Hollywood praising Tonya Harding

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

They hated her for all of those things before she chose to fight dirty. And that made hating her after much easier and more satisfying. She fought dirty because the country and her life had told her that the only person looking out for her was herself. And while what she did was wrong, she was right about that. No one was on Tonya's side except Tonya even BEFORE this happened.

You ask who she was representing at the Olympics and that shows a fundamental misunderstanding of people in her position. She was absolutely representing herself, her only chance. That gold medal wasn't for honor/glory, it was going to be freedom.

And once again I never said sympathy, I said empathy. They aren't the same thing.

What? The country has made her twice national champion. World medalist. Olympic medalist (which 4th place is considered to be). Do you realize how much free stuff, how many breaks, how many resources she has received from USFSA at that point? You think anyone makes it to these heights straight outta trailer park without massive infusion of support?

Stop with the sob story. Learn the facts.

You keep calling Harding an Olympic medalist. Your stupid is showing. They don’t give pewter medals to 4th place at the Olympics.

It is customary to refer to the 4th place finisher as a pewter medalist. It's tradition.

Nationals yes. Worlds sometimes. Olympics no.

You.are.wrong. (And ridiculous for calling Tonya Harding an Olympic medalist.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

I admitted my word usage was bad but that is not a disparagement in any interpretation!

This is what you said, assuming it was you:

"Tonya grew up abused and her only ticket out was skating. If you back an abused dog into a corner they are going to lash out when they try to escape. I think the whole thing also showed how insanely classist figure skating was (is?). Tonya was 'athletic' and not 'graceful'. She didn't have the prettiest costumes because she couldn't afford them, she didn't have the grace of a girl raised in a wealthy family in new england. Those things were not her fault but resulted in the whole skating industry/country rooting for Nancy because she was prettier and more graceful and more what people wanted their daughters to be. "

And it is wildly, wildly untrue. By the time of the attack, Tonya wasn't an "abused dog", and she wasn't "in the corner". She was a decorated athlete who could have become even better with good work ethic. She received ample financial help. Kerrigan didn't come from a wildly different class, her family is blue collar and her parents sacrificed greatly for her training. Her coaches transformed her look completely before the Olympics, the teeth, the hair, everything. Tonya could have the same if she listened. Tonya wasn't graceful because she didn't care to be, it wasn't because big bad boys flew down and stole her grace. She didn't have grace because she didn't see it as a value. The country rooted for Nancy because who in their right mind would want a daughter like Tonya? It was utterly within Tonya's power to act with grace. She chose not to.

Incidentally, her costume at the Olympics came free from USFSA because they were afraid Tonya would give another boob show.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

And it absolutely was a classist issue in the media. Trailer park abusive parents poor as dirt is absolutely a different class than blue collar working middle class happy family. It's not Warren Buffett and then everyone else, there are a lot of brackets.

Nancy was rude and disrespectful to coaches/ staff BEFORE this incident. Tonya acted like a spoiled brat sometimes BEFORE this incident. Nancy became America's sweetheart. Why? Because working middle class is not the same as growing up with one abusive parent in a trailer park and you could see the difference every time they were on television.

People escape much worse. Certainly in skating Tonya was around enough class to have it rubbed off if she wanted to.

Kerrigan became America's sweetheart because she skated well and because she didn't arrange to maim anyone. For all her faults. All Tonya had to do was show up at the rink and practice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

I admitted my word usage was bad but that is not a disparagement in any interpretation!

