s/o New understanding of Harry & Meghan

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have always believed them. The clash between M and K seemed to be cultural and I think they both made mistakes in that regard. I also think M had a hard time taking royalty seriously as so many Americans do and that was a mistake. But I don’t for a second doubt the ugliness that they each went though both growing up a spare in that family and when they were married. The BRF seems seriously dysfunctional and the trolls who hate on them are disgusting and cruel. I don’t blame them one bit for getting out.

When she talks about not being taught to curtsy or any of the protocol, despite that she was American and clearly didn’t know it, it’s so clear they wanted her to look and feel powerless and crass. It was incredibly calculated by the firm. They wanted her to grovel and bend herself into knots to do things their way, with no help. But she wasn’t some 21 year British girl who’d be dreaming of this. She was rich and famous in her own right. So she knew there was another way to live.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think Harry deeply regrets his choices and misses his old life.

HAHAHA! What? You think he's watching this all go down and wishes he were stuck in the midst of it? No.

LOL right? Even Camilla, queen of mess, had to take a break from it all and went on vacation with her blood relatives.

How dare she? While her king is sick... LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Oprah interview made major damage to both of them.

Having his grandfather at his last days and doing this damaging interview causing extra anguish to his almost 90 year old grandmother, father, etc is something that will always stay with both of them.

There is no good way to explain that interview - he knew his grandfather is in bad condition and still did it, or he didn’t know, which means he’s totally clueless if he didn’t know his own grandfather is dying. The fact that a dying grandfather did not seem a priority consideration to either of them is telling.

DP. But I think this goes to the different standards people are held to. Kate gets thrown under the bus by William while allegedly recovering from major surgery and it’s business as usual. Harry gets his ass beat by William and it’s nbd but H&M get years of criticism for doing an interview while a nonagenarian was sick? What’s the difference other than William was born first?

The difference is hierarchy, even within a tiny family. It is a sickness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have always believed them. The clash between M and K seemed to be cultural and I think they both made mistakes in that regard. I also think M had a hard time taking royalty seriously as so many Americans do and that was a mistake. But I don’t for a second doubt the ugliness that they each went though both growing up a spare in that family and when they were married. The BRF seems seriously dysfunctional and the trolls who hate on them are disgusting and cruel. I don’t blame them one bit for getting out.

When she talks about not being taught to curtsy or any of the protocol, despite that she was American and clearly didn’t know it, it’s so clear they wanted her to look and feel powerless and crass. It was incredibly calculated by the firm. They wanted her to grovel and bend herself into knots to do things their way, with no help. But she wasn’t some 21 year British girl who’d be dreaming of this. She was rich and famous in her own right. So she knew there was another way to live.

Exactly. That was SO cruel. I can’t imagine how scary it must have been to realize your new “family” was happy to set you up to fail and be so horribly unwelcoming. Then to get dragged through the mud online and all the awful racist comments. The BRF is a mess. Trash wrapped up in fake civility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have always believed them. The clash between M and K seemed to be cultural and I think they both made mistakes in that regard. I also think M had a hard time taking royalty seriously as so many Americans do and that was a mistake. But I don’t for a second doubt the ugliness that they each went though both growing up a spare in that family and when they were married. The BRF seems seriously dysfunctional and the trolls who hate on them are disgusting and cruel. I don’t blame them one bit for getting out.

When she talks about not being taught to curtsy or any of the protocol, despite that she was American and clearly didn’t know it, it’s so clear they wanted her to look and feel powerless and crass. It was incredibly calculated by the firm. They wanted her to grovel and bend herself into knots to do things their way, with no help. But she wasn’t some 21 year British girl who’d be dreaming of this. She was rich and famous in her own right. So she knew there was another way to live.

Sophie was offered up to be a mentor of sorts to Meghan, and meghan brushed it off.

I think the person who said that Meghan had delusions of grandeur hit the nail on the head. Meghan thought her charm and good looks would be enough. It's not surprising she thought that, because that's how it works in Hollywood. But the monarchy is a whole different kettle of fish. Everyone in the royal family seemed to see it coming except for H & M.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I seldom comment on the BRF threads. But there is an important point a lot of people missed about that Oprah interview. M&H implied (and in fact basically got Oprah to say) that the reason their kids did not have prince and princess titles was racism because Meghan is biracial. This was a flat out lie and they knew it. The reason is to do with a pre-existing regulation whereby only grandchildren of the sitting monarch have prince & princess titles. The children of Beatrice and Eugenie, Prince Andrew’s grandchildren, lacked royal titles for the exact same reason. And indeed, when Charles ascended that generation received their titles and they knew all along they would.

