Barbie movie 'iconic' monologue is BS

[Anonymous]

Maybe you haven’t explicitly felt this OP, but there are definitely still societal pressures put on women in the workplace.

Yes, and how is that different from pressures put on men in the workplace? The specifics of the typical demands can be different, but not the fact there is pressure.

Human experience is not perfect and can be rough going at times - that is not some great injustice against women specifically.

Nobody demands you 'to have it all'. If you're tying yourself into knots, trying to be liked, then stop doing that. As a rule, nobody gets a medal or a thank you for existing.

[Anonymous]

This latent feminism seems to be having a moment. Maybe it's a millennial thing - they're coming of age, going to college, and reacting to their psych and lit classes? Like the popularity of "Lessons in Chemistry" novel, which seemed sooooooo dated to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This latent feminism seems to be having a moment. Maybe it's a millennial thing - they're coming of age, going to college, and reacting to their psych and lit classes? Like the popularity of "Lessons in Chemistry" novel, which seemed sooooooo dated to me.

Millennials are 40somethings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe you haven’t explicitly felt this OP, but there are definitely still societal pressures put on women in the workplace.

Yes, and how is that different from pressures put on men in the workplace? The specifics of the typical demands can be different, but not the fact there is pressure.

Human experience is not perfect and can be rough going at times - that is not some great injustice against women specifically.

Nobody demands you 'to have it all'. If you're tying yourself into knots, trying to be liked, then stop doing that. As a rule, nobody gets a medal or a thank you for existing.

Really? If a man is demanding or even yells, others say he’s doing his job and has high standards.

If a women is the same she’s usually called names by others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Maybe you haven’t explicitly felt this OP, but there are definitely still societal pressures put on women in the workplace.

Yes, and how is that different from pressures put on men in the workplace? The specifics of the typical demands can be different, but not the fact there is pressure.

Human experience is not perfect and can be rough going at times - that is not some great injustice against women specifically.

Nobody demands you 'to have it all'. If you're tying yourself into knots, trying to be liked, then stop doing that. As a rule, nobody gets a medal or a thank you for existing.

Yes there are different "pressures" on men, like my H is given a hard time if he takes a day off for a sick child. His boss said, "what is wrong with your wife". His answer was, "nothing but I actually love my kids and being there when they are sick is something i enjoy, my wife actually has tons of leave but I like parenting"... he did not like that answer but oh well FMLA.

But, his pressures from work that happen because he is a man are way less than what the women at his work experience.

Also, I think people forget that women who are 45 and older could literally and legally not be given a job and the reason could be because they have children or because they are pregnant.

[Anonymous]

Professional men (I don't think this applies for working class men) are given the benefit of the doubt in the workplace. They have to repeatedly fail to be taken to task and even then there is alot of concern from other men about how the failing male will feel about being given critical feedback. Whereas men are very willing to constantly give feedback to women which is often pretty patronizing and makes alot of assumptions about female traits in general v.s the specific person. This is my experience. On the Barbie movie I think they made the point that societal pressures on men and women were difficult - I don't think being a bro with horse posters was intended to look like a fulfilling role for men either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not that no woman is happy or that you can't be an imperfect woman. The monologue is mainly just about how the expectations for women are constantly contradictory, and this makes it hard ("impossible") to feel like you are meeting expectations because no matter what you do, it's wrong.

This, above. OP, you're overthinking this monologue, trying to parse every phrase and "find" where those things are actually happening, and when you don't recognize any of it in YOUR life, you're dismissing the whole monologue. PP above has it right. Expectations are constantly contradictory and the result is that some women at some times feel that whatever choice they make, it's going to be the wrong one to someone. If you've never had that experience, never felt the contradictions in expectations for you as a woman, well, you are fortunate indeed.

I'm wondering now how old the women are who are blasting the monologue and saying, almost with a shrug, that they haven't experienced those things and their lives are good. My life is great, but I'm older than most on this board, I think, and in my career especially, I sure as hell encountered those contradictory expectations many times in many ways over the years. Maybe those of you who are younger --30s? 40s? -- haven't had that same experience.

+1 I think the PP captured it well. I can choose to not care about those expectations, perfectly happy with my average life, not being skinny, have been a SAHM, WAHM, WOHM, etc. but still notice they exist. DH sees it too. I used to work Saturdays so he'd be out with our two toddlers every weekend and got so much "amazing dad!" comments that really annoyed him because it conveyed that male incompetence/disengagement is the expectation.

