Minimum math at TJ

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

The same math is taught at TJ, but with greater depth and graded more rigorously. The top third of the class progresses beyond Multivariable, the middle third typically peaks at BC or Multivariable, and the bottom of the class, particularly in recent years, continues to struggle, starting with Math 1 and finishing with much lower math than kids in base schools. If math doesn't come naturally, there's no point doing TJ.

why? wont it make it difficult for kids to get into good colleges?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

The same math is taught at TJ, but with greater depth and graded more rigorously. The top third of the class progresses beyond Multivariable, the middle third typically peaks at BC or Multivariable, and the bottom of the class, particularly in recent years, continues to struggle, starting with Math 1 and finishing with much lower math than kids in base schools. If math doesn't come naturally, there's no point doing TJ.

why? wont it make it difficult for kids to get into good colleges?

Why? Because the studetns at TJ are supposed to be focused on STEM and highly interested in math and science. They should be able to dive deeper into math concepts and understand them at that depth.

There is no hidding the fact that the admissions changes were made because of the NAACP threat of a law suit surrounding the lack of Black and Hispanic kids at TJ. I like that they removed the quant test because I do think to rewarded people who could ay for years of prepping. And yes, that would include my child if he decided he wanted to apply to TJ in a few years. He has been at RSM and taking math competition classes since 4th grade. I can see where that gives hima leg up on a quant test. I can also see that there are other kids who are smart and good at math that have not had the same opportunities to participate in programs like RSM or AoPS or mathnasium or anything along those lines for a variety of reasons.

FCPS does offer every student a path to Algebra 1 in 7th grade and I think that any of those kids should have the ability to do well at a school like TJ. I like setting seats aside for every MS so that the kids who come from backgrounds that cannot access the enrichment opportunities or parents who can help them with Khan Academy or maybe even steady enough internet to get to Khan Academy have a chance to attend TJ. They might not end up in the Multivariate classes but they will be exposed to kids with strong academic interests, very capable teachers, and opportunities that they would not have at their base school.

I do think that the requirement should be completing Geometry by 8th grade because I do think that identifies kids who are more able t handle the more rigorous math at TJ. I would hope that a higher standard would encourage the MS with fewer kids in Algebra 1 to find a way to work more closely with those kids in Advanced Math or LIV programs to strengthen their math foundations so that the kids are more capable of succeeding in Algebra and Geometry and then at TJ.

TJ is a public school that should serve all the kids of FCPS and the other countries that pay into it. There is nothing wrong with looking at how we admit students to make TJ more accessible to those students. But they need to find that balance and try to find away to address the legitimate concerns that kids are being excluded because of a lack of access to out of school enrichment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

The same math is taught at TJ, but with greater depth and graded more rigorously. The top third of the class progresses beyond Multivariable, the middle third typically peaks at BC or Multivariable, and the bottom of the class, particularly in recent years, continues to struggle, starting with Math 1 and finishing with much lower math than kids in base schools. If math doesn't come naturally, there's no point doing TJ.

So by this breakdown is bottom third then just taking equivalent of what could get at any other AP high school? Is then the thought by that bottom third that still have better chance at colleges with “TJ” on application? From other posts, seems if kids falling to bottom third, better to bow out and go be top % at non-TJ high school. Seeing more posts about kids taking algebra 1 or geometry in 9th at TJ- same thought, if then cannot get the different science classes at TJ b/c don’t have math requirements to do so, why go to TJ? Or are odds truly better for colleges if can just say “TJ” on application even if bottom third?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

So by this breakdown is bottom third then just taking equivalent of what could get at any other AP high school? Is then the thought by that bottom third that still have better chance at colleges with “TJ” on application? From other posts, seems if kids falling to bottom third, better to bow out and go be top % at non-TJ high school. Seeing more posts about kids taking algebra 1 or geometry in 9th at TJ- same thought, if then cannot get the different science classes at TJ b/c don’t have math requirements to do so, why go to TJ? Or are odds truly better for colleges if can just say “TJ” on application even if bottom third?

Someone has to be in the bottom third. They are not getting the same as base school. It would be harder more rigorous classes, but yes they would be starting at geometry.

