Why are most teachers too scared to return to in person teaching, but most parents want schools open

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol you think parents are upset now just wait til they do come up with a COVID-19 vaccine and 1/3rd of parents are stubborn defiant anti-vaccinators.
Cannot wait to see the fireworks when those parents get told they can’t send their kid to school unless they get a shot.

The anti-vaxxers can keep homeschooling for all I care. Everyone else back in the classroom!

For what it's worth, I have always thought the anti-vaxers were not only ignorant, but spreading dangerous misinformation, so I'm very very pro-vaccine. However, I am very wary of whatever first variation covid vaccine they come out with in terms of its efficacy and safety. There is just way too much political and public pressure and financial incentive to come out with something quickly. And the drug companies have forced to governments to waive any liabilities regarding the vaccines they put out, and instead, they are recommending to the governments to provide their own public fund to draw from for lawsuits.

I am super pro-vaccine as well and I think this is a reasonable point. That's why I don't get so worked up with they do those surveys and something like 1/3 of Americans say they wouldn't get the vaccine when it's available. I think some portion of that group are people who normally get vaccines and trust them, but is wary of a brand new vaccine for a brand new virus that was rushed to market. I think once the vaccine is provided to first responders and we don't see negative outcomes, a lot of people who are currently wary of the vaccine will be willing to to get it.

It's like this with everything Covid-related. People interpret everything as having two sides that line up perfectly with political positions. So many people assume there is a group of people who are Pro-Trump, anti-mask, anti-vaccine, pro-school-opening. pro-business-opening, anti-teachers-union, anti-China, anti-WHO. anti-science, and then another group that is anti-Trump, pro-mask, pro-vaccine, anti-school-opening, anti-business-opening, pro-teachers-union, pro-China, pro-WHO, pro-science.

That's not how this works. There are plenty of people who hate Trump but think requiring masks outside is overkill. There are lots of people who are pro-science and believe the science shows that school opening is feasible. Most of these issues are not even political, but practical. When we try to break everything down on a left-right continuum, we miss a lot of important information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol you think parents are upset now just wait til they do come up with a COVID-19 vaccine and 1/3rd of parents are stubborn defiant anti-vaccinators.
Cannot wait to see the fireworks when those parents get told they can’t send their kid to school unless they get a shot.

That's not going to happen. Flu vaccines are not required. There is no way they are going to require this new vaccine. It will be challenging enough to get the vaccine distributed to those who proactively want it.

My uncle is in a nursing home that requires the flu shot for all workers.

[Anonymous]

Liberal here very much so. My entire circle of friends is pretty much liberal with the exception of a few. All of us think it is safe for schools to open with appropriate PPE. This is not a political thing it is a science thing for us. Science shows masks work. most of the kids that I know if not all wear masks routinely when going about their daily lives to doctors dentists Parks, grocery stores. this is not rocket science and I truly believe teachers and administrators can figure this out if they wanted to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Liberal here very much so. My entire circle of friends is pretty much liberal with the exception of a few. All of us think it is safe for schools to open with appropriate PPE. This is not a political thing it is a science thing for us. Science shows masks work. most of the kids that I know if not all wear masks routinely when going about their daily lives to doctors dentists Parks, grocery stores. this is not rocket science and I truly believe teachers and administrators can figure this out if they wanted to.

So it’s strictly a science thing, huh?
You don’t think it’s simultaneously a planning and schematics thing or a personnel and safety thing or a budget and materials thing or an class environment and area infection rate thing or an administrative and school board thing or a city or district or county or state thing...it’s all simple science and none of those other entities and/or factors have any significance into how this should be played out?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I will very happily go back to school, but not until: (1) there is a vaccine that's proven 100% effective, (2) zero new infections for at least 36 months anywhere in the US, and (3) everyone has been vaccinated, including every last anti-vaxxer and homesteader in Alaska.

There is no vaccine that is 100% effective for any disease.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol you think parents are upset now just wait til they do come up with a COVID-19 vaccine and 1/3rd of parents are stubborn defiant anti-vaccinators.
Cannot wait to see the fireworks when those parents get told they can’t send their kid to school unless they get a shot.

That's not going to happen. Flu vaccines are not required. There is no way they are going to require this new vaccine. It will be challenging enough to get the vaccine distributed to those who proactively want it.

My uncle is in a nursing home that requires the flu shot for all workers.

And I am a vet and am required to have a rabies shot. What's your point?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I will very happily go back to school, but not until: (1) there is a vaccine that's proven 100% effective, (2) zero new infections for at least 36 months anywhere in the US, and (3) everyone has been vaccinated, including every last anti-vaxxer and homesteader in Alaska.

There is no vaccine that is 100% effective for any disease.

I'm assuming Mr. 100% PP was being facetious. Either that or dense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

I'm the PP, and I agree 100% that this is a decision that should be made on a state or national level. But I don't think that the criteria should allow people into classrooms where there's a 74% chance. That number is just too high.

Right now, the level of virus in the community is an enormous roadblock. We know what society needs to do to bring the levels down, we know because we have lots of role models of countries that have done it. Yes, there are things that schools can do to reduce spread in the building. Some of those things are possible right now, and some aren't, given the way that American public schools are structured and resourced. But those things need to be an addition to low virus levels, not a replacement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

Are you insinuating that this pandemic has inadvertently exposed the elephant in the room with regard to the gross inequalities that exist in resources and capability throughout our education system with regard to income and perhaps even subconsciously or surreptitiously with regard to race?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

I'm the PP, and I agree 100% that this is a decision that should be made on a state or national level. But I don't think that the criteria should allow people into classrooms where there's a 74% chance. That number is just too high.

