Older TJ kids: is there regret w/college app results

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"My kid took algebra 2 in 9th and it was pretty clear that a lot (not all, but a lot) of the kids taking pre-calc or calculus in 9th grade were qualitatively better at math and it was a long hard struggle to catch up with the calculus kids because they're not standing still. "

meh. My kid (sr now at TJ) also took Alg 2 in 9th and while yes there are some crazy genious kids at TJ there is also a big swath that simply was able to do Alg 1 in 6th at their ES whereas at the vast majority of ESs across the county that's not an option. DC would have done fine with Alg 1 in 6th but it wasn't a route really even at our AAP center. She didn't struggle to keep up with those kids.

How did she do on the math team?

? She had zero interest in the math team. She does do other ECs at TJ.

Then she's not keeping up with those kids.

Cuz yep all kids’ goals are the same for their ECs and having had the route to take Alg 1 in 6th when virtually all other schools do not offer this permanent makes every one of those kids geniuses.

Can you clarify your post? This is word salad.
We are only talking about math.
My point is that a lot of kids that were accelerated in math were better at math. They weren't born that way but the early acceleration made them that way and it took a lot to catch up to them.
The reason I bring up math team is because at TJ the top math students are not measured by standardized tests like the SATs, everyone is getting 800 on that. They are measured by their performance on the competitive math exams. If you don't really care about that then that's fine but that is where the math comeptition is at TJ.

My point is that my Alg 2 in 9th kid has not had a hard time “keeping up” in her classes at TJ and with her overall GPA. She took Calc BC in 11 like most and has a pretty strong although not top 10% GPA.

She had zero interest in the math club. Only some kids do. Not joining the math club does not mean kids who are on “normal advanced” track of Alg 2 in 9th are “behind in math” at TJ. That was the earlier claim.

Also - part of why many kids who did Algebra 2 in 8th are on that track is not because they are so much smarter than kids doing Algebra 2 in 9th but rather that Algebra 2 in 8th is only available in limited spots. Most kids have no access to it.

Finally I will agree that if your kid did math club at TJ then yeah sure they probably were among the very top kids in math. But kids do not need to be in that small group to still do well and “keep up” with math at TJ broadly speaking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

TJ Sophomore parent here and my kid is doing well grade wise but we are white knuckling it a bit academically. I feel like he is being challenged in a way that he would not be at his base school and intellectually, I know that he will be better off in the long run with a better more rigorous education but I went to an ivy+ school where I met my spouse and it is a sizable part of our identity. We wanted something like that for him. I see really smart seniors getting rejected from schools that make my jaw drop. Did they submit a limerick for their essay or something?

UVA is really starting to look like a fantastic landing spot but they don't like TJ kids for some reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"My kid took algebra 2 in 9th and it was pretty clear that a lot (not all, but a lot) of the kids taking pre-calc or calculus in 9th grade were qualitatively better at math and it was a long hard struggle to catch up with the calculus kids because they're not standing still. "

meh. My kid (sr now at TJ) also took Alg 2 in 9th and while yes there are some crazy genious kids at TJ there is also a big swath that simply was able to do Alg 1 in 6th at their ES whereas at the vast majority of ESs across the county that's not an option. DC would have done fine with Alg 1 in 6th but it wasn't a route really even at our AAP center. She didn't struggle to keep up with those kids.

How did she do on the math team?

? She had zero interest in the math team. She does do other ECs at TJ.

Then she's not keeping up with those kids.

Cuz yep all kids’ goals are the same for their ECs and having had the route to take Alg 1 in 6th when virtually all other schools do not offer this permanent makes every one of those kids geniuses.

Can you clarify your post? This is word salad.
We are only talking about math.
My point is that a lot of kids that were accelerated in math were better at math. They weren't born that way but the early acceleration made them that way and it took a lot to catch up to them.
The reason I bring up math team is because at TJ the top math students are not measured by standardized tests like the SATs, everyone is getting 800 on that. They are measured by their performance on the competitive math exams. If you don't really care about that then that's fine but that is where the math comeptition is at TJ.

My point is that my Alg 2 in 9th kid has not had a hard time “keeping up” in her classes at TJ and with her overall GPA. She took Calc BC in 11 like most and has a pretty strong although not top 10% GPA.

She had zero interest in the math club. Only some kids do. Not joining the math club does not mean kids who are on “normal advanced” track of Alg 2 in 9th are “behind in math” at TJ. That was the earlier claim.

