DDOT's latest plan to destroy traffic, Georgia Avenue edition

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Changing a major artery impacts the side streets, but also the cross streets. Just trying to get past GA Ave going in either direction is a mess. Making main arteries in the city less useful to the traffic they were designed to carry makes all the other roads less safe.

Why are they using main arteries for this? Why not take a parallel side street and make that the bike and bus street? busses need to stop frequently impeding traffic, so give them their own street, don't change the main care avenues. Bikers would be safer on a parallel road a block over, which would also deter cars from using those side streets for cut through.

The city is a grid, this should be possible.

Because they are the main arteries.

Roads are for all modes of transportation, not just cars. Buses? Traffic. Bikes? Traffic. Walking? Traffic. If you want a cars-only road, use the Beltway.

You want to change the paradigm that roads are for cars and make them for all sorts of things. That is a preference of yours, not a given. So I guess not wanting to change the paradigm is a preference also. I don't care about your preference. You don't care about mine. So why are we having a discussion?

Roads are for whoever the people who live in the city want them to be for. Not buying it that I can't support bus lanes just because DC politicians ripped up streetcar tracks years before I was born in order to give space over to cars.

Well that is what you think. What do you want us to do with the revelation of thoughts in your head? It is certainly not going to change my behavior. Why would it?

I mean, it doesn't have to change your behavior. But the DC DOT put out plans to change GA Ave to make it more usable for people who aren't in cars- which means that the DOT thinks that roads are not for cars. Unless you are the mayor, they likely have more power than you do, arguing with people on the internet that the fact that you think roads are for cars means anything.

I didn't say it means anything. That is my point. The people in power are going to do what they want to do. Don't pretend that you care about my opinion or that I have buy in to the decision making. So you are happy with what the people in power are doing, go, be happy. What are you trying to do with us here? You don’t care about our opinion.

Serious question: why do you keep posting on here with your (singular you, not plural you) opinion? What are you (singular you, not plural you) trying to do here? It seems to me that what you're trying to do here is complain. First, complain about Georgia Avenue. Second, complain about responses to your posts.

Just because you mark your question as serious doesn't mean I cave to your demand of an answer. Get in power and do what you want. Those that oppose you will do the same. You are wasting your time here.

You know how to use the emoji function! I do too!

We have typing skills!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Changing a major artery impacts the side streets, but also the cross streets. Just trying to get past GA Ave going in either direction is a mess. Making main arteries in the city less useful to the traffic they were designed to carry makes all the other roads less safe.

Why are they using main arteries for this? Why not take a parallel side street and make that the bike and bus street? busses need to stop frequently impeding traffic, so give them their own street, don't change the main care avenues. Bikers would be safer on a parallel road a block over, which would also deter cars from using those side streets for cut through.

The city is a grid, this should be possible.

Because they are the main arteries.

Roads are for all modes of transportation, not just cars. Buses? Traffic. Bikes? Traffic. Walking? Traffic. If you want a cars-only road, use the Beltway.

You want to change the paradigm that roads are for cars and make them for all sorts of things. That is a preference of yours, not a given. So I guess not wanting to change the paradigm is a preference also. I don't care about your preference. You don't care about mine. So why are we having a discussion?

Roads are for whoever the people who live in the city want them to be for. Not buying it that I can't support bus lanes just because DC politicians ripped up streetcar tracks years before I was born in order to give space over to cars.

Well that is what you think. What do you want us to do with the revelation of thoughts in your head? It is certainly not going to change my behavior. Why would it?

I mean, it doesn't have to change your behavior. But the DC DOT put out plans to change GA Ave to make it more usable for people who aren't in cars- which means that the DOT thinks that roads are not for cars. Unless you are the mayor, they likely have more power than you do, arguing with people on the internet that the fact that you think roads are for cars means anything.

I didn't say it means anything. That is my point. The people in power are going to do what they want to do. Don't pretend that you care about my opinion or that I have buy in to the decision making. So you are happy with what the people in power are doing, go, be happy. What are you trying to do with us here? You don’t care about our opinion.

I don't think the statement "roads are for cars" is an opinion per se- I think it is a policy statement. Yes, if your opinion is that "only cars should be allowed on Georgia Ave" then I don't care about your opinion. I personally think that cars should be allowed on Georgia but that other modes should be taken into account- if you only care about one method then your opinion is pretty worthless from a policy standpoint- other people list in this world

Yes of course everyone is talking about their policy preferences. Are you going to change your policy preference based on what someone states here? From your response, sounds like no. Why do you expect me to? You say "I personally think...". Well "I personally think roads are for cars". So what do we do now? You think I am going to listen to you lecture without telling you that you are wasting your time?