Obviously the "it's impossible to be a woman" opening is over-the-top but the meaning is that it is impossible for one person to meet all the contradictory social messages out there about what a is good woman. I think it is especially hard for some young women, raised to be people-pleasers to get to a point of feeling good enough as they are, with whatever choices make sense for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Professional men (I don't think this applies for working class men) are given the benefit of the doubt in the workplace. They have to repeatedly fail to be taken to task and even then there is alot of concern from other men about how the failing male will feel about being given critical feedback. Whereas men are very willing to constantly give feedback to women which is often pretty patronizing and makes alot of assumptions about female traits in general v.s the specific person. This is my experience. On the Barbie movie I think they made the point that societal pressures on men and women were difficult - I don't think being a bro with horse posters was intended to look like a fulfilling role for men either.

I agree with this.

[Anonymous]

I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

[Anonymous]

Bc the narrative out there that’s constantly shoved in our faces is oppressor vs oppressed. It’s a divide and conquer mentality

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

After reading your comment, I can’t take your opinion seriously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

After reading your comment, I can’t take your opinion seriously.

Because you were able to take the opinion of an anonymous stranger seriously before reading that comment?

You could have just said: I loved the movie and disagree with your opinion. But based on the unnecessarily convoluted way you expressed your simple opinion, I can see why you liked the Barbie movie and Greta Gerwig. She’s expresses herself just like you do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

After reading your comment, I can’t take your opinion seriously.

Because you were able to take the opinion of an anonymous stranger seriously before reading that comment?

You could have just said: I loved the movie and disagree with your opinion. But based on the unnecessarily convoluted way you expressed your simple opinion, I can see why you liked the Barbie movie and Greta Gerwig. She’s expresses herself just like you do.

You are fundamentally misunderstanding my comment, which is not unexpected. Not being able to take your earlier comment seriously is wholly unrelated to my opinion of the movie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

After reading your comment, I can’t take your opinion seriously.

Because you were able to take the opinion of an anonymous stranger seriously before reading that comment?

You could have just said: I loved the movie and disagree with your opinion. But based on the unnecessarily convoluted way you expressed your simple opinion, I can see why you liked the Barbie movie and Greta Gerwig. She’s expresses herself just like you do.

You are fundamentally misunderstanding my comment, which is not unexpected. Not being able to take your earlier comment seriously is wholly unrelated to my opinion of the movie.

DP. I also fundamentally misunderstood your earlier comment. Because I also wondered “how would you know her opinion, never mind take it seriously, BEFORE reading her comment?”

I think that perhaps you just aren’t a very effective communicator. (Relax, it’s personal, not because you’re a woman!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I found the whole movie to be a big, ol’ sloppy mess with lots of starts and no finishes. I don’t get why they even had the America Ferrara part. It was tangential and superficial. She and her daughter have lost their connection and silly, white daddy doesn’t get either of them, but suddenly Barbie appears and they’re all bff. What was up with Mattel corporate knowing about Barbieland? And trying to keep it under wraps? It came off as an empty pathetic attempt at surrealism, it really it was pseudo intellectual nonsense. And don’t even get me started on the ghost of Ruth Handler. And why does it end with Barbie going to the Gyno? They might as well have played “I’m ever Woman.” Or did they?

What a mess! The movie wasn’t funny and it wasn’t deep! It was cheesy, heavy handed and basic!

I hated Ladybird too, so from now on, no matter how good the reviews are, I vow to avoid anything by Greta Gerwig. She is not my type!

After reading your comment, I can’t take your opinion seriously.

Because you were able to take the opinion of an anonymous stranger seriously before reading that comment?

You could have just said: I loved the movie and disagree with your opinion. But based on the unnecessarily convoluted way you expressed your simple opinion, I can see why you liked the Barbie movie and Greta Gerwig. She’s expresses herself just like you do.

You are fundamentally misunderstanding my comment, which is not unexpected. Not being able to take your earlier comment seriously is wholly unrelated to my opinion of the movie.

No, I didn’t misunderstand your comment. There was literally nothing to misunderstand. You wrote one sentence. It said, “After reading your comment I can’t take your opinion seriously.” There is nothing profound in that statement.

But let’s break it up if it helps:

1) “After reading your comment,”: you read my critique of Barbie and why I didn’t like it. (I can also assume that based on the fact you cut and paste the one and only comment I made up until that point on this thread.); and

2) “I can’t take your opinion seriously.” Now here is the guts, the area for misinterpretation. What could it possibly mean? It’s such a deep concept. Why is this stranger not taking my opinion seriously? Did I misrepresent myself to said stranger? Was I expecting my opinion to be accepted like that of a prophet?

The stranger says I misunderstand his/her enigma of a comment. He/she said it
“[was not unexpected,” so complex was the concept.

Seriously, are you high or something?