My hot take - if you own an AR-15 you have a few loose screws

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

No one fires an AR-15 just once.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

+!00000
Exactly my family too. Generations of gun owners. All stand one hundred percent with what you wrote.

Thank you.

To the Republicans on this board still supporting the guy who last night mangled the names of 19 children who have just recently been killed FU. He literally danced and people clapped. You are sub human if you still stand with this utter garbage. Ex Republican never again and I will fight like hell against any Republicans that are left. The party of insurrectionists , criminals, lairs and child abusers and killers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

It is extremely American to behave as if this is a unique, complicated problem with no easy answers, so oh no! it can't be solved.

Almost every developed country in the world has strict gun laws in place that SOMEHOW limit the acquisition of deadly weapons. We don't have to reinvent the wheel here. The problem is not figuring out how to describe weaponry accurately. The problem is structural, not specific to this issue. Pretending that this is about getting the vocabulary of ballistics right is a form of distraction.

It’s also a form of control. These gun guys are all about power and it makes them feel special. So rather than address the obvious issues (guns and toxic masculinity) they look for more ways to feel good about themselves. Pathetic.

It is strange to me what a bubble some of you people live in. You continue to spout these broad characterizations about gun owners that are completely unfounded. Are you really that obtuse to think that only a particular subset of white males enjoy firearms. Go to a range or take a class someday. More than half of the people in my CCW course were women and it was about as diverse as a UN meeting. I've been to a number of ranges in the DMV area and met all kinds of people of all ethnicities...surgeons, dentists, public school teachers, Hill staffers (both D and R), etc. Grow the f*&% up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

It is extremely American to behave as if this is a unique, complicated problem with no easy answers, so oh no! it can't be solved.

Almost every developed country in the world has strict gun laws in place that SOMEHOW limit the acquisition of deadly weapons. We don't have to reinvent the wheel here. The problem is not figuring out how to describe weaponry accurately. The problem is structural, not specific to this issue. Pretending that this is about getting the vocabulary of ballistics right is a form of distraction.

It’s also a form of control. These gun guys are all about power and it makes them feel special. So rather than address the obvious issues (guns and toxic masculinity) they look for more ways to feel good about themselves. Pathetic.

It is strange to me what a bubble some of you people live in. You continue to spout these broad characterizations about gun owners that are completely unfounded. Are you really that obtuse to think that only a particular subset of white males enjoy firearms. Go to a range or take a class someday. More than half of the people in my CCW course were women and it was about as diverse as a UN meeting. I've been to a number of ranges in the DMV area and met all kinds of people of all ethnicities...surgeons, dentists, public school teachers, Hill staffers (both D and R), etc. Grow the f*&% up.

Look out, this guy has a black friend with a CCW permit.

Shut this thread down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

It is extremely American to behave as if this is a unique, complicated problem with no easy answers, so oh no! it can't be solved.

Almost every developed country in the world has strict gun laws in place that SOMEHOW limit the acquisition of deadly weapons. We don't have to reinvent the wheel here. The problem is not figuring out how to describe weaponry accurately. The problem is structural, not specific to this issue. Pretending that this is about getting the vocabulary of ballistics right is a form of distraction.

It’s also a form of control. These gun guys are all about power and it makes them feel special. So rather than address the obvious issues (guns and toxic masculinity) they look for more ways to feel good about themselves. Pathetic.

It is strange to me what a bubble some of you people live in. You continue to spout these broad characterizations about gun owners that are completely unfounded. Are you really that obtuse to think that only a particular subset of white males enjoy firearms. Go to a range or take a class someday. More than half of the people in my CCW course were women and it was about as diverse as a UN meeting. I've been to a number of ranges in the DMV area and met all kinds of people of all ethnicities...surgeons, dentists, public school teachers, Hill staffers (both D and R), etc. Grow the f*&% up.

I've taken many classes and gone to ranges many times.

Yes, there is diversity.

And like the general population, 90+% of people in the classes and at the range support gun control laws. No semi-automatic rifles, background checks, age limits, waiting periods, etc.