Most people recognize that policies are compromises.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Why don't you go down to Georgia Avenue, at whatever time you like and for however long you like, and count the children you see. Report back to us. And we'll compare your number to the 20,000+ children who live in the surrounding neighborhoods.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Well I guess you think kids go to these places by the tone of your question, which really isn't a question, but a lecture. You have your opinions, we have ours. Do what you want.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

I live a few blocks from Georgia and rarely cross it on foot with my kids (ironically when I do it is usually when I am getting off the bus). My oldest is in 4th grade and sometimes walks to or from school alone- I would never let him do this if he had to cross Georgia. In other words, the reason you might not see that many kids on Georgia is because drivers are insane and people don't feel safe walking on it. I am very much in support of this plan. If drivers want to try to hold DC residents hostage by saying that they will drive dangerously in residential streets as well then let's add in speed bumps on the side roads as well.

There are several schools (John Lewis, Truesdell come to mine) that have boundaries that cross Georgia Ave by the way. The four year old who was killed was a Truesdell student.

Speedbumps are dumb. Cars just go through stop signs to make up for lost time. I'd rather have drivers stop at intersections than randomly slow down in the middle of the block.

I've got news for you: if you are regularly running stop signs to make up for the time you lost at speed bumps, you are both in the minority and a dangerous driver.

I just live in the real world. People respond to traffic calming proposals in ways that aren't obvious or desirable that sometimes make traffic calming proposals a net negative for safety.

Traffic calming advocates assume they can make drivers' commutes substantially longer and drivers will just take it. The problem is: They won't! They are jealous of their time and they will do all kinds of things, many you would never think of, to make sure their commutes do not get longer, regardless of whatever crazy idea DDOT proposes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

I live a few blocks from Georgia and rarely cross it on foot with my kids (ironically when I do it is usually when I am getting off the bus). My oldest is in 4th grade and sometimes walks to or from school alone- I would never let him do this if he had to cross Georgia. In other words, the reason you might not see that many kids on Georgia is because drivers are insane and people don't feel safe walking on it. I am very much in support of this plan. If drivers want to try to hold DC residents hostage by saying that they will drive dangerously in residential streets as well then let's add in speed bumps on the side roads as well.

There are several schools (John Lewis, Truesdell come to mine) that have boundaries that cross Georgia Ave by the way. The four year old who was killed was a Truesdell student.

Speedbumps are dumb. Cars just go through stop signs to make up for lost time. I'd rather have drivers stop at intersections than randomly slow down in the middle of the block.

I've got news for you: if you are regularly running stop signs to make up for the time you lost at speed bumps, you are both in the minority and a dangerous driver.

I just live in the real world. People respond to traffic calming proposals in ways that aren't obvious or desirable that sometimes make traffic calming proposals a net negative for safety.

Traffic calming advocates assume they can make drivers' commutes substantially longer and drivers will just take it. The problem is: They won't! They are jealous of their time and they will do all kinds of things, many you would never think of, to make sure their commutes do not get longer, regardless of whatever crazy idea DDOT proposes.

But magical thinking has power!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

Nope

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

Nope

Maybe you can’t see all the kids because they aren’t the type of kids you want to protect. I live a block from Georgia and fully support the bus lanes. Where are you posting from?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

This dewy-eyed, whitewashed vision of Georgia Avenue is great! Now do Benning Avenue. Tell us how every child, and their parents, wish they could hang out on Benning Road.

[Anonymous]

The argument that if we don't all agree Georgia Avenue should be a speedway to shuttle individual drivers in individual cars from their homes in MD to their offices downtown, then those drivers will go on murderous rampage of children on Petworth residential streets, is insane.

I'm sorry traffic is bad. All evidence ponts to the idea that the only way to address the issue on a long-term basis is to move people to more efficient modes of transportation. That includes buses. If you'd rather plow through crowds of school children in a residential neighborhood going 50 in 15 than take the bus, then I suggest it's time to rethink your values system.

I've taken the bus to work for years. It's fine. It's not as luxurious as driving my own car and parking in the building but it costs a tiny fraction of that option so whatever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

Nope

Maybe you can’t see all the kids because they aren’t the type of kids you want to protect. I live a block from Georgia and fully support the bus lanes. Where are you posting from?