This is what you said, assuming it was you:

"Tonya grew up abused and her only ticket out was skating. If you back an abused dog into a corner they are going to lash out when they try to escape. I think the whole thing also showed how insanely classist figure skating was (is?). Tonya was 'athletic' and not 'graceful'. She didn't have the prettiest costumes because she couldn't afford them, she didn't have the grace of a girl raised in a wealthy family in new england. Those things were not her fault but resulted in the whole skating industry/country rooting for Nancy because she was prettier and more graceful and more what people wanted their daughters to be. "

And it is wildly, wildly untrue. By the time of the attack, Tonya wasn't an "abused dog", and she wasn't "in the corner". She was a decorated athlete who could have become even better with good work ethic. She received ample financial help. Kerrigan didn't come from a wildly different class, her family is blue collar and her parents sacrificed greatly for her training. Her coaches transformed her look completely before the Olympics, the teeth, the hair, everything. Tonya could have the same if she listened. Tonya wasn't graceful because she didn't care to be, it wasn't because big bad boys flew down and stole her grace. She didn't have grace because she didn't see it as a value. The country rooted for Nancy because who in their right mind would want a daughter like Tonya? It was utterly within Tonya's power to act with grace. She chose not to.

Incidentally, her costume at the Olympics came free from USFSA because they were afraid Tonya would give another boob show.

Listen dude you are all over the place. What we are discussing in the pps you quote is whether or not I disparaged or spoke poorly of Nancy Kerrigan. Nothing in the post you just quoted, which is mine, puts any qualitative judgement positive or negative on Nancy. Calling her wealthy was a poor choice of words but still not an insult in any way shape or form.

The fact that you think Tonya could just 'choose' to be classy and graceful shows you don't really understand how different her upbringing was from Nancy's. And pointing that out ISN'T AN INSULT to Nancy. Your posts are making me more convinced of my position frankly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

I admitted my word usage was bad but that is not a disparagement in any interpretation!

But you used that word, without knowing the facts because a "graceful girl raised in a wealthy New England family" has a much better ring than "a bucktoothed welder's daughter from Stoneham, Mass."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Listen dude you are all over the place. What we are discussing in the pps you quote is whether or not I disparaged or spoke poorly of Nancy Kerrigan. Nothing in the post you just quoted, which is mine, puts any qualitative judgement positive or negative on Nancy. Calling her wealthy was a poor choice of words but still not an insult in any way shape or form.

The fact that you think Tonya could just 'choose' to be classy and graceful shows you don't really understand how different her upbringing was from Nancy's. And pointing that out ISN'T AN INSULT to Nancy. Your posts are making me more convinced of my position frankly.

I didn't say you disparaged Kerrigan. I said you misrepresented her situation because it served your story better.

Of course Tonya could choose to be a more graceful skater. There was enough free stuff coming her way if she wanted to take ballet classes or work on skating skills, not jumps. You don't think people are just born skating gracefully, do you.

Off ice, yes. She could choose to not lie, make excuses, and certainly she could choose not to have her rival maimed. Especially as it was wildly unnecessary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Listen dude you are all over the place. What we are discussing in the pps you quote is whether or not I disparaged or spoke poorly of Nancy Kerrigan. Nothing in the post you just quoted, which is mine, puts any qualitative judgement positive or negative on Nancy. Calling her wealthy was a poor choice of words but still not an insult in any way shape or form.

The fact that you think Tonya could just 'choose' to be classy and graceful shows you don't really understand how different her upbringing was from Nancy's. And pointing that out ISN'T AN INSULT to Nancy. Your posts are making me more convinced of my position frankly.

I didn't say you disparaged Kerrigan. I said you misrepresented her situation because it served your story better.

Of course Tonya could choose to be a more graceful skater. There was enough free stuff coming her way if she wanted to take ballet classes or work on skating skills, not jumps. You don't think people are just born skating gracefully, do you.

Off ice, yes. She could choose to not lie, make excuses, and certainly she could choose not to have her rival maimed. Especially as it was wildly unnecessary.

Try to misrepresent yourself by not allowing your own post in the quotes?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

The bolded is an accusation of disparagement without using the word. You're not entitled to your own facts either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

I admitted my word usage was bad but that is not a disparagement in any interpretation!

But you used that word, without knowing the facts because a "graceful girl raised in a wealthy New England family" has a much better ring than "a bucktoothed welder's daughter from Stoneham, Mass."

And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

I don't agree with that. You are free to disagree. Tons of rich women marry multiple times and beat their daughters for not being perfect.