Right now, the level of virus in the community is an enormous roadblock. We know what society needs to do to bring the levels down, we know because we have lots of role models of countries that have done it. Yes, there are things that schools can do to reduce spread in the building. Some of those things are possible right now, and some aren't, given the way that American public schools are structured and resourced. But those things need to be an addition to low virus levels, not a replacement.

What is this 74% chance number? Our PA county has given the 5% positivity rate as a guideline, which is a metric supported by most research organizations to indicate that the virus is under good control. I also lived in MD, and I know the local numbers are climbing - so they do have to watch those numbers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

Are you insinuating that this pandemic has inadvertently exposed the elephant in the room with regard to the gross inequalities that exist in resources and capability throughout our education system with regard to income and perhaps even subconsciously or surreptitiously with regard to race?

Oh, I thought everyone knew that already. Was it a secret?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

Are you insinuating that this pandemic has inadvertently exposed the elephant in the room with regard to the gross inequalities that exist in resources and capability throughout our education system with regard to income and perhaps even subconsciously or surreptitiously with regard to race?

Oh, I thought everyone knew that already. Was it a secret?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You guys,
My boss expects me to drive to work. I don't want to die. What should I do? I don't want to die. It is not like I can take safety precautions like driving the speed limit, not driving distracted, wearing a seatbelt.

You see the rate of traffic fatalities. He is such a jerk expecting me to do the job I get paid to do.

I'm honestly starting to think that this is something we will start to hear. That it's unfair for employees to risk their lives driving to work. After all look at how many thousands of people die in year in car accidents? How is it fair to expect employees to RISK THEIR LIVES driving to work?

In an average 6 month period, car accidents kill 16K Americans. During the same time period, COVID has killed 10 times that many people. During the same time period, COVID has killed more than twice as many working age Americans (18 to 65 year olds) as car accidents generally do.

And yet we accept, without argument, all sorts of rules to make driving safer for everyone. For example, my life would be much easier if my 10 year old could drive himself places. He could run errands, take himself to soccer, etc . . . . But we have a society have decided that it's not safe to allow 10 year olds to drive. If I demanded the right to let him do so anyway, in the name of personal freedom, my neighbors would be calling the police the second they saw him get behind the wheel.

Why are restrictions and modifications that protect us from COVID, people are up in arms. Why is the state allowed to make rules about my 10 year old driving, and not about where my 10 year old spends his days? Why do people think my state should be allowed to require me to have insurance, but not to require me to have a mask? What is the difference?

Should none of us drive until traffic fatalities are in 0? Asking for a teacher friend who says they won't go back to work until there are no more covud cases

I think that there are some teachers who follow the "shoot for the stars, and at least you'll end up over the moon" philosophy with the virus. I don't think that 0 COVID cases is reasonable. On the other hand, if you look at the website that GA Tech has put out that calculates virus risk based on the county and group sizes, there's a 74% chance that a gathering of 100 in Montgomery County will have at least one person with COVID. As a high school teacher, even with the proposed shifts for hybrid, that means that there's more than a 74% chance that I'd be exposed in the first week of school, and by exposed I mean prolonged indoor contact, something we know is risky. Before someone argues that "children don't spread", I'll point out that my 17 and 18 year old students are biologically adults, and that we know from data at college sports, and boot camp, and other settings that 18 year olds spread the virus very well.

I think that the reasonable point for return to school is somewhere between a 74% chance of exposure to something that could kill my high risk family members, and a 0 % chance.

Having said that, there are countries that got the virus down to 0 identified cases before reopening schools. Kids in New Zealand, for example, can go to school worry free. So, it's not like 0 is an impossible goal. But I think the chances of that happening in the US have dropped to zero.

I don't think we should be following any single school superintendant's or teacher's comfort level in terms of criteria and metrics for reopening schools. These should be set by the county or state and followed.

The real roadblock is the lack of alignment and lack of will by the school administration for the more affluent school districts. And for the poorer school districts, it is primarily the lack of infrastructure and resources to open in an acceptably low-risk manner.

I'm the PP, and I agree 100% that this is a decision that should be made on a state or national level. But I don't think that the criteria should allow people into classrooms where there's a 74% chance. That number is just too high.

Right now, the level of virus in the community is an enormous roadblock. We know what society needs to do to bring the levels down, we know because we have lots of role models of countries that have done it. Yes, there are things that schools can do to reduce spread in the building. Some of those things are possible right now, and some aren't, given the way that American public schools are structured and resourced. But those things need to be an addition to low virus levels, not a replacement.

What is this 74% chance number? Our PA county has given the 5% positivity rate as a guideline, which is a metric supported by most research organizations to indicate that the virus is under good control. I also lived in MD, and I know the local numbers are climbing - so they do have to watch those numbers.

Georgia Tech has put out a website where you can set a group size and it calculates the risk of having someone in that group having covid for each county in the US. The group sizes are multiple choice, so I chose 100, the number that comes closest to my teaching load as a High School teacher. In reality my teaching load would be a little higher than that, but it's much closer to 100 than 500 which was the next option.

You can see the tool here. https://covid19risk.biosci.gatech.edu/

If you put in a group size of 100, and Montgomery County, MD, you can see that there's an estimated 74% chance that at least one person in that group would have COVID. For a high school student, with a hybrid model, the numbers would be slightly lower, since they'd be exposed to only 1/2 the students in each class. If you're in a different county, or have a kid in elementary school you could look that up as well.