This was race baiting of the lowest and most despicable order and they deserve to be shunned for it.

Meghan also said that the kids would not get security for this reason, and claimed that she wrote to the powers that be to beg for security not for herself but for her husband.

She lied and lied. Then she built additional lies on top of the first ones. I doubt she’ll return to the UK because she and her husband seem permanently loathed - whatever people think about monarchy or William or Kate specifically.

Why would she want to go back to a country that likes a pedophile more than a mixed race woman?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My complaint with Meghan is not that she was lying, it's that she knew what she was getting into, so stfu. It's like going to a music festival and then issuing a press release complaining that all the loud music and drinking made it hard for you to sleep.

The royal family is very well known to be bonkers, co trolling and grossly unfair to second sons.

I think her main complaint is that they didn't change ON HER BEHALF. which duh, of course they won't.

I don’t think she expected the racism attack that she received nor the lack of support of the BRF press. And on top of that, no security detail for her or her children.

Who, what, when, where, why? Surely there is abundant proof of hundreds of incidents to support all of this.

You are either a liar or twisting history. Yes, there were tons of documented cases in news back then. If you want to know now, you only need to do a simple google. Here is the first hit --

https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/former-british-police-officers-admit-sending-racist-messages-about-meghan-markle-1.6551564

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I tend to believe most if not all of what H&M said about the RF; I also think they are codependent, damaged people from dysfunctional families who leave all manner of estrangement (family, friends, colleagues / business partners) in their wake.

All of these people are a mess.

I agree, and we all know that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I seldom comment on the BRF threads. But there is an important point a lot of people missed about that Oprah interview. M&H implied (and in fact basically got Oprah to say) that the reason their kids did not have prince and princess titles was racism because Meghan is biracial. This was a flat out lie and they knew it. The reason is to do with a pre-existing regulation whereby only grandchildren of the sitting monarch have prince & princess titles. The children of Beatrice and Eugenie, Prince Andrew’s grandchildren, lacked royal titles for the exact same reason. And indeed, when Charles ascended that generation received their titles and they knew all along they would.

This was race baiting of the lowest and most despicable order and they deserve to be shunned for it.

You misunderstand. WHEN CHARLES TOOK THE THRONE, Archie is entitled to be a prince as the grandchild of the sitting monarch. But

The Sussexes indicated in the interview that they had expected Archie would be given the title of prince after Charles acceded the throne, but that they had been told that protocols would be changed - in line with Charles’s wish for a slimmed down monarchy - so that Archie would be excluded from becoming an HRH and prince.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/mar/08/why-meghan-harry-son-archie-denied-title-prince-mixed-race

They DID change the rules so that Harry's kids wouldn't be HRH Prince/Princess

No, they said nothing of the kind in the interview. And their kids are prince/princess now, not excluded at all, which was always going to be the case.

Regardless of the title, BRF didn’t want to give them security.

The family had security. When they asked for a separate security detail for the baby (Archie), they were told No. Because the baby already had security - the same security is Harry and Meghan.

This is a lie. Please provide source.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I seldom comment on the BRF threads. But there is an important point a lot of people missed about that Oprah interview. M&H implied (and in fact basically got Oprah to say) that the reason their kids did not have prince and princess titles was racism because Meghan is biracial. This was a flat out lie and they knew it. The reason is to do with a pre-existing regulation whereby only grandchildren of the sitting monarch have prince & princess titles. The children of Beatrice and Eugenie, Prince Andrew’s grandchildren, lacked royal titles for the exact same reason. And indeed, when Charles ascended that generation received their titles and they knew all along they would.

This was race baiting of the lowest and most despicable order and they deserve to be shunned for it.

Andrew’s child have the Princess title.

“Her middle names are Elizabeth and Mary, making her full name Princess Beatrice Elizabeth Mary of York, which appears on her birth certificate.”

They have them now. They didn’t have them then. Not sure what your source is. H&M’s kids also have them now. The rule comes from the Letters Patent which long predates H&M.