Incidentally, trailer park mothers don't usually enroll their children in skating lessons. It's not really a trailer park thing. Who knows where Tonya would be if her mother didn't beat her for not being perfect. Maybe she didn't beat her enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

I don't agree with that. You are free to disagree. Tons of rich women marry multiple times and beat their daughters for not being perfect.

Incidentally, trailer park mothers don't usually enroll their children in skating lessons. It's not really a trailer park thing. Who knows where Tonya would be if her mother didn't beat her for not being perfect. Maybe she didn't beat her enough.

Yeah well that part really isn't an opinion, it's statistics. Google "cycle of poverty'

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

I don't agree with that. You are free to disagree. Tons of rich women marry multiple times and beat their daughters for not being perfect.

Incidentally, trailer park mothers don't usually enroll their children in skating lessons. It's not really a trailer park thing. Who knows where Tonya would be if her mother didn't beat her for not being perfect. Maybe she didn't beat her enough.

Yeah well that part really isn't an opinion, it's statistics. Google "cycle of poverty'

And holy hell I responded before I read your second paragraph. Nevermind you're not worth talking to if that's your take, I'm out. Endorsing child abuse is arguably as bad as what Tonya did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe try “stable”?

That would be more accurate but less hateable than a pretty ice princess from a "wealthy New England family".

None of my posts disparaged Nancy. Sorry that doesn't fit into the box you want to put me in.

You said she came from a wealthy New England family. That's a lie. You portrayed her as Tonya's rival in a classist war. That's a lie. Who wants to put people in boxes now?

I admitted my word usage was bad but that is not a disparagement in any interpretation!

But you used that word, without knowing the facts because a "graceful girl raised in a wealthy New England family" has a much better ring than "a bucktoothed welder's daughter from Stoneham, Mass."

And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Now you're misrepresenting things to paint a picture of privilege where none existed. Try this:

"My mom is blind. My dad is a welder. He works three jobs to pay for my skating. My parents remortgaged our house to fund my training. I get up at 4 am to practice every day.

And then some piece of trailer trash hits me on the kneecap."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

I don't agree with that. You are free to disagree. Tons of rich women marry multiple times and beat their daughters for not being perfect.

Incidentally, trailer park mothers don't usually enroll their children in skating lessons. It's not really a trailer park thing. Who knows where Tonya would be if her mother didn't beat her for not being perfect. Maybe she didn't beat her enough.

Yeah well that part really isn't an opinion, it's statistics. Google "cycle of poverty'

Maybe you should find statistics on the percentage of trailer trash mothers who enroll their daughters in ice skating lessons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
And you're intentionally drumming up the poor Nancy story, less realistic than the rich Nancy story when the entire purpose is to compare their lives. Nancy's childhood had more in common with a wealthy girl's childhood than it did with Tonya's.

"I had a bucktooth'

'My mom just married her 5th husband and called me a fat pig and beat me with a hairbrush for not being perfect today'

Come on.

Of course Tonya COULD have chosen to be perfect. But my entire point is that most people that start out the way Tonya does don't have the fortitude to pull themselves into a different classier world. She did a terrible thing, she came from a terrible place. Those things aren't unrelated and we have a better chance at preventing future Tonya's by acknowledging that most people can't fix themselves after a start like that

I don't agree with that. You are free to disagree. Tons of rich women marry multiple times and beat their daughters for not being perfect.

Incidentally, trailer park mothers don't usually enroll their children in skating lessons. It's not really a trailer park thing. Who knows where Tonya would be if her mother didn't beat her for not being perfect. Maybe she didn't beat her enough.

Yeah well that part really isn't an opinion, it's statistics. Google "cycle of poverty'

Maybe you should find statistics on the percentage of trailer trash mothers who enroll their daughters in ice skating lessons.

NP just looking for clarification. Is it your position then that Tonya's mother couldn't have been abusive because she paid for skating lessons?

[Anonymous]

Trailer park trash loves other trailer park trash. What is so shocking? It just shows how many trailer park trash there are in the U.S.