MC police pick up ESS 5 year old; harass & assault him

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The article isn't saying the entire situation. Why were the cops with the child for 50 minutes? Either child wouldn't calm down and get it together or they were waiting for the mother to arrive to get the child as it was a safety issue to leave the child there.

Or, more like what would happen with any 5 year old subjected to this, cops harangued kid into a state where he could not be calmed down. If you put cuffs on my kid, who is totally normal and has no behavioral problems, that is what I would expect to happen.

It wasn't just the cuffs, they reported told they kid that he deserved to get beaten and insinuated that he had a beating coming. The kid probably though the cops were going to beat him.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The kid didn’t wander off he intentionally chose to leave school because he wanted to leave. Schools aren’t jails so when kids want to intentionally leave some kids will. It is really hard for school staff to drop everything and get a kid back to school especially kids who are used to being in charge at home and are never disciplined. Instead of the mom being mad at her kid for leaving school she is suing. It could be the officers were talking amongst themselves saying if they had done that as kids they would have been beaten.

That might be true for older kids, but this kid is 5. He should be supervised at all times.

And even if he displayed poor judgment by leaving -- he is, after all, 5, and 5 year olds have poor judgment and limited impulse control -- that's still no excuse for the officers to yell and threaten him.

Nah, barring no special needs, five year olds know they shouldn’t leave a classroom.

"He's no angel." - weirdo DCUM poster

Name calling, are you the kid’s parent or lawyer? You’re posting throughout this thread as if it’s personal to you.

So can we presume that you are an interested party? Why do you care so much? It seems very personal to you in a way that is very unhealthy and honestly slightly racist.

What is racist about saying 5 year olds know not to leave the classroom?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A similar situation happened at a private school in Prince George's County about 14 years ago. Luckily, another parent from the school spotted the kindergartener walking alone on a major road. This parent happened to be the spouse of a police officer. She called the police right away and stayed with the child until they came. As far as I know, the story had a happy ending. The school did make a few security changes afterwards.

I don’t know the details about either case but they don’t sound the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The article isn't saying the entire situation. Why were the cops with the child for 50 minutes? Either child wouldn't calm down and get it together or they were waiting for the mother to arrive to get the child as it was a safety issue to leave the child there.

Or, more like what would happen with any 5 year old subjected to this, cops harangued kid into a state where he could not be calmed down. If you put cuffs on my kid, who is totally normal and has no behavioral problems, that is what I would expect to happen.

If you kid is totally "normal" they wouldn't be leaving school. I suspect the kid was fighting the police and didn't get in the car (which isn't necessarily wrong of a 5 year old given they were strangers).

There is more to this story. I'd like to see the footage and know more about the child before I condemn the police officers. They probably did say some stuff to the five year old but it isn't a simple situation with a 5 year old walking off campus.

[Anonymous]

I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I find this really confusing. It's hard to know what happened. I am always suspicious when there is just one side, especially when that side is the lawyers representing one person.

One one hand, the kid ran away from school. One of the things that the article objects to seems to be that the police picked up the kid, put him in the car and drove him back to school. To me, that's what I'd expect. The police's first job in that circumstance is definitely to get the kid back to the adults who are caring for him. Yes, being "placed in a squad car" (one of the things they object to) is scary, but I'm not sure how else they should get the child back to school

It sounds like some of the things they said while they were doing it were out of line, but honestly without the other side it's just hard to say.

Quoting here “ the complaint was written based on body camera footage of the incident from one officer. The other officer’s camera was not on, they said.”

That’s a wrap!

The quote was written by the attorney, who claims to have seen the body camera footage. The journalist did not see the body camera footage. Big difference.

Until footage is presented in court you mean.

Sure, but that footage could support either side, or be open to differing interpretations. I'm certainly not going to take an attorney's description of what the body camera footage shows as gospel given his obvious self-interest in the matter.

Why would the attorney lie about something that can be verified? I'm no experts but I think there are consequences for attorneys that lie in court documents.

I am an attorney and "lie" is quite strong. Yes, you cannot knowingly make a false statement in a pleading. You absolutely can and many do shade the facts in the absolute most favorable light to your client.

Playing fast and loose with facts can be a strategic mistake, but most plaintiff's side lawyers aren't known for their discretion and tend to like a flair for the dramatic, particularly when there is an ability to get favorable press. But it is going to take quite a lot for an attorney to actual face an ethical issue if there is even a chance the video could be interpreted as he described.

So in other words yes the police did place handcuffs on a 5 year old's wrist.

Maybe. I haven't seen the footage. But, even if that part is true, that is hardly the most salacious part of the complaint. It is conceivable there could be a rationale basis for handcuffing a kid and, even if that action itself was improper, that is a far cry from assaulting him.

If the child was out of control hitting and kicking the only option would be handcuffs or physically restrain. Most parents would have a bigger fit if their child was physically restrained.

The cops were probably inappropriate but lets see the footage. There should have been a camera in the police car and in the office of the school.

Sorry, this is a five year old. Why do we need cops to physically restrain or handcuff him? This is not normal.

Depending on what the kid was doing, restraining him might have been the safest option for him. It is also conceivable that the cop thought he would be safer that way. (I have a five year old -- they can hurt you. The cop likely couldn't have been in enough fear to warrant deadly force, or even something like mace or a taser. But simply restraining is a far lesser action than any of those other things.) Even if you think the cop was wrong for cuffing the kid -- and that certainly could be true -- that's not necessarily an egress act. Beating the kid, as seems was also alleged, is a whole different story.

