Ivies vs. Top 20 schools (after listening to many a podcast on the subject)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are all so weird with your obsession over rankings.

I'm pretty it's just one person posting multiple times to create a fake consensus.

Well there’s at least two of us cuz I didn’t post the above and I agree. Not exactly groundbreaking or revelatory though is it? Those top 15 schools have always been tops, not much to argue over to create a fake consensus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are all so weird with your obsession over rankings.

I'm pretty it's just one person posting multiple times to create a fake consensus.

Well there’s at least two of us cuz I didn’t post the above and I agree. Not exactly groundbreaking or revelatory though is it? Those top 15 schools have always been tops, not much to argue over to create a fake consensus.

No, we can't live with 15. We have to trim it to only 8.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You are all so weird with your obsession over rankings.

I'm pretty it's just one person posting multiple times to create a fake consensus.

So you agree? You think you're really pretty?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So I've been listening to a lot of podcasts about college admissions (mostly Inside the Admissions Office) and after listening to some of the instagram episodes Dean J from UVA, it really jumps out at me how different schools like Ivies look at candidates vs. schools like UVA.

Obviously, the Ivies are amazing. And anyone would be extremely lucky to go there. But listening to some of the Admissions Officers from the top schools on Inside the Admissions Office is really just so different from the way Dean J speaks. The admissions officers from the tippy top schools expect *so much* from the kids (obviously) to the point where listening just made me exhausted. They're talking about filling the entire awards section (with state and national and even international awards preferably) and running your own business or nonprofit and the importance of showing a passion and making a major contribution in that passion, etc. Whereas Dean J is always saying that they know that they're dealing with teenagers who are 17 and have school work to focus on and like to hang out with their friends on the weekend and maybe don't really have a passion yet or are allowed to change their mind if they do something for a year and then decide they don't like it.

And of course it makes sense! It almost made me feel better - the Ivies *should* be for the tippy top students. Why do we want our kids breaking their back to be perfect teenagers unless they truly are superstars? Schools like UVA are still great and doesn't mean you've failed at anything, it just means that you were a normal teenager and they understand and even encourage this. Does anyone else feel the same way?

This feels obvious and out of touch. Most people would be over the moon for UVA…..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In many cases, parents have bulldozed the "achievements" of the successful applicants to the Ivies. There are very few kids who actually start their own non-profits/businesses on their own, like that.

Yup my friend's daughter just got admitted to a bunch of Ivies and the focus of her application (according to her mom) was a non profit the daughter started that was very similar to a non profit the mom had started years earlier while living in another city.

The most annoying thing I was that I got a text (with a screenshot of the acceptance) for each school the kid got into, along with a message saying "oh no! Larla's decision about where to go is now going to be even harder!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In many cases, parents have bulldozed the "achievements" of the successful applicants to the Ivies. There are very few kids who actually start their own non-profits/businesses on their own, like that.

Yup my friend's daughter just got admitted to a bunch of Ivies and the focus of her application (according to her mom) was a non profit the daughter started that was very similar to a non profit the mom had started years earlier while living in another city.

The most annoying thing I was that I got a text (with a screenshot of the acceptance) for each school the kid got into, along with a message saying "oh no! Larla's decision about where to go is now going to be even harder!"

So I get that you are bitter and agree what the mom did was distasteful.

You know that transcript and recommendations are vastly more important in admissions, right? So she had the grades and recommendations also, which means she was a top performer and people liked her, right? So we can agree the non-profit had minimal impact.

Now, let's talk about the non-profit (I assume you meant charity). It was similar to one mom started. So what? It's bad that mom inspired her? Did she do the work? Was it successful and admirable? If so, what is the problem, exactly?

I know you don't think it, but you really need let go of the gossip and bitterness. You'll be happier.

And I will repeat the mom sending out notices like that was in poor taste.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That probably makes sense. HYPSM are in a class by themselves.

Or your weird fascination with acronyms on this forum. I graduated from one of them, lived abroad and most people have only ever heard of Harvard, Stanford, or MIT. Yale, to a lesser extent, when you're talking about politics, and Princeton did not give off the "wow" effect as much as it does in the US. Berkeley seems to be more well-regarded overseas and is often seen as a top school in the US despite it being ranked low. Columbia is also quite popular, especially in Asia-Pacific.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:HYPSM are universally recognized as the T5. There is not much debate about that. They all have sizable endowment that others can't match. They are the only elite institutions that offer non-binding early actions while everyone else employs ED. In spite of that, their yield rate is consistently high.