It's the 5-10% who want to be able to buy anything they want at any time they want that are the problem. And yes, I've known many of these people. They are almost all whacko white men, with the occasional whacko white woman. All are in complete denial and refuse to look at facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

+!00000
Exactly my family too. Generations of gun owners. All stand one hundred percent with what you wrote.

Thank you.

To the Republicans on this board still supporting the guy who last night mangled the names of 19 children who have just recently been killed FU. He literally danced and people clapped. You are sub human if you still stand with this utter garbage. Ex Republican never again and I will fight like hell against any Republicans that are left. The party of insurrectionists , criminals, lairs and child abusers and killers.

Your statement would go further if you wouldn’t make wild claims about generalizations. Could do the same thing for those of us who are democrats. It only shows you are unintelligent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As long as the law allows it, it's not for me to judge. No, I don't own one, I don't ever will.

I’m sure many people said the same about slavery 170
Years ago. I wouldn’t own one but it’s not for me to judge? Of course it is for us to judge, if you e are responsible citizens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

It is extremely American to behave as if this is a unique, complicated problem with no easy answers, so oh no! it can't be solved.

Almost every developed country in the world has strict gun laws in place that SOMEHOW limit the acquisition of deadly weapons. We don't have to reinvent the wheel here. The problem is not figuring out how to describe weaponry accurately. The problem is structural, not specific to this issue. Pretending that this is about getting the vocabulary of ballistics right is a form of distraction.

It’s also a form of control. These gun guys are all about power and it makes them feel special. So rather than address the obvious issues (guns and toxic masculinity) they look for more ways to feel good about themselves. Pathetic.

It is strange to me what a bubble some of you people live in. You continue to spout these broad characterizations about gun owners that are completely unfounded. Are you really that obtuse to think that only a particular subset of white males enjoy firearms. Go to a range or take a class someday. More than half of the people in my CCW course were women and it was about as diverse as a UN meeting. I've been to a number of ranges in the DMV area and met all kinds of people of all ethnicities...surgeons, dentists, public school teachers, Hill staffers (both D and R), etc. Grow the f*&% up.

Well, I can’t tell you how *not* surprised I am that you missed the fact that I was talking about the people who want to debate about the precision of word definitions in the gun control arguments.

But since you brought it up, surgeons, dentists, teachers, and hill staffers, are not immune from having psychopaths in their fields. I get that some fearful people want to carry a gun for protection. It’s more likely to make them a victim, but they are misled and desperate to feel safe- most likely from a MAN with unhealthy ideas about what it means to be a man, exacerbated by an unhealthy father and society, mental illness, and testosterone. Toxic.

You can grow the f up yourself. Guns outside of LE and the military are toys for uncivilized and immature people with fantasies of heroism or toughness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

+!00000
Exactly my family too. Generations of gun owners. All stand one hundred percent with what you wrote.

Thank you.

To the Republicans on this board still supporting the guy who last night mangled the names of 19 children who have just recently been killed FU. He literally danced and people clapped. You are sub human if you still stand with this utter garbage. Ex Republican never again and I will fight like hell against any Republicans that are left. The party of insurrectionists , criminals, lairs and child abusers and killers.

Your statement would go further if you wouldn’t make wild claims about generalizations. Could do the same thing for those of us who are democrats. It only shows you are unintelligent.

Nothing I wrote wasn’t true try again

He danced that POS danced after he read those names. 19 Names!!! Children died while grown men stood by doing nothing. Then they head to a gun celebration what is wrong with you!

Democratics are right MAGA Trump whatever you want to call those criminal traitors Putin supporters no Republicans should be one any longer

What policies do they support? None except raising taxes and the National debt and taking your social security. They literally vote for no mental heath anything they have grifted and tried to hang Pence. The Republican Party is still trying to over throw the government of the US we have a rolling coup. They will install a dictator and guess what they will never let you own another gun again. You think dictators care about the constitution Hahahaha.

I’m not unhinged or wrong. The whole Republican Party should be disbanded. Biden won Trump the criminal lost over and over again.

[Anonymous]

OP no one cares about your dumb hot take or hot flash or whatever other weird syndrome you clearly suffer from.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

Great questions.

Hopefully PP will reply in good faith.

[Anonymous]

Only time will tell, but I think the upcoming elections are going to shatter the minds of many people on this thread.

