Replicating ATS success — what are exact differences

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One big difference is parents who are involved and motivated enough to seek a slot at ATS. Your principal can’t do anything about that one.

There are plenty of people trying to get in, there are not enough slots. We shouldn't have to be motivated to enter the lottery, this is how all the elementary schools should be ran.

What about those of us who are happy at our school, don’t agree with how ATS is run or don’t think it’s a good fit for our kid? I don’t want my Arlington elementary school to become ATS!

We have older elementary neighbors and friends whose kids go to APS, so I am not just basing my opinion off of DCUM threads and website copy.

Genuinely curious:
What would you have done if all APS schools were "run like ATS?"
What specifically do you not like about how ATS is run?

Not the poster you're asking, but our kids attended a school where the principal was a "principles not rules" type, and one kid had a teacher who would have loved being at ATS. And I responded with polite, cheerful noncompliance. Which was OK with the principal.

You can't make parents back you up on homework every night in every grade or tucking in shirts or playing an instrument. All my kids were reading by the end of K, but I would not have agreed with holding any of them back for lack of "academic achievement" in K

What was the teacher asking them/you to do that made you respond with cheerful noncompliance?

Does it matter? Kid was well-behaved in class

Yes, it does matter.

A brilliant and cogent response

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think that ATS has some good things going for it. But a HUGE part of their success is that it’s a self selecting group that starts in K and stays through 5th.


Neighborhood schools have way more transient students that move around often. So you have kids (and often it’s low income kids) who are at their 3rd school in two years.

Also in neighborhood schools class sizes fluctuate and because of that staffing fluctuates. (A lot more teacher turn over and teacher teaching different grades).


These are things you just can’t replicate in a neighborhood school.

All of that matters . But so do things like properly teaching kids to read, regular updates to parents on kids, and giving kids 1-1 tutoring when they are in danger of falling behind.

In fact so many families want a school like ATS that APS could try an experiment at a neighborhood school by adopting more of ATS’s practices and see what happens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One big difference is parents who are involved and motivated enough to seek a slot at ATS. Your principal can’t do anything about that one.

There are plenty of people trying to get in, there are not enough slots. We shouldn't have to be motivated to enter the lottery, this is how all the elementary schools should be ran.

What about those of us who are happy at our school, don’t agree with how ATS is run or don’t think it’s a good fit for our kid? I don’t want my Arlington elementary school to become ATS!

We have older elementary neighbors and friends whose kids go to APS, so I am not just basing my opinion off of DCUM threads and website copy.

Genuinely curious:
What would you have done if all APS schools were "run like ATS?"
What specifically do you not like about how ATS is run?

Not the poster you're asking, but our kids attended a school where the principal was a "principles not rules" type, and one kid had a teacher who would have loved being at ATS. And I responded with polite, cheerful noncompliance. Which was OK with the principal.

You can't make parents back you up on homework every night in every grade or tucking in shirts or playing an instrument. All my kids were reading by the end of K, but I would not have agreed with holding any of them back for lack of "academic achievement" in K

What was the teacher asking them/you to do that made you respond with cheerful noncompliance?

Does it matter? Kid was well-behaved in class

Yes, it does matter.

A brilliant and cogent response

Just because he sat quietly at his desk doesn’t mean he was well-behaved. Ignoring the teacher’s requests means he was exactly the opposite.

OP, it’s behavior like this drags other schools down. You don’t get to just smile politely while ignoring the rules at ATS. (And this is why tucking shirts in matters. When families know they take trivial requests seriously, they know the school means business when it comes to the big stuff.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that ATS has some good things going for it. But a HUGE part of their success is that it’s a self selecting group that starts in K and stays through 5th.


Neighborhood schools have way more transient students that move around often. So you have kids (and often it’s low income kids) who are at their 3rd school in two years.

Also in neighborhood schools class sizes fluctuate and because of that staffing fluctuates. (A lot more teacher turn over and teacher teaching different grades).


These are things you just can’t replicate in a neighborhood school.

All of that matters . But so do things like properly teaching kids to read, regular updates to parents on kids, and giving kids 1-1 tutoring when they are in danger of falling behind.

In fact so many families want a school like ATS that APS could try an experiment at a neighborhood school by adopting more of ATS’s practices and see what happens.

But you wouldn’t get the same results bc you’d have people like dumb@ss PP who think they’re fine as long as they remain cheerful while ignoring the teacher’s requests.

