Harvard President resigns

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two things can be true at the same time:

1. Gay was targeted by right-wing media because she is a black woman
2. Gay is a plagiarist and needed to resign

She plagiarized over and over again, many times beyond just boilerplate language. This shows an intent to deceive, which then calls into question her data and all her scholarship.

This makes me very sad, especially for all the women of color in academia who Claudine Gay was supposed to represent.

Read the story of Priyanga Amarasekare, who remains suspended at UCLA and no one will say exactly why.

https://www.chronicle.com/article/when-a-professor-disappears-and-no-one-will-tell-you-why
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-00473-8

So she’s being pushed to the brink of sanity and her students’s opportunities destroyed because of protocol in the wake of complaining about discrimination - literally nothing to do with her scholarship, her publications, her research, her cites, her mentorship. Some piece of shit chancellor is mad at her and wants her destroyed. May that chancellor get it back twentyfold in this lifetime.

Except it does have to with her scholarship. I also originally thought it was no big deal, but she lifted almost entire paragraphs from other people's work, and then didn't acknowledge that work as a source - that shows a clear intent to deceive. And she plagiarized the acknowledgements in her doctoral thesis. I mean, come on.

Dr. Gay is accused of plagiarizing two sentences in the acknowledgments of her 1997 Harvard dissertation from the acknowledgments in the 1996 book “Facing Up to the American Dream: Race, Class, and the Soul of the Nation,” by the Harvard political scientist Jennifer L. Hochschild.

Dr. Hochschild: “Sandy Jencks showed me the importance of getting the data right and of following where they lead without fear or favor,” adding later that Mr. Jencks “drove me much harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

Dr. Gay thanked her thesis adviser, Gary King, who “reminded me of the importance of getting the data right and following where they lead without fear or favor.” She also thanked her family, who “drove me harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/21/us/claudine-gay-harvard-president-excerpts.html

For gods sake. I was discussing the UCLA prof story in the links, which is why I quoted it. I didn’t write Gay’s name even.

Sorry I misunderstood. My DC who's in a PhD program in a related field to the UCLA prof and knows some of her grad students alerted me to her story. DC has become very cynical about academia, and I spent a lot of time over winter break convincing her to not quit and throw away the last 3 1/2 years of her life.

To bring this back to politics - the constant attacks and discrediting of academia and experts is a key part of the far-rightwing, fascist agenda in this country, funded by American and foreign oligarchs. It is scary.

She's not the only one and it's not because of right-wing attacks or discrediting academia. It's because the system is broken (like so many other systems nowadays).

Because the right-wing is deliberately targeting our society's institutions by breaking them. And then they argue that we need a strongman to fix everything and save us.

Sometimes bad people make good points. Doesn't make them good people - they are still bad - but they are occasionally right about one or two things. It's just hard to find those things amidst all the hateful garbage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two things can be true at the same time:

1. Gay was targeted by right-wing media because she is a black woman
2. Gay is a plagiarist and needed to resign

She plagiarized over and over again, many times beyond just boilerplate language. This shows an intent to deceive, which then calls into question her data and all her scholarship.

This makes me very sad, especially for all the women of color in academia who Claudine Gay was supposed to represent.

Read the story of Priyanga Amarasekare, who remains suspended at UCLA and no one will say exactly why.

https://www.chronicle.com/article/when-a-professor-disappears-and-no-one-will-tell-you-why
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-00473-8

So she’s being pushed to the brink of sanity and her students’s opportunities destroyed because of protocol in the wake of complaining about discrimination - literally nothing to do with her scholarship, her publications, her research, her cites, her mentorship. Some piece of shit chancellor is mad at her and wants her destroyed. May that chancellor get it back twentyfold in this lifetime.

Except it does have to with her scholarship. I also originally thought it was no big deal, but she lifted almost entire paragraphs from other people's work, and then didn't acknowledge that work as a source - that shows a clear intent to deceive. And she plagiarized the acknowledgements in her doctoral thesis. I mean, come on.

Dr. Gay is accused of plagiarizing two sentences in the acknowledgments of her 1997 Harvard dissertation from the acknowledgments in the 1996 book “Facing Up to the American Dream: Race, Class, and the Soul of the Nation,” by the Harvard political scientist Jennifer L. Hochschild.

Dr. Hochschild: “Sandy Jencks showed me the importance of getting the data right and of following where they lead without fear or favor,” adding later that Mr. Jencks “drove me much harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

Dr. Gay thanked her thesis adviser, Gary King, who “reminded me of the importance of getting the data right and following where they lead without fear or favor.” She also thanked her family, who “drove me harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/21/us/claudine-gay-harvard-president-excerpts.html

For gods sake. I was discussing the UCLA prof story in the links, which is why I quoted it. I didn’t write Gay’s name even.

Sorry I misunderstood. My DC who's in a PhD program in a related field to the UCLA prof and knows some of her grad students alerted me to her story. DC has become very cynical about academia, and I spent a lot of time over winter break convincing her to not quit and throw away the last 3 1/2 years of her life.