If you live in the area, you know there are approximately zero kids who live on or hang out on Georgia Avenue. This whole thread is so utterly divorced from reality.

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Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

Of course there are children on Georgia Avenue.

Why shouldn't the side streets be safe for kids AND Georgia Avenue be safe for kids?

Ha! What are these hordes of children doing on Georgia Avenue? Are they going to liquor stores? Are they buying lottery tickets? Maybe they're getting their car washed?

Yes, Georgia Avenue is a wonderland for kids of all ages.

Perhaps they are attending school or crossing the street after leaving school.

Such as at El Haynes:
https://www.elhaynes.org/contact/

or

Center City PCS:
https://www.myschooldc.org/schools/profile/146

That doesn't even count the schools that are a block or two off of Georgia Avenue.

Believe it or not people live in DC.

Exactly. This is why we should keep the traffic on Georgia Avenue. There's no kids on Georgia Avenue. There's a million kids in the surrounding area. Some, inevitably, will be killed as cars race through nearby neighborhoods trying to avoid Georgia Avenue.

This isn't hard. Cars should be where people expect them to be. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road with lots of traffic. No one thinks of fkning Gallatin Street as a major thoroughfare.

Do you think the kids at these schools just apparate to appear at the school a few blocks from Georgia ave? You can see how drivers going miles and miles from MD to downtown DC would need to use Georgia but you can't imagine how a child who goes to school a few blocks from Georgia would need to use it? I live in DC a certainly don't think that I use the beltway more or have more of a need for it than someone who lives in Kensington.

Have you been on Georgia Avenue? It is basically a very long stretch of liquor stores, barber shops, car washes, bodegas, drug addicts and homeless people. It's not really a big place for kids to go.

Starting at Eastern Ave and going south, the following are on Georgia: Target, the Shepherd Park Library, a craft store, apartment buildings (in which children live), the Parks at Walter Reed (which includes a daycare, nail salon, restaurants and playground, all on Georgia), a CVS, Walmart, McDonalds (several), another playground. You don't take your kids to any of those places?

Also, you think kids don't do to barber shops?

Plus an awesome thrift store, at least two other daycares, a community center and park, Petworth library, numerous restaurants, and Banneker pool. Sorry this no kids on Georgia poster is just weird. Georgia is a vibrant place. There are absolutely kids there. There would be more if it were a safer street.

This dewy-eyed, whitewashed vision of Georgia Avenue is great! Now do Benning Avenue. Tell us how every child, and their parents, wish they could hang out on Benning Road.

I live in Trinidad and while I agree Benning is awful now, I'd love it if we could improve the area enough for kids to be able to hang out on Benning. There are tons of kids in the surrounding neighborhood and it's actually terrible that we have to avoid most of the major roads in the area because they are unsafe.

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Anonymous wrote:Love it; bring it to more of the major streets. Thanks DDOT!

Seems like this makes the streets more dangerous, not less.

Drivers aren't going to sit in traffic, and they're not going to switch to the bus. This will just shift traffic onto all the smaller streets around Georgia Avenue. How is that better?

Seems like it's better to focus traffic on big roads where everyone expects there to be lots of cars. I would be pissed if I lived in a neighborhood near Georgia.

This is the main question here that no one can seem to answer.

They don't want to answer it. The data and research is very clear that increasing congestion on heavily congested roads decreases safety. This isn't about safety. It has never been.

The data and research that you made up in your head.

In the actual world, the data and research are very clear that slower speeds make a street safer for everyone, including drivers.

Are you the AI bot, or the 19 yr old city planning intern with nothing else to do all afternoon? These insipid IKnowYouAreButWhatAmI responses are boresome. You're flat wrong.

Anyway, the actual data show that squeezing traffic to a standstill on a designated arterial will induce diversion to side roads. That situation is not, in fact, safer for anyone. High volume traffic on designated local streets is more dangerous for pedestrians, cyclists, pets, and 3 yr old scooter riders who misjudge the curb.

Your term paper thesis is going to kill a 3 yr old someday soon in the District. Is that okay with you?

[Mic drop]

Is it ok with you that an actual four year old was actually killed by a driver on Georgia Avenue?

Are you even from here? There's virtually no children on Georgia Avenue because their parents are like, "stay the F away from Georgia Avenue because there's too many cars." There's tens of thousands of children in the neighborhoods abutting Georgia Avenue that will be put in serious danger by this plan.

