“Colleges That Change Lives”

[Anonymous]

I cannot believe I am reading a post from an in-state Virginia resident saying that that would rather have their kids go to a CTLC school instead of W&M. What a mistake.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe I am reading a post from an in-state Virginia resident saying that that would rather have their kids go to a CTLC school instead of W&M. What a mistake.

Don’t believe everything you read.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Looking forward to you not supporting that study abroad proclamation.

Many small schools go out of their way to tout studying abroad on their websites because they know that applicants worry (with good reason) about the claustrophobia of having to spend four years in a small environment in the middle of nowhere. It's kind of ironic -- I mean, if the education and social experience provided by these schools is so awesome and special, then why do you need to get away? -- but it makes sense.

Perhaps you lack a good reference point, but many students are quite thoughtful when making such decisions. Pretty sure most (yes, even those from loser CTCL schools) aren’t going abroad simply because they are claustrophobic and disappointed in what they had hoped would be an awesome and special education.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2018/11/13/study-abroad-numbers-continue-grow-driven-continued-growth-short-term-programs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe I am reading a post from an in-state Virginia resident saying that that would rather have their kids go to a CTLC school instead of W&M. What a mistake.

Seriously, Kalamazoo at 60K over W&M at $40? Even with a $36K scholarship, the difference in prestige is enormous. UVA is $31K - $32K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe I am reading a post from an in-state Virginia resident saying that that would rather have their kids go to a CTLC school instead of W&M. What a mistake.

Seriously, Kalamazoo at 60K over W&M at $40? Even with a $36K scholarship, the difference in prestige is enormous. UVA is $31K - $32K.

Seriously, it may be hard to believe, but not everyone cares about prestige. And I'd say it's debatable anyway about how much "prestige" UVA has outside of the DMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Oops,-We've visited a lot of colleges and I get the details mixed up. Kalamazoo's study abroad is 10-20k less than full cost of attendance and includes all travel expenses. I just remembered it was a good deal compared to other schools we were looking at. (Especially since Kalamazoo is already generous with merit aid--DD is likely eligible for 32k scholarship which would make total cost of attendance on campus 28k--cheaper than our in-state options). Also, for DD who wants to major bio/chem it was one of the few places she's visited where STEM majors regularly go on 1-2 semester study abroad and still graduate on time. But maybe these advantages are more common that I realize? She also considered Wooster on the CTCL list, but they didn't have the same level of study abroad support and was in a small town so for her it was less appealing. She's also applying to W&M in state, which is a match for her scores/GPA--but will likely end up costing more than these CTCL schools. She has a few other dream reach SLACs but even if she gets in, she knows if she doesn't get sufficient aid she won't be able to attend. She's not interested in public schools outside of W&M (though she has agreed to apply to 1 as an academic/financial safety in case expected merit aid doesn't come through at SLACs). So these schools play a meaningful role in her college search.

That is one of the main reasons that I attended Kalamazoo 20 years ago. As a chemistry major who was interested in study abroad (and ended up double majoring in Spanish as well), it was one of the few places I looked where it was expected/routine/straightforward for science majors to take the time to study abroad and not end up messing up required class sequences. At the time, they also had the year-round calendar with built-in quarters off for internships and senior projects, and the combination of all of those things was very attractive. The senior project I did at an external institution is what introduced me to the field of science I now work in, and the research I did at K helped me get into a prestigious graduate school, where I earned my Ph. D. (although I joined the Peace Corps straight out of K and then went to graduate school after completing that commitment). Glad to hear that Kalamazoo is still attractive to many, as it definitely changed my life.

[Anonymous]

Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

Right, UVA where there are 16,000 undergraduates, the professors don’t know their students, small group tutorials taught by grad students and incredibly competitive atmosphere. I’ve got two there now. Their brother who went to a CTCL school got a much more personalized education, which is what was best for him. The 2 at Uva are happy but sometimes wonder if they would have been better off at a much smaller college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

Right, UVA where there are 16,000 undergraduates, the professors don’t know their students, small group tutorials taught by grad students and incredibly competitive atmosphere. I’ve got two there now. Their brother who went to a CTCL school got a much more personalized education, which is what was best for him. The 2 at Uva are happy but sometimes wonder if they would have been better off at a much smaller college.

Well, considering that your two at UVA attending a school where almost 90% of the students graduate in four years - much higher than any CTCL - I’d say it’s pretty obvious that the typical student is happier there than a CTCL school. Your kids are outliers.

[Anonymous]

Another correlation/causation error.

So, graduating in 4 years is a measure of happiness?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

Right, UVA where there are 16,000 undergraduates, the professors don’t know their students, small group tutorials taught by grad students and incredibly competitive atmosphere. I’ve got two there now. Their brother who went to a CTCL school got a much more personalized education, which is what was best for him. The 2 at Uva are happy but sometimes wonder if they would have been better off at a much smaller college.

Well, considering that your two at UVA attending a school where almost 90% of the students graduate in four years - much higher than any CTCL - I’d say it’s pretty obvious that the typical student is happier there than a CTCL school. Your kids are outliers.

PP you crack me up. You must be on this thread 24-7 to make sure you can come up with any retort possible to counter those of us who have had children attend a CTCL school. God forbid anyone say anything positive about CTCL. My 2 at UVA are supposed to be happy bc they and their peers have a 90% chance of grasping 4 years? My DC who attended the CTCL must be ecstatic since he graduated in 3.5 years! (Oh wait, now you’ll say he did that bc he was so miserable that he needed to get out ASAP!)

[Anonymous]

Graduating, not grasping

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

Good for them. I wanted a smaller campus with more personal interaction with professors, which is what I got at K. Ad I went to K before the first edition of CTCL was published, so it wasn’t CTCL marketing that attracted me. I had a chance at a full scholarship to Michigan, where many of my family members had attended and were happy. Instead, I took a generous scholarship to K, which was a better fit for me. I honestly would not be in my current field of work if not for my time at K. Could I have been happy and ended up fine at Michigan? Most likely, but that doesn’t mean K wasn’t the right choice for me. Or don’t you believe in the fit/feel of different colleges?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another correlation/causation error.

So, graduating in 4 years is a measure of happiness?

Ok now you’re being ridiculous and you know it. Arguing that it’s better to go to a school with a low graduation rate is just plain contrarian and silly

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting, PP, but someone close to me did almost exactly what you just described with a science degree - from UVA.

Right, UVA where there are 16,000 undergraduates, the professors don’t know their students, small group tutorials taught by grad students and incredibly competitive atmosphere. I’ve got two there now. Their brother who went to a CTCL school got a much more personalized education, which is what was best for him. The 2 at Uva are happy but sometimes wonder if they would have been better off at a much smaller college.

Well, considering that your two at UVA attending a school where almost 90% of the students graduate in four years - much higher than any CTCL - I’d say it’s pretty obvious that the typical student is happier there than a CTCL school. Your kids are outliers.

PP you crack me up. You must be on this thread 24-7 to make sure you can come up with any retort possible to counter those of us who have had children attend a CTCL school. God forbid anyone say anything positive about CTCL. My 2 at UVA are supposed to be happy bc they and their peers have a 90% chance of grasping 4 years? My DC who attended the CTCL must be ecstatic since he graduated in 3.5 years! (Oh wait, now you’ll say he did that bc he was so miserable that he needed to get out ASAP!)

It’s not that. I just laugh at parents who compare their kids’ schools like this. How do you know which kid is getting a better education? It’s not like you’re going to class with them. And if your UVA kids are saying they wish they went CTCL, isn’t it likely that they’re just being nice to their sibling who couldn’t get into UVA?