[Anonymous]

I would believe that the gun owners and apologists in this thread are sad that a bunch of 10yo were murdered with a gun purchased legally if it seemed like they realized in any way that a principled stance here is to surrender or destroy the guns they own. You are in bad, scary company. Why do you want to be associated with this culture? Do you not understand that a cultural acceptance of casual firearms ownership is the main problem here?

If you and/or your partners continue to own these weapons, how do you morally justify it? If I owned something that was used to murder children, I would get rid of that thing on principle. Why don’t you feel morally obligated to take a stand? Do you just not care?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree or disagree? It's not a good gun for hunting - you'll disintegrate the trophy or meat. It's actually pretty terrible for home defense, as the the firearm is 4x more powerful than a 9mm handgun and will go through multiple walls and potentially hit your family.

So that really comes down to two reasons: (1) you intend to massacre a group of people as quickly and efficiently as possible or (2) because you LARP as an "operator" and somehow that gives you a sense of self-worth and confidence.

There's no reason to own this fire arm, unless you're a bit of a nutcase.

The. End.

Why would an AR-15 "disintegrate" the meat? I don't think you really understand how firearms work. I'm no fan of the AR-15, but many models fire the same cartridges as a hunting rifle.

There appears to be a ton of bad information, even completely mad up nonsense like disintegrating meat and “ban the sweet spot,” in this thread.

I don’t think we should wildly start banning things before we even understand the underlying facts (and this thread is full of bad facts).

Ok. Share your facts. Let’s discuss.

They don’t have facts. I know exactly the type. When you point out real facts, like that nearly all of the deadliest shootings used a semi-automatic rifle/AR-15, they talk about completely unrelated things like hunting and meat.

They claim you need an official, scientific study to prove guns are the problem, without having any basic understanding of the scientific method and how you can’t perform a controlled, double blind study on mass shootings. They just throw their hands up in the air and say “if only people raised their kids better!”

Whatever facts you present, they’ll point out something not even remotely related and think they won. I was talking with a pro-massacre relative the other day who said more people are killed by cars than guns. I pulled up actual statistics on how gun deaths have now surpassed car deaths and are climbing. They then said “we’ll more people are INJURED by cars, so ha! Cars are a bigger problem!” And they think that’s a legit argument. As if whiplash is just as bad as children being massacred.

You can’t win with these people. They’re dumb. I would rather they just be upfront and say “yes, we know people are murdered at extremely high rates and we’ve decided owning these weapons is worth that price”. Then we can recognize it’s a character and values problem, and deal with them appropriately.

What is you want exactly? For posters to just start dropping random facts on random topics? Firearms and ballistics are quite broad subjects. If you have a question about either, then throw it out and there and knowledgeable posters can respond to it. But the PP was right -- this chat is rife with incorrect statements about guns. What happened this week was an unspeakable tragedy. Maybe now is the time to have an informed public debate about reasonable steps that can be taken to prevent these things from continuing to happen. But it needs to be an "informed" debate.

What exactly are the incorrect statements?

I don’t need questions answered about guns. My close family is LEO. I’ve had guns in my home and I’ve done plenty of shooting. My family knows more about firearms and ballistics than anyone on this thread.

Every LEO I know (and I know a lot) who has worked shootings all agree that semi automatic rifles need to be banned and we need stricter laws around obtaining firearms. Period. Every other developed country in the world has figured this out.

We don’t need to nitpick over what things are called or how good they are for hunting. Those are irrelevant.

How much more information is needed to have an “informed” debate?

Great questions.

Hopefully PP will reply in good faith.

Not PP but will reply in part. At a bare minimum, a discussion should start with an accurate understanding of what laws and regulations are already in place, to what extent they are having any meaningful impact on gun-related offenses, and whether amending them will help prevent these tragedies going forward. Between this thread and recent others on DCUM, there are all kinds of inaccurate statements. Some are pounding the table insisting on certain requirements that already exist. To pick one issue, I think a lot more could be done strengthening "red flag" laws. But let's be honest, we aren't repealing the 2nd Amendment and I don't see a political path forward for any kind of broad ban on semi-automatic rifles. Those rifles are popular with too many citizens from coast to coast.