[Anonymous]

You do realize that a school made up of only students who were middle school math club members is not a fun HS experience for anyone.

[Anonymous]

Out of all the applicants, what portion have Algebra 1 versus Geometry/Algebra 2? which of these applicants have greater chance of getting admitted?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

This is because of the new admissions process which admits more kids who are just starting Geometry at TJ. Class of 2024 and prior years have a much greater number of kids on math paths higher than top kids at other schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

This is because of the new admissions process which admits more kids who are just starting Geometry at TJ. Class of 2024 and prior years have a much greater number of kids on math paths higher than top kids at other schools.

by geometry, you mean TJ Math1? What is the teacher to student ratio for math 1? is there individual attention?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You do realize that a school made up of only students who were middle school math club members is not a fun HS experience for anyone.

My ES Math Club kid also plays sports and does Scouts. He is a well rounded kid who happens to love math. Maybe you need to rethink who the kids are who are in math club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You do realize that a school made up of only students who were middle school math club members is not a fun HS experience for anyone.

Disagree. At a science and math school, yes, it can and often does create a more fun experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

The same math is taught at TJ, but with greater depth and graded more rigorously. The top third of the class progresses beyond Multivariable, the middle third typically peaks at BC or Multivariable, and the bottom of the class, particularly in recent years, continues to struggle, starting with Math 1 and finishing with much lower math than kids in base schools. If math doesn't come naturally, there's no point doing TJ.

why? wont it make it difficult for kids to get into good colleges?

Why? Because the studetns at TJ are supposed to be focused on STEM and highly interested in math and science. They should be able to dive deeper into math concepts and understand them at that depth.

There is no hidding the fact that the admissions changes were made because of the NAACP threat of a law suit surrounding the lack of Black and Hispanic kids at TJ. I like that they removed the quant test because I do think to rewarded people who could ay for years of prepping. And yes, that would include my child if he decided he wanted to apply to TJ in a few years. He has been at RSM and taking math competition classes since 4th grade. I can see where that gives hima leg up on a quant test. I can also see that there are other kids who are smart and good at math that have not had the same opportunities to participate in programs like RSM or AoPS or mathnasium or anything along those lines for a variety of reasons.

FCPS does offer every student a path to Algebra 1 in 7th grade and I think that any of those kids should have the ability to do well at a school like TJ. I like setting seats aside for every MS so that the kids who come from backgrounds that cannot access the enrichment opportunities or parents who can help them with Khan Academy or maybe even steady enough internet to get to Khan Academy have a chance to attend TJ. They might not end up in the Multivariate classes but they will be exposed to kids with strong academic interests, very capable teachers, and opportunities that they would not have at their base school.

I do think that the requirement should be completing Geometry by 8th grade because I do think that identifies kids who are more able t handle the more rigorous math at TJ. I would hope that a higher standard would encourage the MS with fewer kids in Algebra 1 to find a way to work more closely with those kids in Advanced Math or LIV programs to strengthen their math foundations so that the kids are more capable of succeeding in Algebra and Geometry and then at TJ.

TJ is a public school that should serve all the kids of FCPS and the other countries that pay into it. There is nothing wrong with looking at how we admit students to make TJ more accessible to those students. But they need to find that balance and try to find away to address the legitimate concerns that kids are being excluded because of a lack of access to out of school enrichment.

Is it correct to say seats are set aside for every MS?l or just idea that more kids have chance because of lottery v test scores only? Or is it actually a controlled lottery where pick 2 or whatever number of kids but equally— so 2 from Cooper, 2 from Poe, 2 from Glasgow, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:About how many TJ kids each year end up taking math beyond MVC and linear algebra? Anyone have a guess how the numbers will change for class of 2025 and beyond?

The numbers that I vaguley remember seeing from last years admitted class had about 1/4 of the class only having Algebra 1 H and a good number having taken Algebra 2. I would guess that 3/4 of the students at TJ will be able to take MVC and Linear Algebra based on the math that they had when they entered.

