:RTO has been a disaster for us, productivity is down because people were using those extra non commuting hours to work extra. Now most are just doing the standard 8 hours and not one minute more.

On the plus side, I no longer feel guilty of i don't finish up my work by the end of the day, quitting time is quitting time and now I have a clear demarcation of hours that are my time. No more working unpaid overtime, no more working on weekends here and there.

I'm also using sick leave more because I don't want to go into the office sick, and I have an invisible autoimmune disorder which makes it easier for me to catch viruses, with everyone else coming into work half sick. It is what it is.

Of course I am looking for a remote position on my lunch break, so time to get back to the search!

What’s a RA?

Get an RA! Seriously. Even if you are in government. I can’t believe how people sacrifice their health for their jobs. I have an RA and I am still remote.

My husband was working remote long before Covid. I have serious health issues. He was recalled in Jan for five days a week. If you need the income, you do it. What choice do we have?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IF folks think they do their jobs 100% remote, then why do we need to keep jobs in US? I'm sur companies can get cheaper and smarter labor overseas. Especially Asian countries.

I mean, I'm a lawyer who works remotely part time. People overseas don't have law degrees. My Dad does telehealth visits with patients sometimes, does that mean you'd want an overseas doctor? They don't have medical licenses.

That argument is absurd.

We use military insurance. They rarely see patients in person. Bulk is phone calls. Foreign is fine if they are better doctors.

Kaiser Permanente here- same. It does make it easy to get referrals though! I even had an orthopedic surgeon looking over xrays on zoom the other day.

No, because I still wait 3-9 months for specialists appointments even for a 5 minute phone call. It’s taking me years to get diagnosed because I can only get follow ups every 3-6 months. I often cannot see the same doctor twice.

What type of specialists are booked that far out? Mental health?

Allergy, pulmology, and gi-liver are 3-4 months, same with cardiology, and a few others. Cannot get into the sleep clinic. Ultrasounds, CT’s and mri s are 2-3 months but it takes ages months of calling to get an appointment. Genetics is 9-10 months. And that’s for existing patients, new is longer. I cannot even get into the specialist I really need.

All health. And, peds I had to schedule an appointment in March for August and it’s not even a proper slot as they had no physicals available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If employers want to go back to 1995, I'm going back to 1995 too.

No overtime without overtime pay, no checking email on weekends, I do my 8 hours 5 days a week and take my 30 minute lunch break outside the building and that's it.

It's what you have to do to be able to just do other basic activities of living if employers won't be flexible.

You obviously weren’t working a professional job in 1995. Yes, white collar salaried workers were working way more than 40 hours a week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If employers want to go back to 1995, I'm going back to 1995 too.

No overtime without overtime pay, no checking email on weekends, I do my 8 hours 5 days a week and take my 30 minute lunch break outside the building and that's it.

It's what you have to do to be able to just do other basic activities of living if employers won't be flexible.

You obviously weren’t working a professional job in 1995. Yes, white collar salaried workers were working way more than 40 hours a week.

My dad, a PhD chemist who was a group leader in the ag industry at that time, was absolutely not working more than 40 a week in 1995.

When I interned at his company as a college student, I learned that company policy was to tell them where to reach you when you were on vacation.

I said “Dad, have you been doing this?” In 20+ years he had never once gotten contacted on vacation, so I wondered.

He said “Hell no. The only people who do that hate their families.”

No cell phone. Minimal email. Carpooler, so set transportation times every day.

Yes, I would take 1995 rules.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those who insist on terminating TW are usually old men, people without children, or those who never did much childrearing. This generation of parents actually wants to spend time with their kids, we want to be able to cook a home cook meal several times a week, and see them after work for more than an hour, we don't want to be shitty/absent parents. TW simply gives us two hours of our lives back (at least!), time we can dedicate to our families and not commuting.

We are the generation that deeply understands why birthrates are going down. A society that refuses to support parents is doomed, young people will look at us and say "hard pass".

This has been definitely true for DH's office. The retiring Boomers seem to be the last generation hardcore into in-office work. Xers on down, not so much.

I can’t think of anyone in my office of any age who likes full time RTO.

Before 2025, my office had the option to work in the office or fully remote. Only around 10% chose to come into the office and of those, they were older and/or didn't have children at home. Due to such a dramatic difference, I can't imagine that RTO is dead forever. It will gradually come back when the boomers move on, though that could take another decade.

It's not so much that most of us like it, but we are honest enough to recognize it has benefits. Hybrid approach is probably most beneficial for all.

Maybe to your job requires team collaboration, but our office is mainly individual contributor type work. I will admit it's nice to catch up on non related work gossip and happenings, but that is not a necessary function.

It’s not a simple as this. What many people who wfh refuse to acknowledge is that one usually isn’t as productive working at home. I know many people, feds and private sector alike, who would go to the gym, grocery shop, get a haircut, etc in the middle of the work day (and not work later to make up the time).

Joke is on them. The gym at our Fed office (and also at dh’s) is fab. Everyone is working out now in the middle of the day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Those who insist on terminating TW are usually old men, people without children, or those who never did much childrearing. This generation of parents actually wants to spend time with their kids, we want to be able to cook a home cook meal several times a week, and see them after work for more than an hour, we don't want to be shitty/absent parents. TW simply gives us two hours of our lives back (at least!), time we can dedicate to our families and not commuting.