There is something wrong with you. Please just stop posting here.

That's a lovely invitation, but I decline. Why exactly is there something wrong with me? What have a said that you think is so offensive? I think my post was quite measured and was open to either side being correct and acknowledging that I don't have enough facts to come to a definitive conclusion. I guess you just prefer to immediately assume that one side is at fault based on nothing more than a lawyer's characterization of what occurred.

Also, that is only my second post on this thread, so there must be other similar people that haves something wrong with them for keeping an open mind and not jumping to conclusions.

This is just clown shoes all the way down. Who do you think you are arguing with and what point are you trying to prove?

That's two posts in a row where you have insulted me, but you haven't actually addressed the substance of my post and why you believe it is beyond the pale. I've addressed the topic in a serious, substantive manner. If you want to do the same, great. If you want to just lash out and hear nothing but an echo chamber that agrees with you (of course I don't really now what part of my post you so object to), then I have no need to engage further.

I agree, there’s a poster on this thread that results to name calling and telling everyone to stop expressing their opinions. Not willing to read alternate points of view or at least challenge the substance.

[Anonymous]

Was the lawsuit was filed before mom and lawyer saw the video? If so, was it the cruiser ride back to the school that triggered the suit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

Its not appropriate for a police officer to say mom will spank you as that's a parenting choice but I would fully expect a police office to pick up a child and put them in a car to return them to school I would assume the child was continuing to act up with price but we don't know until we saw the video. My big concern is what happened at school to make this child leave? Was the child bullied? Threatened? Special needs? Kids don't typically elope except in SN or feeling upset or threatened.

[Anonymous]

It is my understanding from having a child with SNs (who is not an eloper) that school staff cannot physically stop a child from leaving, and if the child gets to the property line, cannot follow the child beyond that point. This happens more often than you might think or hope, and has definitely happened at most schools, although you would not have heard about it.

So, if we want to focus just on the elopement, schools are going to need more staff and better policies because law enforcement is always going to be involved under the current policy.

Now, if we want to discuss police brutality (which is where I think we should focus our energies), if even half of what the complainant is alleging is true, the cops need to just throw money at the parents, as well as firing the officers involved.

There is zero excuse for physically and verbally abusing anyone, let alone a small child. There are no circumstances under which even a fraction of what is being described is appropriate.

Finally, the question of whether the school staff stood by and let this happen.

It is SCARY to stand up to the police. This is a constant struggle in my workplace (Emergency Department) and nurses and doctors often fail to protect their patients. But we need to do better, and so do school staff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

Its not appropriate for a police officer to say mom will spank you as that's a parenting choice but I would fully expect a police office to pick up a child and put them in a car to return them to school I would assume the child was continuing to act up with price but we don't know until we saw the video. My big concern is what happened at school to make this child leave? Was the child bullied? Threatened? Special needs? Kids don't typically elope except in SN or feeling upset or threatened.

Elopement happens more often than you might think, and that is especially true in kindergarten, for both typically developing kids who just don't like the transition to school, and for kids with special needs who are eventually going to need a different type of environment or a classroom with more staffing. I do not know this family, and I don't know their child, but I can tell you as a general rule that kindergarten is the first interaction most kids have with public education, and it can take until at least January to identify and document kids who are going to need an environment with more supervision.

None of that is to excuse any of what happened, but I'm pushing back on the specific allegation that kids don't elope except in super unique circumstances. That's not true. Which is why the kindergarten and first grade classes need more staffing, but that appears to be impossible right now with budget cuts.

[Anonymous]

I once had a kid elope from his parents visiting across the street and climb into my car parked in my property. Parents were pissed but not surprised. Some kids just have no boundaries or obvious thought process. I figured the kid was special needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

Well, there are terrible parents and you sound like one. If you have kids snd you think it’s okay to tell a kid they deserve to be beaten get therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I once had a kid elope from his parents visiting across the street and climb into my car parked in my property. Parents were pissed but not surprised. Some kids just have no boundaries or obvious thought process. I figured the kid was special needs.

Please stop acting like SN kids are a problem or deserve to be abused because of their SN.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

Maybe evaluate the boundaries you have for acceptable behavior toward a young child - a FIVE year old.

It’s one thing to pick up the child, let him know in no uncertain terms the behavior was totally unacceptable, and to coordinate with the parent to determine an appropriate path forward. This could include suspension, etc.

It’s another thing to berate, terrorize, and threaten a child with physical harm for over 50 minutes. That’s despicable and completely out of bounds of professional behavior, let alone how any LEO and school should treat a child. Can you as an adult imagine a scenario where you were detained by police who threatened physical harm to you for almost an hour? How would you feel?

Also, how the hell did a child leave the school to begin with? Again, we’re talking a five year old. Where were the responsible adults who are supposed to ensure that young children don’t just walk off school property. If this were a 15 year old, different situation. This is a FIVE year old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m trying to put myself in their shoes. So the gist of it, if my 5 1/2 year old eloped from school, and school employees were unable to stop him at the school property line and had to call the police. Then if it took officers 50 minutes and a bunch of “your mom is going to spank you when you get home” and a ride in the cruiser back to school...

I’d be angry... not at the school or police officers but at my child. I can’t imagine ever thinking I was entitled to money because of this. Without seeing the video, I may have a different opinion but I’m not going to take the lawyer’s play by play.

Well, there are terrible parents and you sound like one. If you have kids snd you think it’s okay to tell a kid they deserve to be beaten get therapy.

We haven’t seen the recordings to know what was said.