Andrew’s daughters had princess titles because they were the children of the SON of the monarch (QEll). William and Harry, similarly, had Prince titles. Edward’s children had the titles, but their parents chose not to use them. Supposedly Louise has continued to not use the title that she is entitled to use by birth, and her brother can decide how to style his title when he turns 18.

Anne’s children do not have Prince/Prince titles— because she is the daughter of the monarch rather then a son. They don’t have other titles because she and her first husband declined to accept a title for him when they married.

Harry’s children became Prince /Princess when QEll died — and Charles became the monarch. Funny that the BRF published updated titles almost immediately for other members of the family. The BRF didn’t do the same for the Sussex kids for quite some time — changing them only after Lili was christened and the Sussexes publicly used their titles. So one might question why their titles weren’t changed immediately on official palace publications when others were.

Because the firm is petty LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This comparison of headlines about Meghan v. Kate was my first introduction to Meghan's struggles in the UK, so I was always sort of "on her side" (until the weird non-abdication).

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ellievhall/meghan-markle-kate-middleton-double-standards-royal

Nah. The press was awful to Kate for many many years. They took and published shots of her sunbathing topless on vacation, published shots of her skirt flying up exposing her bum, delved into every single aspect of her and her family’s life. She wasn’t spared.

Exactly. So why tolerate the same/worse attack on another woman after all Kate had gone through?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The difference is that Kate has paid her dues with more than ten years of flawless service while Meghan did nothing but complain and showboat for the instant she set foot in the Brad and bailed less than two years after joining then cashed in on her association with a family and institution she claimed to despise.

Kate paid her due to the British snobbish sexist pigs. Why is that a good thing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This comparison of headlines about Meghan v. Kate was my first introduction to Meghan's struggles in the UK, so I was always sort of "on her side" (until the weird non-abdication).

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ellievhall/meghan-markle-kate-middleton-double-standards-royal

Nah. The press was awful to Kate for many many years. They took and published shots of her sunbathing topless on vacation, published shots of her skirt flying up exposing her bum, delved into every single aspect of her and her family’s life. She wasn’t spared.

That wasn't "the press" that was a french tabloid. British tabloids would never have done that. And if you can find me articles scrutinizing her everyday life choices like how the produce she buys is bad for the environment and where she puts her hands whens he walks makes her look stuck-up, I'll believe that Kate wasn't spared either. But I have not seen articles like that.

When people refer to the press’s treatment they are talking about tabloids not the freaking Wall Street Journal/Financial Times.

British tabloids are the scum of the earth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, I think there are multiple sides. I think Harry is a nice guy, intends to be a good person, rather naive, damaged childhood, was living a weird life where he wasn’t really allowed to have a purpose as the “spare” falls in love with Meghan who I think has some delusions of grandeur, although also trying to be a nice person and is one of those people that kind of invite drama. She could have seen the sh$tshow that is the BRF from a mile away but she proceeded anyway. And I have no doubt there was racism and all that and they are in a difficult spot with needing all the expensive security but I also think they think they are entitled to a very privilege life. It’s all basically exhibit A why the monarchy shouldn’t exist. It really didn’t do Harry any favors.

I think this is one of the best and most reasonable takes I’ve seen on here. But I would add that Meghan wouldn’t be the first person not to realize the extent of dysfunction in her spouse’s family until after they were married and let it all hang out. She didn’t have a lot of up close and personal experience with their backbiting staffs, etc until she was officially part of them.

I agree with all of this. I think, too, that Meghan was completely unprepared for the extent of both the blatant and the more subtle racism that she faced with constant media attacks. Quite a lot of what was said, published, tweeted about her wouldn’t be published in the US by mainstream sources— and it never let up. As Meghan herself said, she thought it would be “fair”. I’m not familiar enough with tabloid publications and British talk shows to know what Meghan “should” have expected, or perhaps should have been prepared by Harry / palace aides to expect. I do think that Meghan’s coverage was frequently horribly racist in ways that were likely genuinely unexpected and without precedent— and the place did nothing to attempt to contain it, and that too, was likely a shock for Meghan.

I am not really a William fan but I think he was right when he told Harry he needed to pump the brakes a little bit with his relationship with Meghan. I think everyone in the RF knew she would be ill-prepared for palace life. Had they dated longer it may not have been such a rough entry.

Why do you think the queen cared? She was a hard person.