To repeat, AN ACTUAL FOUR YEAR OLD WAS ACTUALLY KILLED BY A DRIVER ON GEORGIA AVENUE. But that doesn't matter to you, because ... well, why?

Wow. Your caps make your dumb arguments so much more convincing! Again, go to Georgia Avenue and count how many children you see. You will only need one hand. Then go to look up how many kids live in nearby neighborhoods, walking to school and playing with friends, who will suddenly be put in immediate danger as tens of thousands of drivers go racing through their neighborhoods to avoid Georgia Avenue. This isn't hard. Well, maybe for you it is...

Yeah, you haven't answered the question. Why are potential kids, who might potentially be killed, more important to you than this actual child who was actually killed on Georgia Avenue? Wasn't his safety important too?

Are you aware of how completely crazy you sound? You think we should put tens of thousands of kids in danger because there was a kid killed on Georgia Avenue five years ago?

I'm still waiting for you to acknowledge that Georgia Avenue is dangerous for kids, right now.

You mean kid, singular? There's not many children on Georgia Avenue because of the whole lots-of-cars-thing.

I would be ashamed of myself, if I claimed to be worried about kids' safety, but I just hand-waved away a four-year-old child who was killed. Apparently you're only worried about some kids' safety. My idea is that all streets in DC should be safe for all kids.

I dont mean to be rude, but you are a complete moron. Seriously. You should never talk.

Name calling is where people who can't debate go to hide.

I think the issue is that there is very few children on Georgia Avenue. There's a lot of traffic there and have you ever been on Georgia Avenue? There's not a lot of reason for children to be on Georgia Avenue!

But in the surrounding neighborhoods, there is a huge, huge number of children. There are more kids in Ward 4 than anywhere else in the city. One quarter of everyone who lives there is under the of 18.

If you make traffic terrible on Georgia Avenue, tens of thousands of drivers will cut through all the side streets where those children live and where there is not a lot of traffic currently. Those kids will be put in imminent danger by this plan.

I live a few blocks from Georgia and rarely cross it on foot with my kids (ironically when I do it is usually when I am getting off the bus). My oldest is in 4th grade and sometimes walks to or from school alone- I would never let him do this if he had to cross Georgia. In other words, the reason you might not see that many kids on Georgia is because drivers are insane and people don't feel safe walking on it. I am very much in support of this plan. If drivers want to try to hold DC residents hostage by saying that they will drive dangerously in residential streets as well then let's add in speed bumps on the side roads as well.

There are several schools (John Lewis, Truesdell come to mine) that have boundaries that cross Georgia Ave by the way. The four year old who was killed was a Truesdell student.

Speedbumps are dumb. Cars just go through stop signs to make up for lost time. I'd rather have drivers stop at intersections than randomly slow down in the middle of the block.

I've got news for you: if you are regularly running stop signs to make up for the time you lost at speed bumps, you are both in the minority and a dangerous driver.

I just live in the real world. People respond to traffic calming proposals in ways that aren't obvious or desirable that sometimes make traffic calming proposals a net negative for safety.

Traffic calming advocates assume they can make drivers' commutes substantially longer and drivers will just take it. The problem is: They won't! They are jealous of their time and they will do all kinds of things, many you would never think of, to make sure their commutes do not get longer, regardless of whatever crazy idea DDOT proposes.

Yes, dangerous scofflaw drivers will do dangerous illegal things, and that is what enforcement is for.

Rational drivers will do things like ask themselves, "Hey, maybe my commute would be better if I took the bus! I will try that."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The argument that if we don't all agree Georgia Avenue should be a speedway to shuttle individual drivers in individual cars from their homes in MD to their offices downtown, then those drivers will go on murderous rampage of children on Petworth residential streets, is insane.

I'm sorry traffic is bad. All evidence ponts to the idea that the only way to address the issue on a long-term basis is to move people to more efficient modes of transportation. That includes buses. If you'd rather plow through crowds of school children in a residential neighborhood going 50 in 15 than take the bus, then I suggest it's time to rethink your values system.

I've taken the bus to work for years. It's fine. It's not as luxurious as driving my own car and parking in the building but it costs a tiny fraction of that option so whatever.

It's better to have car traffic where people expect it. That way, no one is surprised and there are fewer accidents. Everyone knows Georgia Avenue is a major road and responds accordingly. When you put lots of traffic in places where people don't expect it (like side streets), that's when bad things happen.