Also - part of why many kids who did Algebra 2 in 8th are on that track is not because they are so much smarter than kids doing Algebra 2 in 9th but rather that Algebra 2 in 8th is only available in limited spots. Most kids have no access to it.

Finally I will agree that if your kid did math club at TJ then yeah sure they probably were among the very top kids in math. But kids do not need to be in that small group to still do well and “keep up” with math at TJ broadly speaking.

I'm not saying she can't keep up with her classes or that these other kids are smarter than her.
I don't think my kid can't keep up or that other kids are smarter than him.
I'm saying that these kids are smart and the head start they get is hard to overcome. These kids are progressing swiftly and in o0rder to come up form behind he had to do a lot of extra work.

TJ has a lot of kids on USAMO and one kid on the US national math olympiad team.

I think this conversation is drifting. My initial statement was that there are some kids at TJ that you can't catch up to if you start too far behind. And they are the ones you are compared to in college admissions.

The real competition for the spots at MIT isn't the SAT. Everybody gets a perfect math SAT. EVERYBODY. It's your performance at the math competitions that set you apart from the other 100+ kids that get a perfect math score at TJ. Oh, you're not competing on the math team competitions? Then you're not a likely candidate for some of these majors at some of these schools (they might be ok with some other stem olympiad achievement but math is the one they want)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"My kid took algebra 2 in 9th and it was pretty clear that a lot (not all, but a lot) of the kids taking pre-calc or calculus in 9th grade were qualitatively better at math and it was a long hard struggle to catch up with the calculus kids because they're not standing still. "

meh. My kid (sr now at TJ) also took Alg 2 in 9th and while yes there are some crazy genious kids at TJ there is also a big swath that simply was able to do Alg 1 in 6th at their ES whereas at the vast majority of ESs across the county that's not an option. DC would have done fine with Alg 1 in 6th but it wasn't a route really even at our AAP center. She didn't struggle to keep up with those kids.

How did she do on the math team?

? She had zero interest in the math team. She does do other ECs at TJ.

Then she's not keeping up with those kids.

Cuz yep all kids’ goals are the same for their ECs and having had the route to take Alg 1 in 6th when virtually all other schools do not offer this permanent makes every one of those kids geniuses.

Can you clarify your post? This is word salad.
We are only talking about math.
My point is that a lot of kids that were accelerated in math were better at math. They weren't born that way but the early acceleration made them that way and it took a lot to catch up to them.
The reason I bring up math team is because at TJ the top math students are not measured by standardized tests like the SATs, everyone is getting 800 on that. They are measured by their performance on the competitive math exams. If you don't really care about that then that's fine but that is where the math comeptition is at TJ.

My point is that my Alg 2 in 9th kid has not had a hard time “keeping up” in her classes at TJ and with her overall GPA. She took Calc BC in 11 like most and has a pretty strong although not top 10% GPA.

She had zero interest in the math club. Only some kids do. Not joining the math club does not mean kids who are on “normal advanced” track of Alg 2 in 9th are “behind in math” at TJ. That was the earlier claim.

Also - part of why many kids who did Algebra 2 in 8th are on that track is not because they are so much smarter than kids doing Algebra 2 in 9th but rather that Algebra 2 in 8th is only available in limited spots. Most kids have no access to it.

Finally I will agree that if your kid did math club at TJ then yeah sure they probably were among the very top kids in math. But kids do not need to be in that small group to still do well and “keep up” with math at TJ broadly speaking.

I'm not saying she can't keep up with her classes or that these other kids are smarter than her.
I don't think my kid can't keep up or that other kids are smarter than him.
I'm saying that these kids are smart and the head start they get is hard to overcome. These kids are progressing swiftly and in o0rder to come up form behind he had to do a lot of extra work.

TJ has a lot of kids on USAMO and one kid on the US national math olympiad team.

I think this conversation is drifting. My initial statement was that there are some kids at TJ that you can't catch up to if you start too far behind. And they are the ones you are compared to in college admissions.

The real competition for the spots at MIT isn't the SAT. Everybody gets a perfect math SAT. EVERYBODY. It's your performance at the math competitions that set you apart from the other 100+ kids that get a perfect math score at TJ. Oh, you're not competing on the math team competitions? Then you're not a likely candidate for some of these majors at some of these schools (they might be ok with some other stem olympiad achievement but math is the one they want)

Who said they are gunning for MIT? When UVA becomes unattainable, there should be a concern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

This is not true. The top colleges can not take many students from TJ so there are only a handful of spots available while the vast majority of TJ students are stronger than who are accepted from other high schools. The colleges are also still looking for diversity even if outlawed. That doesn't help either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

This is not true. The top colleges can not take many students from TJ so there are only a handful of spots available while the vast majority of TJ students are stronger than who are accepted from other high schools. The colleges are also still looking for diversity even if outlawed. That doesn't help either.