[Anonymous]

Pretty sure the dumbass is the one who thinks everyone needs to care about tucked-in shirts, but in any case, this is why countywide ATS is a bad idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that ATS has some good things going for it. But a HUGE part of their success is that it’s a self selecting group that starts in K and stays through 5th.


Neighborhood schools have way more transient students that move around often. So you have kids (and often it’s low income kids) who are at their 3rd school in two years.

Also in neighborhood schools class sizes fluctuate and because of that staffing fluctuates. (A lot more teacher turn over and teacher teaching different grades).


These are things you just can’t replicate in a neighborhood school.

All of that matters . But so do things like properly teaching kids to read, regular updates to parents on kids, and giving kids 1-1 tutoring when they are in danger of falling behind.

In fact so many families want a school like ATS that APS could try an experiment at a neighborhood school by adopting more of ATS’s practices and see what happens.

Science focus used to be a mini- ATS. No tucking in shirts but mostly everything else was present— daily homework starting in kindergarten, encouraging reading, emphasizing writing and having daily writing homework in fourth and fifth grade, extremely encouraging playing an instrument (if you didn’t, you had to do sol tutoring during band/orchestra so most kids did an instrument). It ended when they became a neighborhood school— it was part Covid relaxing standards, part that not enough parents wanted that type of school anymore so they couldn’t force it. I think you need buy in for something like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that ATS has some good things going for it. But a HUGE part of their success is that it’s a self selecting group that starts in K and stays through 5th.


Neighborhood schools have way more transient students that move around often. So you have kids (and often it’s low income kids) who are at their 3rd school in two years.

Also in neighborhood schools class sizes fluctuate and because of that staffing fluctuates. (A lot more teacher turn over and teacher teaching different grades).


These are things you just can’t replicate in a neighborhood school.

All of that matters . But so do things like properly teaching kids to read, regular updates to parents on kids, and giving kids 1-1 tutoring when they are in danger of falling behind.

In fact so many families want a school like ATS that APS could try an experiment at a neighborhood school by adopting more of ATS’s practices and see what happens.

Science focus used to be a mini- ATS. No tucking in shirts but mostly everything else was present— daily homework starting in kindergarten, encouraging reading, emphasizing writing and having daily writing homework in fourth and fifth grade, extremely encouraging playing an instrument (if you didn’t, you had to do sol tutoring during band/orchestra so most kids did an instrument). It ended when they became a neighborhood school— it was part Covid relaxing standards, part that not enough parents wanted that type of school anymore so they couldn’t force it. I think you need buy in for something like that.

So it was an option school before?

[Anonymous]

I don’t know where this whole this tucked in shirt talk keeps coming from. Our child started at ATS this year and no one has mentioned anything about dress code or having their shirts tucked in. Is this something that used to happen?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know where this whole this tucked in shirt talk keeps coming from. Our child started at ATS this year and no one has mentioned anything about dress code or having their shirts tucked in. Is this something that used to happen?

We are at ATS and the shirt tucking isn’t a crazy thing or we haven’t been told anything. We are in kinder though so maybe that’s why. 🤷‍♀️

[Anonymous]

I know someone asked why ATS is different from other option schools and someone else mentioned absenteeism. For reference. ATS has 1.7% of kids with chronic absenteeism. Claremont is 18.83% and Campbell is 19.94%.

Everyone can discuss this to death. But it is the makeup of the school. THAT is the difference. ATS doesn't have some magic solution. They haven't solved education. They have a very specific self selecting group of families who highly value education. And that is super wonderful.

It is just hard to fight against nearly 20% of the school being chronically absent. The population of the school is just different.

Also, this got me looking at absentee rates at schools.

Drew 23.66%
Randolph 21.76%
Barcroft 15.5%

Lets Compare to N. Arlington schools

Nottingham .51%
Taylor 4.02%
Cardinal 2.14%

Chronic Absenteeism is probably the real problem we need to solve to help close the achievement gap.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know where this whole this tucked in shirt talk keeps coming from. Our child started at ATS this year and no one has mentioned anything about dress code or having their shirts tucked in. Is this something that used to happen?