So just a handful of students will be taking the math that is after MVC/LA — differential equations? MVC/LA senior year is probably the most common senior year math for TJ kids?

Yes. About half the class does this. The rest are split between higher and lower.

This is surprising to me as that is then the same math being taken by kids at other high schools— always thought kids at TJ and point of TJ was accelerated math (and science). So strange to me more kids at TJ not on path higher than what other top kids at other AP schools taking.

The same math is taught at TJ, but with greater depth and graded more rigorously. The top third of the class progresses beyond Multivariable, the middle third typically peaks at BC or Multivariable, and the bottom of the class, particularly in recent years, continues to struggle, starting with Math 1 and finishing with much lower math than kids in base schools. If math doesn't come naturally, there's no point doing TJ.

why? wont it make it difficult for kids to get into good colleges?

Why? Because the studetns at TJ are supposed to be focused on STEM and highly interested in math and science. They should be able to dive deeper into math concepts and understand them at that depth.

There is no hidding the fact that the admissions changes were made because of the NAACP threat of a law suit surrounding the lack of Black and Hispanic kids at TJ. I like that they removed the quant test because I do think to rewarded people who could ay for years of prepping. And yes, that would include my child if he decided he wanted to apply to TJ in a few years. He has been at RSM and taking math competition classes since 4th grade. I can see where that gives hima leg up on a quant test. I can also see that there are other kids who are smart and good at math that have not had the same opportunities to participate in programs like RSM or AoPS or mathnasium or anything along those lines for a variety of reasons.

FCPS does offer every student a path to Algebra 1 in 7th grade and I think that any of those kids should have the ability to do well at a school like TJ. I like setting seats aside for every MS so that the kids who come from backgrounds that cannot access the enrichment opportunities or parents who can help them with Khan Academy or maybe even steady enough internet to get to Khan Academy have a chance to attend TJ. They might not end up in the Multivariate classes but they will be exposed to kids with strong academic interests, very capable teachers, and opportunities that they would not have at their base school.

I do think that the requirement should be completing Geometry by 8th grade because I do think that identifies kids who are more able t handle the more rigorous math at TJ. I would hope that a higher standard would encourage the MS with fewer kids in Algebra 1 to find a way to work more closely with those kids in Advanced Math or LIV programs to strengthen their math foundations so that the kids are more capable of succeeding in Algebra and Geometry and then at TJ.

TJ is a public school that should serve all the kids of FCPS and the other countries that pay into it. There is nothing wrong with looking at how we admit students to make TJ more accessible to those students. But they need to find that balance and try to find away to address the legitimate concerns that kids are being excluded because of a lack of access to out of school enrichment.

Is it correct to say seats are set aside for every MS?l or just idea that more kids have chance because of lottery v test scores only? Or is it actually a controlled lottery where pick 2 or whatever number of kids but equally— so 2 from Cooper, 2 from Poe, 2 from Glasgow, etc.

Every MS is guaranteed seats for the top 1.5% of kids who meet the admission criteria. Not all schools have kids with a 3.5 GPA, Honors Science, Honors LA/Social Studies, and Algebra 1 H by 8th grade but the kids who do meet those requirements and apply will be admitted to TJ. The number of seats is determined by the size of the school or 8th grade class, I am not sure which, but is somewhere between 6-9 seats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Out of all the applicants, what portion have Algebra 1 versus Geometry/Algebra 2? which of these applicants have greater chance of getting admitted?

Math level is not considered at all in the application. The kid in Algebra I has the exact same chance of getting admitted as a kid in pre-calc or calc.

[Anonymous]

There is a large gray area between requiring geometry by 8th for TJ admissions and not considering math level at all. Being in Algebra I in 8th should count as a negative in the application, but not an insurmountable one. TJ has always had kids starting in Math 1. That's fine, but those kids should need to be really impressive in some other area to compensate for the lack of math advancement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out of all the applicants, what portion have Algebra 1 versus Geometry/Algebra 2? which of these applicants have greater chance of getting admitted?

Math level is not considered at all in the application. The kid in Algebra I has the exact same chance of getting admitted as a kid in pre-calc or calc.

Of course, it's a lottery system not merit based?