We are the generation that deeply understands why birthrates are going down. A society that refuses to support parents is doomed, young people will look at us and say "hard pass".

This has been definitely true for DH's office. The retiring Boomers seem to be the last generation hardcore into in-office work. Xers on down, not so much.

I can’t think of anyone in my office of any age who likes full time RTO.

Before 2025, my office had the option to work in the office or fully remote. Only around 10% chose to come into the office and of those, they were older and/or didn't have children at home. Due to such a dramatic difference, I can't imagine that RTO is dead forever. It will gradually come back when the boomers move on, though that could take another decade.

It's not so much that most of us like it, but we are honest enough to recognize it has benefits. Hybrid approach is probably most beneficial for all.

Maybe to your job requires team collaboration, but our office is mainly individual contributor type work. I will admit it's nice to catch up on non related work gossip and happenings, but that is not a necessary function.

It’s not a simple as this. What many people who wfh refuse to acknowledge is that one usually isn’t as productive working at home. I know many people, feds and private sector alike, who would go to the gym, grocery shop, get a haircut, etc in the middle of the work day (and not work later to make up the time).

I and many co-workers are actually less productive in the office. First of all we are more tired from getting up earlier and commuting. Then, we don’t even have adequate equipment because the government won’t let us buy anything. We also take time settling in and talking to coworkers in the hallways. We also have a gym at work and some people are going there during the day.

If people who WFH are really running errands on work time, they don’t have good management or there isn’t enough work to do.

[Anonymous]

It feels like CEOs and planners have ignored how certain trends changed the workplace overall. Many jobs don’t take 40 hours anymore due to automation, AI etc. Our local city hall seems to have a lot of people whose jobs really shouldn’t exist anymore. Applying for some permits, licenses etc should be outsourced to a third party website but instead you have to stand in line and talk to Carol, who wants to stay until retirement. The problem in most small towns however is that if we fire all these people and outsource their jobs then everyone in town will be u employed. dOGE is probably correct to say “this could be a website and doesn’t have to be a person” but there is no overall plan for what to do with all of us. This is equally true at the university where I work. Lots of nice older women who used to do things like print out the professors lecture, staple them and put them in binders. I have no idea what they do now but they are still employed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh shut up! You have a job! Be grateful!

What did you do before Covid?!


Oh poor you- you have to prioritize and work and learn to adjust. Stop blaming the admin!

DP. Before Covid we worked remotely three days a week. Can’t speak for other people but I’m an attorney and literally all private sector opportunities are not required 100% in office every day a week which is especially infuriating because I turned down other opportunities to work in the government.

I’ve also clerked and worked in a larger agency and both times the drinking water has tested positive for a bunch of nasty stuff. Who knows what else is in these buildings impacting our health.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It feels like CEOs and planners have ignored how certain trends changed the workplace overall. Many jobs don’t take 40 hours anymore due to automation, AI etc. Our local city hall seems to have a lot of people whose jobs really shouldn’t exist anymore. Applying for some permits, licenses etc should be outsourced to a third party website but instead you have to stand in line and talk to Carol, who wants to stay until retirement. The problem in most small towns however is that if we fire all these people and outsource their jobs then everyone in town will be u employed. dOGE is probably correct to say “this could be a website and doesn’t have to be a person” but there is no overall plan for what to do with all of us. This is equally true at the university where I work. Lots of nice older women who used to do things like print out the professors lecture, staple them and put them in binders. I have no idea what they do now but they are still employed.

I’m sure you won’t see the irony in your post. Do you realize that there are still a lot of people who need Carol because they don’t have access to the computer or don’t know how to use it? I’m sure, like DOGE, you’d just tell these people “too bad.” Your privilege and ignorance is showing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If teachers were being given punitive directives in order to get them to quit -- not even from their principals but from district leadership that wanted to sole source/privatize their jobs -- I would also object to that.

I mean sure. But simply requiring you to come to the office ain’t that.

My coworkers were given 12 hours notice, are working in random conference rooms, and our leadership is not allowed to get exceptions for them. It absolutely is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If teachers were being given punitive directives in order to get them to quit -- not even from their principals but from district leadership that wanted to sole source/privatize their jobs -- I would also object to that.

If teachers had their unions destroyed to force them to work in conditions that were not part of their bargaining agreement, they would object.

Or they can come into DCUM and be shitty to fed workers.

Or Fed workers can learn not to be tone deaf and realize that they still have a job if they are going in.

The next step is RIFs. But if they can get people to leave more cheaply and with fewer opportunities for lawsuits, they'd prefer that. This is not about your personal class resentment drama.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If teachers were being given punitive directives in order to get them to quit -- not even from their principals but from district leadership that wanted to sole source/privatize their jobs -- I would also object to that.

If teachers had their unions destroyed to force them to work in conditions that were not part of their bargaining agreement, they would object.

Or they can come into DCUM and be shitty to fed workers.

Or Fed workers can learn not to be tone deaf and realize that they still have a job if they are going in.

The next step is RIFs. But if they can get people to leave more cheaply and with fewer opportunities for lawsuits, they'd prefer that. This is not about your personal class resentment drama.

I have no resentment towards federal workers. I think this administration is absolutely abhorrent. But on this one particular issue of simply going back into the office, you're not getting much sympathy from me since most people have to go in as well. We can talk about all of those other issues if you like, but you need to realize that you're not going to get much sympathy for whining about having to go into the office.