Maybe true for undergrad. Except Harvard, Stanford, MIT, a lot of their Y/P's grad programs are not even T5 and world-wide rankings put them in the teens. Get a grip on reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That probably makes sense. HYPSM are in a class by themselves.

Or your weird fascination with acronyms on this forum. I graduated from one of them, lived abroad and most people have only ever heard of Harvard, Stanford, or MIT. Yale, to a lesser extent, when you're talking about politics, and Princeton did not give off the "wow" effect as much as it does in the US. Berkeley seems to be more well-regarded overseas and is often seen as a top school in the US despite it being ranked low. Columbia is also quite popular, especially in Asia-Pacific.

Columbia is universally regarded as a mid-tier Ivy at best even in Asia. It's always been HYP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That probably makes sense. HYPSM are in a class by themselves.

Or your weird fascination with acronyms on this forum. I graduated from one of them, lived abroad and most people have only ever heard of Harvard, Stanford, or MIT. Yale, to a lesser extent, when you're talking about politics, and Princeton did not give off the "wow" effect as much as it does in the US. Berkeley seems to be more well-regarded overseas and is often seen as a top school in the US despite it being ranked low. Columbia is also quite popular, especially in Asia-Pacific.

Columbia is universally regarded as a mid-tier Ivy at best even in Asia. It's always been HYP

“Mid-tier Ivy”. So ridiculous, in so many ways. You should stop saying that, and things like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The title of this thread is, “Ivies vs Top 20 schools.”

What’s does UVA have to do with it? It’s not even a top 25 school.

This comment didn’t age well…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Agreed. And the 15 schools listed above (Ivy + non-Ivy) are indisputably the top 15 in this country. Impressive list.

Well, US News would dispute that. Latest rankings place Cornell outside of the top 15, and Vanderbilt and Wash U tied with Brown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The thread only provides further evidence of how Ivy-obsessed many of you are, even when it manifests itself as resentment or envy. If you don’t think the Ivies are all that, pay less attention to them. State universities have a different mission.

I went to an Ivy, and my kids went to "lesser" colleges (utterly sneered at as "safeties" on this board). They are doing extremely well, despite attending low-ranked colleges. I'd say my kids are doing much better than I ever did with my highly respected degree.

The idiotic emphasis on Ivy League, top tier schools on this board reflects the type of people on this board, that's it.

The most successful adults I know went to state universities. My classmates from HYPSM are not all successful. A Harvard grad is working as a special needs teacher, as is another friend who graduated from Yale. Another Harvard grad is working as a librarian. A third Harvard grad is struggling to start his own business, which was basically killed by the pandemic. OTOH, a few are living in penthouses in Manhattan raking in unthinkable (to me) riches. A few retired in their 30s on their tech money. I'm one of the unsuccessful ones who quit to raise kids.

Looking back, I'm sorry I went to an elite Ivy. I think it held me back because I was so proud of my achievement. I'm smarter now than I was at 18 and thought "prestige" meant anything. It doesn't. It may help you now and then, and might open a door or two early in your career, but for the "average" HYPSM grad, the degree is nothing more than a diploma you stuff in your closet and forget about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In many cases, parents have bulldozed the "achievements" of the successful applicants to the Ivies. There are very few kids who actually start their own non-profits/businesses on their own, like that.

My dad actually did build a substantial business when he was in high school. But no way did he have perfect grades or a long list of international awards. It’s hard to believe that many real teen entrepreneurs are pliant enough to have great grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agreed. And the 15 schools listed above (Ivy + non-Ivy) are indisputably the top 15 in this country. Impressive list.

Well, US News would dispute that. Latest rankings place Cornell outside of the top 15, and Vanderbilt and Wash U tied with Brown.

And the value of US News' rankings is....???

You know US News makes a lot of money from their rankings, right? It's a business, not a not-for-profit organization evaluating colleges using an impartial standard?

And it's really, really dumb.