TWSB Nutcracker 2023!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

The black and brown students from NW gets stuck in certain roles. DD is black was a page last year, her casting group all black and brown girls. This year, all the same page girls are bunnies. I haven't said anything to my daughter about this or to the other parents, but it's something I'm keeping an eye on. Party Girls, Little Butterflies and other "prized" roles will cast very few students of color, especially ones who are not pale or white-passing. It's alarming that given how few black and brown students they have and why they're consistently being grouped in the same roles together.

Isn't Valley Forge Bunny more advanced than Soldier? So, they "skipped" the Soldier stage and were advanced to the Bunny? I would imagine that to be a good thing, no?
However, if certain roles are type-cast, or *disproportionately* assigned to girls of a certain race, then this is a big problem. Maybe unconscious bias, but nonetheless something that needs to be addressed by whomever is doing the casting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wish there was a spot on their audition form for previous roles! It can't be that hard.

They do already keep track of what roles kids have had, and they ask them at the auditions too.
If kids are not going to be okay doing a role multiple times, they should probably sit out honestly.
And I'm a parent of a chronic soldier, but she gets it and is just determined to be her best. if your kids can't have that attitude, let Donna know.

Just because they've been doing things this way for a million years doesn't mean it's right or the best way forward. They're missing a huge opportunity to retain students, make the performance an opportunity to set goals by 'going after different roles'. And yes, two years in a row you can spin to a child that they're the veterans this year but three years in a row while their friends get to grow? That's so discouraging and basically telling that child that they don't matter or as my daughter put it, "I'm just filler." How about they pull some of this weight to encourage kids instead of having it land on the parent? It would mean so much more coming from them.

[Anonymous]

I feel like a lot of this is just the harsh world of dance. Not everyone will get the highly coveted roles and, yes, there are plenty of talented ballerinas who will never be promoted from the corps to soloist or to principal dancer. The reality is that there are only so many roles in this production because of the company. If you want your DD to grow as a dancer and have the opportunity to dance more challenging roles over the years, you’re probably better off at a youth ballet like Maryland Youth Ballet where there is no professional company taking up the vast majority of the roles.

[Anonymous]

A soldier is a desirable role. Three times a soldier is nothing like being a page three times.

[Anonymous]

I guess they have to balance the reputation of the company / school (which may lead them to treat casting as a 100% meritocracy) and the development/retainment of as many dancers as possible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like a lot of this is just the harsh world of dance. Not everyone will get the highly coveted roles and, yes, there are plenty of talented ballerinas who will never be promoted from the corps to soloist or to principal dancer. The reality is that there are only so many roles in this production because of the company. If you want your DD to grow as a dancer and have the opportunity to dance more challenging roles over the years, you’re probably better off at a youth ballet like Maryland Youth Ballet where there is no professional company taking up the vast majority of the roles.

So much this

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess they have to balance the reputation of the company / school (which may lead them to treat casting as a 100% meritocracy) and the development/retainment of as many dancers as possible.

If you know anything about the ballet world, you know that it historically has been rife with racism. Ballet is most definitely not a meritocracy. It's getting better, but you're in the market for bridges if you think that TWB or any other professional ballet company for that matter is completely immune from racism.

[Anonymous]

The fact is that none of the standard roles for young girls are hard. Meritocracy is an odd word in this context. The roles of the older girls or party girls, yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

The black and brown students from NW gets stuck in certain roles. DD is black was a page last year, her casting group all black and brown girls. This year, all the same page girls are bunnies. I haven't said anything to my daughter about this or to the other parents, but it's something I'm keeping an eye on. Party Girls, Little Butterflies and other "prized" roles will cast very few students of color, especially ones who are not pale or white-passing. It's alarming that given how few black and brown students they have and why they're consistently being grouped in the same roles together.

This is my daughter too. Was a page last year and a bunny this year... Also not white. Was very upset both years but remains committed because she wants to be a ballerina, loves her classes and for hopes of a role she wants next year... I'll be watching out for this. She absolutely feels overlooked in spite of getting high marks and comments in her classes and I encourage her to keep working, but obviously this doesn't apply if opportunity doesn't exist here for her the same as others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I guess they have to balance the reputation of the company / school (which may lead them to treat casting as a 100% meritocracy) and the development/retainment of as many dancers as possible.

If you know anything about the ballet world, you know that it historically has been rife with racism. Ballet is most definitely not a meritocracy. It's getting better, but you're in the market for bridges if you think that TWB or any other professional ballet company for that matter is completely immune from racism.

PP, that is a good point. Tons of bias (conscious or unconscious), preference for certain looks, etc. Hopefully things do get better in the future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

The black and brown students from NW gets stuck in certain roles. DD is black was a page last year, her casting group all black and brown girls. This year, all the same page girls are bunnies. I haven't said anything to my daughter about this or to the other parents, but it's something I'm keeping an eye on. Party Girls, Little Butterflies and other "prized" roles will cast very few students of color, especially ones who are not pale or white-passing. It's alarming that given how few black and brown students they have and why they're consistently being grouped in the same roles together.

