How common is a math or reading MAP score at the 99th percentile in this area?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

The 2020 norms to which MCPS test data (and that of other school systems) is compared was constructed from samplings of test data across the nation for tests taken between fall of 2015 and spring of 2018. None of the tests taken at that time carried the effect of the pandemic, while every test taken by MCPS students since spring 2020 has been.

The fact that MCPS, as a whole, scores ahead of those national norms despite that pandemic-related learning deficit is indicative of much greater relative strength of the system than just a nominal 2% beat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

The 2020 norms to which MCPS test data (and that of other school systems) is compared was constructed from samplings of test data across the nation for tests taken between fall of 2015 and spring of 2018. None of the tests taken at that time carried the effect of the pandemic, while every test taken by MCPS students since spring 2020 has been.

The fact that MCPS, as a whole, scores ahead of those national norms despite that pandemic-related learning deficit is indicative of much greater relative strength of the system than just a nominal 2% beat.

Yes, the MCPS mean is 1%-2% higher than the national average, but that's nothing to get worked up about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

The 2020 norms to which MCPS test data (and that of other school systems) is compared was constructed from samplings of test data across the nation for tests taken between fall of 2015 and spring of 2018. None of the tests taken at that time carried the effect of the pandemic, while every test taken by MCPS students since spring 2020 has been.

The fact that MCPS, as a whole, scores ahead of those national norms despite that pandemic-related learning deficit is indicative of much greater relative strength of the system than just a nominal 2% beat.

Are you for real? Do you just have young children so you aren’t familiar with this before the pandemic? The situation is unchanged since prior to the pandemic. The 2019 numbers, for example, showed the exact same thing. MCPS and national norms were within a point or two of each other then, just as they are now. Look at your kids MAP report from 2019 if you don’t believe me. They are on ParentVue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

The 2020 norms to which MCPS test data (and that of other school systems) is compared was constructed from samplings of test data across the nation for tests taken between fall of 2015 and spring of 2018. None of the tests taken at that time carried the effect of the pandemic, while every test taken by MCPS students since spring 2020 has been.

The fact that MCPS, as a whole, scores ahead of those national norms despite that pandemic-related learning deficit is indicative of much greater relative strength of the system than just a nominal 2% beat.

No, you cannot properly infer that the slightly higher mcps scores are due to the strength of the system. It can just mean that mcps attracts a slightly higher number of highly engaged families than the national average.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP,

At grade level MAP 99th percentile is really easy. It is based nation wide sample. This area is known to have many high achievers

I got my DC MAP-M score from 3rd Grade (fall) of 244 to 5th Grade of 295 --- not gifted at all

People say this but when MCPS released map percentiles compared to national norms they were just a bit higher. It’s probably a fat tail at the top though due to the reason you cite.

Not really. It's just a point or two above the national average.

That’s correct. Folks in DCUM love to claim that everyone is 99th percentile in Montgomery county but that is absolutely laughable. The midpoint national is 50% obviously, maybe it’s 52% in MCPS. Even if PPs accept this they will fall over themselves talking about the distribution and how it must be different here. It’s not.

+1

[Anonymous]

Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

My DC didn’t qualify for the lottery with a MAP-R score in the 97th percentile because the 97th percentile nationwide wasn’t within the top 15% of MCPS test takers in our low FARMs cohort of schools. So the MCPS-wide mean might be only 2 points or whatever higher than the national norm but among the low FARMS schools, being in the 98/99th percentile is pretty commonplace.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

My DC didn’t qualify for the lottery with a MAP-R score in the 97th percentile because the 97th percentile nationwide wasn’t within the top 15% of MCPS test takers in our low FARMs cohort of schools. So the MCPS-wide mean might be only 2 points or whatever higher than the national norm but among the low FARMS schools, being in the 98/99th percentile is pretty commonplace.

That’s not correct and didn’t happen. The cut off numbers for low FARMS schools have been shared here and none were even close to as high as 97%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

My DC didn’t qualify for the lottery with a MAP-R score in the 97th percentile because the 97th percentile nationwide wasn’t within the top 15% of MCPS test takers in our low FARMs cohort of schools. So the MCPS-wide mean might be only 2 points or whatever higher than the national norm but among the low FARMS schools, being in the 98/99th percentile is pretty commonplace.

That's odd because I thought the information posted on the MCCPTA group obtained through FOIA stated 95% or higher was the cutoff for a low-farms school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

My DC didn’t qualify for the lottery with a MAP-R score in the 97th percentile because the 97th percentile nationwide wasn’t within the top 15% of MCPS test takers in our low FARMs cohort of schools. So the MCPS-wide mean might be only 2 points or whatever higher than the national norm but among the low FARMS schools, being in the 98/99th percentile is pretty commonplace.

That's odd because I thought the information posted on the MCCPTA group obtained through FOIA stated 95% or higher was the cutoff for a low-farms school.

Maybe for MAP-M. This was MAP-R. And either way, it’s clear that there’s a huge gap in what’s “normal” between low and high FARMS schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading this you might get depressed. I think a lot of people here exaggerate both on how commonplace high scores are, but also on what any of that means.

For one, the tails of these exams are not predictive of anything. In other words, 97% is not that meaningfully different from 99% and definitely not 99.75%. Its also a terrible test altogether because it measures exposures to various materials, not innate logical or reasoning skills.

My kids were 98/99 percentile in math/reading depending on year They got into CES, magnet middle and magnet high schools. We live in a low FARMs area *and* we are Asian (so should be a double whammy on acceptances but obviously not). We didn't enrich at all. It was all fine. Also, the kids with the highest MAP M scores in 8th grade were not necessarily the best Multivariate students so it's just one test folks with questionable utility.

I am not Asian, but one of my children went through these programs. My younger one might. They're equally smart, but with the lotteries and all today, I'm not all that optimistic since it's more about DEI than test scores now.

My DC didn’t qualify for the lottery with a MAP-R score in the 97th percentile because the 97th percentile nationwide wasn’t within the top 15% of MCPS test takers in our low FARMs cohort of schools. So the MCPS-wide mean might be only 2 points or whatever higher than the national norm but among the low FARMS schools, being in the 98/99th percentile is pretty commonplace.

That's odd because I thought the information posted on the MCCPTA group obtained through FOIA stated 95% or higher was the cutoff for a low-farms school.

np When did MCPS start lowering the admissions standards for kids from higher FARMS schools? Does this apply for all magnet programs in middle and high school too?