To bring this back to politics - the constant attacks and discrediting of academia and experts is a key part of the far-rightwing, fascist agenda in this country, funded by American and foreign oligarchs. It is scary.

She's not the only one and it's not because of right-wing attacks or discrediting academia. It's because the system is broken (like so many other systems nowadays).

Because the right-wing is deliberately targeting our society's institutions by breaking them. And then they argue that we need a strongman to fix everything and save us.

Really? Is that what your DD is telling you or is that what you are telling her? Do you know any other grad students or PhDs or anyone involved in academia?

There are huge problems - the system has collapsed and so far, nothing has been reborn from the ashes.

[Anonymous]

The values of honesty and integrity in one's academic work should be embraced by everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two things can be true at the same time:

1. Gay was targeted by right-wing media because she is a black woman
2. Gay is a plagiarist and needed to resign

She plagiarized over and over again, many times beyond just boilerplate language. This shows an intent to deceive, which then calls into question her data and all her scholarship.

This makes me very sad, especially for all the women of color in academia who Claudine Gay was supposed to represent.

Read the story of Priyanga Amarasekare, who remains suspended at UCLA and no one will say exactly why.

https://www.chronicle.com/article/when-a-professor-disappears-and-no-one-will-tell-you-why
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-00473-8

So she’s being pushed to the brink of sanity and her students’s opportunities destroyed because of protocol in the wake of complaining about discrimination - literally nothing to do with her scholarship, her publications, her research, her cites, her mentorship. Some piece of shit chancellor is mad at her and wants her destroyed. May that chancellor get it back twentyfold in this lifetime.

Except it does have to with her scholarship. I also originally thought it was no big deal, but she lifted almost entire paragraphs from other people's work, and then didn't acknowledge that work as a source - that shows a clear intent to deceive. And she plagiarized the acknowledgements in her doctoral thesis. I mean, come on.

Dr. Gay is accused of plagiarizing two sentences in the acknowledgments of her 1997 Harvard dissertation from the acknowledgments in the 1996 book “Facing Up to the American Dream: Race, Class, and the Soul of the Nation,” by the Harvard political scientist Jennifer L. Hochschild.

Dr. Hochschild: “Sandy Jencks showed me the importance of getting the data right and of following where they lead without fear or favor,” adding later that Mr. Jencks “drove me much harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

Dr. Gay thanked her thesis adviser, Gary King, who “reminded me of the importance of getting the data right and following where they lead without fear or favor.” She also thanked her family, who “drove me harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/21/us/claudine-gay-harvard-president-excerpts.html

For gods sake. I was discussing the UCLA prof story in the links, which is why I quoted it. I didn’t write Gay’s name even.

Sorry I misunderstood. My DC who's in a PhD program in a related field to the UCLA prof and knows some of her grad students alerted me to her story. DC has become very cynical about academia, and I spent a lot of time over winter break convincing her to not quit and throw away the last 3 1/2 years of her life.

To bring this back to politics - the constant attacks and discrediting of academia and experts is a key part of the far-rightwing, fascist agenda in this country, funded by American and foreign oligarchs. It is scary.

My. Fancy that. Are you saying it's unfair to make Gay resign because she plagiarized? I'm very confused here. Was it right wing "fascist agenda" that forced the resignation of the white male Stanford president last year? As far as I'm aware, there was no real media discussion of that event.

I'm also curious as to who exactly is this "far-rightwing, fascist agenda" and the people behind it. Are you saying Bill Ackerman, a Jewish businessman, is a fascist? Elise Stefanik is a fascist?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Okay I guess we will,have to look at the federalist society membership.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So Stefanik et al’s hearing was never about anti-semitism. It was really about dismantling DEI. Let’s see who they go after next.

If U Chicago is "where fun goes to die", maybe Harvard is where the excesses of DEI finally die. The university should be embarrassed that it appointed a president with such a thin scholarly record. Unfortunately the sorry Gay saga hurts far more meritorious diverse peers. It's hard to see how Gay sticks around Cambridge in a tenured role. She would do Harvard and academia a favor by quietly leaving the faculty also.

Harvard’s new slogan:

Where DEI goes to DIE.

Plagiarism!!

That's what Florida said.

Isn’t it ironic, don’t you think?
A little toooooo ironic.
And who would've thought, it figures

Oh wait https://genius.com/Alanis-morissette-ironic-lyrics

Appreciate the cite!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Two things can be true at the same time:

1. Gay was targeted by right-wing media because she is a black woman
2. Gay is a plagiarist and needed to resign

She plagiarized over and over again, many times beyond just boilerplate language. This shows an intent to deceive, which then calls into question her data and all her scholarship.

This makes me very sad, especially for all the women of color in academia who Claudine Gay was supposed to represent.