This is my daughter too. Was a page last year and a bunny this year... Also not white. Was very upset both years but remains committed because she wants to be a ballerina, loves her classes and for hopes of a role she wants next year... I'll be watching out for this. She absolutely feels overlooked in spite of getting high marks and comments in her classes and I encourage her to keep working, but obviously this doesn't apply if opportunity doesn't exist here for her the same as others.

Bunny is a great role! like PP said, its like she got promoted right over soldiers - soldiers are also great - but unless shes like a Level 4B or 5, Bunny is a Great and totally appropriate role

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

The black and brown students from NW gets stuck in certain roles. DD is black was a page last year, her casting group all black and brown girls. This year, all the same page girls are bunnies. I haven't said anything to my daughter about this or to the other parents, but it's something I'm keeping an eye on. Party Girls, Little Butterflies and other "prized" roles will cast very few students of color, especially ones who are not pale or white-passing. It's alarming that given how few black and brown students they have and why they're consistently being grouped in the same roles together.

This is my daughter too. Was a page last year and a bunny this year... Also not white. Was very upset both years but remains committed because she wants to be a ballerina, loves her classes and for hopes of a role she wants next year... I'll be watching out for this. She absolutely feels overlooked in spite of getting high marks and comments in her classes and I encourage her to keep working, but obviously this doesn't apply if opportunity doesn't exist here for her the same as others.

Bunny is a great role! like PP said, its like she got promoted right over soldiers - soldiers are also great - but unless shes like a Level 4B or 5, Bunny is a Great and totally appropriate role

She's an upper level student but I'll keep encouraging her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

The black and brown students from NW gets stuck in certain roles. DD is black was a page last year, her casting group all black and brown girls. This year, all the same page girls are bunnies. I haven't said anything to my daughter about this or to the other parents, but it's something I'm keeping an eye on. Party Girls, Little Butterflies and other "prized" roles will cast very few students of color, especially ones who are not pale or white-passing. It's alarming that given how few black and brown students they have and why they're consistently being grouped in the same roles together.

This is my daughter too. Was a page last year and a bunny this year... Also not white. Was very upset both years but remains committed because she wants to be a ballerina, loves her classes and for hopes of a role she wants next year... I'll be watching out for this. She absolutely feels overlooked in spite of getting high marks and comments in her classes and I encourage her to keep working, but obviously this doesn't apply if opportunity doesn't exist here for her the same as others.

Bunny is a great role! like PP said, its like she got promoted right over soldiers - soldiers are also great - but unless shes like a Level 4B or 5, Bunny is a Great and totally appropriate role

She's an upper level student but I'll keep encouraging her.

DD knows a 4B who went from Bunny to Soldier on day 1, so I think the roles are all shifted a little older this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

It's a bit more nuanced than that--the Company uses ONLY students from the School, and works closely with the school for auditions. It is in the long-term best interest of the Company to ensure that students continue to audition. If the TWB reputation for the Nutcracker is that the girls from SE end up as flower pages year after year--and that the girls from NW end up as clowns and party girls, then very few girls from SE will audition.

This. I have no doubt that ballet in general is somewhat racist and the girls of color in NW get screwed too. But this year it is incredibly apparent that the whole SE program was basically treated as expendable. Almost uniformly the limited number of kids not cast at the younger levels were from SE, the SE kids are disproportionately the pages and there are virtually zero SE kids in the desirable roles. On top of that, there are the 6 SE “soldiers” who found out they were demoted to pages. For a lot of these roles, there is no question that the roles require largely overlapping skills and selection doesn’t meaningfully effect the show at all. It may, on the other hand, lead to a mass exodus from SE. I think they’ve truly made a mistake here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can imagine how it would feel to be assigned a soldier and then end up a page. Or be a page three years in a row! Being part of the Nutcracker is exciting, but at a certain point... Our DD stopped dancing at WSB a few years ago because of their inflexible schedule for older girls. I can say in retrospect that all of this seems like such a big deal in the moment but isn't. On the other hand, there should be respect for the girls involved. Three years as a page is just wrong. And switching someone from soldier to page is, for a young girl, a pretty big blow. These roles do have varying levels of desirability, and young girls will take something like this hard. There should be more respect for the girls or a clear warning about what could happen so families don't sign up for a possible humiliation of this order without being aware of what could happen.

If my kid were assigned as a page for the third year in a row and didn't want to do it, I would 100% pull them out. I don't give a crap what I signed earlier. It's so totally disrespectful to the girls. This is especially true because one kid who I knew who got stuck in that role for two years was more or less told that it's because they were an excellent babysitter for the younger kids. It's especially crappy to get the worst role because you're a nice kid. 3 years in a row? No way.

This is such a poor attitude. This is a company production, not a school production. The casting is about filling the needs of the production, and not necessarily about showcasing each student. This is going to vary on the number of kids who show up to the audition at each level.

Most of the roles at that level are pretty interchangeable, honestly. It’s not like I’m saying she should get a chance to be Clara (or even clown or party girl or butterfly or bunny). You can absolutely not give a kid page 3 years in a row without affecting the show. At the very least, you should pre-warn parents and give them a chance to turn down the spot.