This applies absolutely everywhere and a pursuit of diversity is legal (which is why rural, fly over states, first gen, low income, etc are pursued). Kids rightfully should be compared against kids at their own schools. Your post makes it seem like middling TJ kids would blow top base kids out of the water.

A. Untrue
B. Not relevant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No matter what the TJ admissions process happens to be, no matter how "rigorous", half of the students will be in the bottom half. Same is true for Stuy and always has been. It is just math.

And for all of these magnets, the top 20-30% always will have better college admissions than the bottom 50%.

And for virtually all if these magnets, many in the bottom 50% would have better college admissions from their base HS (even if they might get a better education at their magnet).

Life is about choices and tradeoffs. TJ is a big choice.

The bottom half of the graduating class pre-2024 has different results than the most recent graduating class.

Like?

Look at the class of 2024 instagram vs the class of 2025 instagram

Why would there be such a big difference in one year and what are you saying is the cause of the difference year over year?

don't get sucked in by this person. It's just someone who probably doesn't even have kids at TJ presently that's still pissed off about the TJ admission process changes made 5 years ago. Time to get over it but some remain obsessed with it.

NP: so there aren’t changes in college results from that year to the next - I think they said ‘24 compared to ‘25? I am confused if there were changes or if it is more someone is making stuff up.

The differences are pretty significant.
Class of 2024 was the last graduating class that was admitted under the old system that used GPA, a standardized test, teacher recommendations and essays
https://www.instagram.com/tj2024destinations
Class of 2025 destinations was the first class that used the new system which allocated spots to very middle school and selected kids based on their GPA and essays. Eliminating standardized tests, teacher recommendations and a application fee.
https://www.instagram.com/tj2025destinations

Eliminating the application fee was the only good thing about the reform.

They were able to eliminate the application fee because they eliminated the battery of standardized exams.

I agree with you that no fee is a positive - and should never be compromised - but remain clear-eyed about the correlation between the two.

There is no necessary no connection between the two. None. You can eliminate the fee without eliminating the test. Total revenues from the TJ application fee was something like $250,000.

I'm gonna guess that you have no idea how expensive standardized exams are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

Whoever this person is gets it. Colleges admit students based on how that student is going to inspire donations or potentially donate themselves, and a lot of traditional TJ students set a narrative with their high school experience that all they're going to do in college is show up, get good grades, leave, get a decent job working for someone else, and never give back. There's no added value for the school in admitting that student if the school already has an exceptional academic reputation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

TJ Sophomore parent here and my kid is doing well grade wise but we are white knuckling it a bit academically. I feel like he is being challenged in a way that he would not be at his base school and intellectually, I know that he will be better off in the long run with a better more rigorous education but I went to an ivy+ school where I met my spouse and it is a sizable part of our identity. We wanted something like that for him. I see really smart seniors getting rejected from schools that make my jaw drop. Did they submit a limerick for their essay or something?

UVA is really starting to look like a fantastic landing spot but they don't like TJ kids for some reason.

This is false. They don't like boring TJ kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

TJ Sophomore parent here and my kid is doing well grade wise but we are white knuckling it a bit academically. I feel like he is being challenged in a way that he would not be at his base school and intellectually, I know that he will be better off in the long run with a better more rigorous education but I went to an ivy+ school where I met my spouse and it is a sizable part of our identity. We wanted something like that for him. I see really smart seniors getting rejected from schools that make my jaw drop. Did they submit a limerick for their essay or something?

UVA is really starting to look like a fantastic landing spot but they don't like TJ kids for some reason.

This is false. They don't like boring TJ kids.

🙄
Most TJ kids have a lot going on with ECs. UVA is fine with TJ but what they do not do anymore that they used to do is take a really large swath of TJ kids in recognition that being top half of the TJ class took probably as much work as top 10% at many base schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

TJ Sophomore parent here and my kid is doing well grade wise but we are white knuckling it a bit academically. I feel like he is being challenged in a way that he would not be at his base school and intellectually, I know that he will be better off in the long run with a better more rigorous education but I went to an ivy+ school where I met my spouse and it is a sizable part of our identity. We wanted something like that for him. I see really smart seniors getting rejected from schools that make my jaw drop. Did they submit a limerick for their essay or something?