We are at ATS and the shirt tucking isn’t a crazy thing or we haven’t been told anything. We are in kinder though so maybe that’s why. 🤷‍♀️

ATS parent here. It was a thing before Covid. With Covid it was not strictly enforced. Last year they brought it back and would keep emphasizing it. This year they haven’t. It’s a thing that non ATS families love to harp on. It hasn’t really been a big deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know someone asked why ATS is different from other option schools and someone else mentioned absenteeism. For reference. ATS has 1.7% of kids with chronic absenteeism. Claremont is 18.83% and Campbell is 19.94%.

Everyone can discuss this to death. But it is the makeup of the school. THAT is the difference. ATS doesn't have some magic solution. They haven't solved education. They have a very specific self selecting group of families who highly value education. And that is super wonderful.

It is just hard to fight against nearly 20% of the school being chronically absent. The population of the school is just different.

Also, this got me looking at absentee rates at schools.

Drew 23.66%
Randolph 21.76%
Barcroft 15.5%

Lets Compare to N. Arlington schools

Nottingham .51%
Taylor 4.02%
Cardinal 2.14%

Chronic Absenteeism is probably the real problem we need to solve to help close the achievement gap.

Where can we find these stats and the definition of chronic absenteeism? Like how many days per quarter?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that ATS has some good things going for it. But a HUGE part of their success is that it’s a self selecting group that starts in K and stays through 5th.


Neighborhood schools have way more transient students that move around often. So you have kids (and often it’s low income kids) who are at their 3rd school in two years.

Also in neighborhood schools class sizes fluctuate and because of that staffing fluctuates. (A lot more teacher turn over and teacher teaching different grades).


These are things you just can’t replicate in a neighborhood school.

All of that matters . But so do things like properly teaching kids to read, regular updates to parents on kids, and giving kids 1-1 tutoring when they are in danger of falling behind.

In fact so many families want a school like ATS that APS could try an experiment at a neighborhood school by adopting more of ATS’s practices and see what happens.

Science focus used to be a mini- ATS. No tucking in shirts but mostly everything else was present— daily homework starting in kindergarten, encouraging reading, emphasizing writing and having daily writing homework in fourth and fifth grade, extremely encouraging playing an instrument (if you didn’t, you had to do sol tutoring during band/orchestra so most kids did an instrument). It ended when they became a neighborhood school— it was part Covid relaxing standards, part that not enough parents wanted that type of school anymore so they couldn’t force it. I think you need buy in for something like that.

So it was an option school before?

Yes— you could transfer in from either Taylor or Jamestown (they were part of a “team”)— roughly 30-50% of the school were transfers. It became a neighborhood school in 2018, though there were still transfers in the upper grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know someone asked why ATS is different from other option schools and someone else mentioned absenteeism. For reference. ATS has 1.7% of kids with chronic absenteeism. Claremont is 18.83% and Campbell is 19.94%.

Everyone can discuss this to death. But it is the makeup of the school. THAT is the difference. ATS doesn't have some magic solution. They haven't solved education. They have a very specific self selecting group of families who highly value education. And that is super wonderful.

It is just hard to fight against nearly 20% of the school being chronically absent. The population of the school is just different.

Also, this got me looking at absentee rates at schools.

Drew 23.66%
Randolph 21.76%
Barcroft 15.5%

Lets Compare to N. Arlington schools

Nottingham .51%
Taylor 4.02%
Cardinal 2.14%

Chronic Absenteeism is probably the real problem we need to solve to help close the achievement gap.

Where can we find these stats and the definition of chronic absenteeism? Like how many days per quarter?

It is on the state website. Here is the definition:

"Chronic absenteeism is defined as missing 10 percent or more of the school year, regardless of reason."

https://schoolquality.virginia.gov/virginia-schools?division=7&filter=

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know where this whole this tucked in shirt talk keeps coming from. Our child started at ATS this year and no one has mentioned anything about dress code or having their shirts tucked in. Is this something that used to happen?

We are at ATS and the shirt tucking isn’t a crazy thing or we haven’t been told anything. We are in kinder though so maybe that’s why. 🤷‍♀️

ATS parent here. It was a thing before Covid. With Covid it was not strictly enforced. Last year they brought it back and would keep emphasizing it. This year they haven’t. It’s a thing that non ATS families love to harp on. It hasn’t really been a big deal.

It was a big deal to the previous principal, or maybe the one before? Anyway, Holly Whatshername harped on it in public presentations about what made her school so special. And then the ATS kids picked up on it. I'm clearly ancient, and the ATS friends of my non-ATS kid talked about the tuck a lot.