UVA is really starting to look like a fantastic landing spot but they don't like TJ kids for some reason.

This is false. They don't like boring TJ kids.

🙄
Most TJ kids have a lot going on with ECs. UVA is fine with TJ but what they do not do anymore that they used to do is take a really large swath of TJ kids in recognition that being top half of the TJ class took probably as much work as top 10% at many base schools.

They have to b/c ECs are built into the TJ day, from day one.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Most TJ kids have a lot going on with ECs. UVA is fine with TJ but what they do not do anymore that they used to do is take a really large swath of TJ kids in recognition that being top half of the TJ class took probably as much work as top 10% at many base schools.

They have to b/c ECs are built into the TJ day, from day one.

A student could easily spend 8th period studying, or bouncing from club to club. The PP meant, I believe, that TJ kids tend to have meaningful ECs, such as leadership, awards, etc., none of which is guaranteed by the 8th period schedule.

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Anonymous wrote:"My kid took algebra 2 in 9th and it was pretty clear that a lot (not all, but a lot) of the kids taking pre-calc or calculus in 9th grade were qualitatively better at math and it was a long hard struggle to catch up with the calculus kids because they're not standing still. "

meh. My kid (sr now at TJ) also took Alg 2 in 9th and while yes there are some crazy genious kids at TJ there is also a big swath that simply was able to do Alg 1 in 6th at their ES whereas at the vast majority of ESs across the county that's not an option. DC would have done fine with Alg 1 in 6th but it wasn't a route really even at our AAP center. She didn't struggle to keep up with those kids.

How did she do on the math team?

? She had zero interest in the math team. She does do other ECs at TJ.

Then she's not keeping up with those kids.

Cuz yep all kids’ goals are the same for their ECs and having had the route to take Alg 1 in 6th when virtually all other schools do not offer this permanent makes every one of those kids geniuses.

Can you clarify your post? This is word salad.
We are only talking about math.
My point is that a lot of kids that were accelerated in math were better at math. They weren't born that way but the early acceleration made them that way and it took a lot to catch up to them.
The reason I bring up math team is because at TJ the top math students are not measured by standardized tests like the SATs, everyone is getting 800 on that. They are measured by their performance on the competitive math exams. If you don't really care about that then that's fine but that is where the math comeptition is at TJ.

My point is that my Alg 2 in 9th kid has not had a hard time “keeping up” in her classes at TJ and with her overall GPA. She took Calc BC in 11 like most and has a pretty strong although not top 10% GPA.

She had zero interest in the math club. Only some kids do. Not joining the math club does not mean kids who are on “normal advanced” track of Alg 2 in 9th are “behind in math” at TJ. That was the earlier claim.

Also - part of why many kids who did Algebra 2 in 8th are on that track is not because they are so much smarter than kids doing Algebra 2 in 9th but rather that Algebra 2 in 8th is only available in limited spots. Most kids have no access to it.

Finally I will agree that if your kid did math club at TJ then yeah sure they probably were among the very top kids in math. But kids do not need to be in that small group to still do well and “keep up” with math at TJ broadly speaking.

I'm not saying she can't keep up with her classes or that these other kids are smarter than her.
I don't think my kid can't keep up or that other kids are smarter than him.
I'm saying that these kids are smart and the head start they get is hard to overcome. These kids are progressing swiftly and in o0rder to come up form behind he had to do a lot of extra work.

TJ has a lot of kids on USAMO and one kid on the US national math olympiad team.

I think this conversation is drifting. My initial statement was that there are some kids at TJ that you can't catch up to if you start too far behind. And they are the ones you are compared to in college admissions.

The real competition for the spots at MIT isn't the SAT. Everybody gets a perfect math SAT. EVERYBODY. It's your performance at the math competitions that set you apart from the other 100+ kids that get a perfect math score at TJ. Oh, you're not competing on the math team competitions? Then you're not a likely candidate for some of these majors at some of these schools (they might be ok with some other stem olympiad achievement but math is the one they want)

Who said they are gunning for MIT? When UVA becomes unattainable, there should be a concern.

If you're trying to go to UVA, then wtf are you even doing at TJ?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Have a 12th grader at TJ and definitely thinking about the original question--any regrets based on college results?

UVA is an outlier--it will be harder to get into UVA from TJ than base school.

But outside of that, there are definite pluses and minuses. The folks that got into Michigan last year, etc say that they are very well prepared. Same for other schools. Only folks at Cal Tech and MIT have said that college is harder than high school.

In terms of college results (and you can't go by the IG shares right now bc there are many TJ seniors with REA or SCEA acceptances that aren't sharing...people sharing now are ED admits bc they are committed) it's a bit nuanced. I think for the top students--there's an advantage bc colleges WILL look at the TJ students and likely admit some. In other words, some TJ students will be discussed in committee. For the "bottom" students, they are all going to really respectable schools--they have all finished calc in 11th grade, maybe 12th grade. So the "floor" for the lowest GPAs are all solid schools, with names you've heard of. This is perhaps one of the differences compared to our base school. In naviance, there are some schools that accept 100% of TJ applicants (Clemson).

For the top 25% etc, it looks like folks are getting good results (not UVA, as mentioned above). We feel more confident that our student is more likely to get a T10-20 acceptance, and more resigned to the fact that they might not get a UVA acceptance. But class rank isn't factored in as much as it was 20 yrs ago. And the experiences (engineering lab, for example, or ECs) have made for great essay topics.

There are some TJ students, who get perfect SATs and stratospheric grades, but who don't get prestigious acceptances, and that feeds a narrative of "well, then who can get in?". But they are also folks who didn't really have much impact on the school--they just studied. On the flip side, there are many more who have the high scores (GPA/SAT), the national science competition awards, and are also leading several clubs and making a huge impact on the school's community and the local community. Those folks go to Yale.

So far, we've been very happy with the TJ experience for our student. And we're good, so far, with the college options. TJ is not for everyone--and that's key. But I don't know that I would be worried about a negative college impact unless increasing chances at UVA is the goal.

This is not true. The top colleges can not take many students from TJ so there are only a handful of spots available while the vast majority of TJ students are stronger than who are accepted from other high schools. The colleges are also still looking for diversity even if outlawed. That doesn't help either.

This applies absolutely everywhere and a pursuit of diversity is legal (which is why rural, fly over states, first gen, low income, etc are pursued). Kids rightfully should be compared against kids at their own schools. Your post makes it seem like middling TJ kids would blow top base kids out of the water.

A. Untrue
B. Not relevant

The middling TJ kid will be at or near the top of their base school.

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Anonymous wrote:No matter what the TJ admissions process happens to be, no matter how "rigorous", half of the students will be in the bottom half. Same is true for Stuy and always has been. It is just math.

And for all of these magnets, the top 20-30% always will have better college admissions than the bottom 50%.

And for virtually all if these magnets, many in the bottom 50% would have better college admissions from their base HS (even if they might get a better education at their magnet).

Life is about choices and tradeoffs. TJ is a big choice.

The bottom half of the graduating class pre-2024 has different results than the most recent graduating class.

Like?

Look at the class of 2024 instagram vs the class of 2025 instagram

Why would there be such a big difference in one year and what are you saying is the cause of the difference year over year?

don't get sucked in by this person. It's just someone who probably doesn't even have kids at TJ presently that's still pissed off about the TJ admission process changes made 5 years ago. Time to get over it but some remain obsessed with it.

NP: so there aren’t changes in college results from that year to the next - I think they said ‘24 compared to ‘25? I am confused if there were changes or if it is more someone is making stuff up.

The differences are pretty significant.
Class of 2024 was the last graduating class that was admitted under the old system that used GPA, a standardized test, teacher recommendations and essays
https://www.instagram.com/tj2024destinations
Class of 2025 destinations was the first class that used the new system which allocated spots to very middle school and selected kids based on their GPA and essays. Eliminating standardized tests, teacher recommendations and a application fee.
https://www.instagram.com/tj2025destinations

Eliminating the application fee was the only good thing about the reform.

They were able to eliminate the application fee because they eliminated the battery of standardized exams.

I agree with you that no fee is a positive - and should never be compromised - but remain clear-eyed about the correlation between the two.

There is no necessary no connection between the two. None. You can eliminate the fee without eliminating the test. Total revenues from the TJ application fee was something like $250,000.

I'm gonna guess that you have no idea how expensive standardized exams are.

It doesn't matter. The claim is that they were only able to eliminate the $100 fee because they were able to save on testing costs. The total collected with that $100 fee was $250,000. The fee was not a budgetary necessity.