Read the story of Priyanga Amarasekare, who remains suspended at UCLA and no one will say exactly why.

https://www.chronicle.com/article/when-a-professor-disappears-and-no-one-will-tell-you-why
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-00473-8

So she’s being pushed to the brink of sanity and her students’s opportunities destroyed because of protocol in the wake of complaining about discrimination - literally nothing to do with her scholarship, her publications, her research, her cites, her mentorship. Some piece of shit chancellor is mad at her and wants her destroyed. May that chancellor get it back twentyfold in this lifetime.

Except it does have to with her scholarship. I also originally thought it was no big deal, but she lifted almost entire paragraphs from other people's work, and then didn't acknowledge that work as a source - that shows a clear intent to deceive. And she plagiarized the acknowledgements in her doctoral thesis. I mean, come on.

Dr. Gay is accused of plagiarizing two sentences in the acknowledgments of her 1997 Harvard dissertation from the acknowledgments in the 1996 book “Facing Up to the American Dream: Race, Class, and the Soul of the Nation,” by the Harvard political scientist Jennifer L. Hochschild.

Dr. Hochschild: “Sandy Jencks showed me the importance of getting the data right and of following where they lead without fear or favor,” adding later that Mr. Jencks “drove me much harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

Dr. Gay thanked her thesis adviser, Gary King, who “reminded me of the importance of getting the data right and following where they lead without fear or favor.” She also thanked her family, who “drove me harder than I sometimes wanted to be driven.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/21/us/claudine-gay-harvard-president-excerpts.html

For gods sake. I was discussing the UCLA prof story in the links, which is why I quoted it. I didn’t write Gay’s name even.

Sorry I misunderstood. My DC who's in a PhD program in a related field to the UCLA prof and knows some of her grad students alerted me to her story. DC has become very cynical about academia, and I spent a lot of time over winter break convincing her to not quit and throw away the last 3 1/2 years of her life.

To bring this back to politics - the constant attacks and discrediting of academia and experts is a key part of the far-rightwing, fascist agenda in this country, funded by American and foreign oligarchs. It is scary.

She's not the only one and it's not because of right-wing attacks or discrediting academia. It's because the system is broken (like so many other systems nowadays).

Because the right-wing is deliberately targeting our society's institutions by breaking them. And then they argue that we need a strongman to fix everything and save us.

You're a great komedian.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Sounds like you believe in quotas based on political orientation.

I believe in balance, or some semblance thereof.

Are you arguing 28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced? Sounds like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Okay I guess we will,have to look at the federalist society membership.

Go for it.

Unfortunately for you, there is no mass conspiracy to refuse to review conservative writers and academics work for plagiarism. So trying to make this into a game with the pretension that what is happening to Gay is only a right wing witch hunt is making you look silly and hysterical. Gay got her comeuppance. As the old say went, pride goes before fall. You're just trying to make a martyr out of a mediocre hack who grifted her way to the top, which, when you think about it, is a very strange thing to do.

But I do understand your mentality. Gay is on "your side" of the ideological divide and a champion of causes you believe in, therefore she needs to be defended and protected at all costs to avoid presenting weaknesses to the enemy, whoever they are. But such mentality only ends up exposing the same weaknesses and corruption you fear, except that it's on your side, not the enemy's side. This mentality and ironic outcome is as old as history. And history, as another old saying goes, repeats itself. And it's quite laughable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Okay I guess we will,have to look at the federalist society membership.

Go for it.

Unfortunately for you, there is no mass conspiracy to refuse to review conservative writers and academics work for plagiarism. So trying to make this into a game with the pretension that what is happening to Gay is only a right wing witch hunt is making you look silly and hysterical. Gay got her comeuppance. As the old say went, pride goes before fall. You're just trying to make a martyr out of a mediocre hack who grifted her way to the top, which, when you think about it, is a very strange thing to do.

But I do understand your mentality. Gay is on "your side" of the ideological divide and a champion of causes you believe in, therefore she needs to be defended and protected at all costs to avoid presenting weaknesses to the enemy, whoever they are. But such mentality only ends up exposing the same weaknesses and corruption you fear, except that it's on your side, not the enemy's side. This mentality and ironic outcome is as old as history. And history, as another old saying goes, repeats itself. And it's quite laughable.

Oh I am sure some of those people are not pro Israel, having affairs, are gay, do not support Trump, etc. what ever you people use to enforce your thought control. There are plenty of conservatives professors and CEOs to go after. I guess you want a quote for liberal vs conservatives professors. Let make sure the same is done with judges and CEOs. Also people in the media. Way too many conservatives in those places.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Sounds like you believe in quotas based on political orientation.

I believe in balance, or some semblance thereof.

Are you arguing 28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced? Sounds like it.

No, I'm not arguing that "28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced." What I am doing is wondering how you would address this imbalance. Would you seek to institute quotas based on political orientation? In other words, what would a solution to this issue look like?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Sounds like you believe in quotas based on political orientation.

I believe in balance, or some semblance thereof.

Are you arguing 28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced? Sounds like it.

No, I'm not arguing that "28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced." What I am doing is wondering how you would address this imbalance. Would you seek to institute quotas based on political orientation? In other words, what would a solution to this issue look like?

DP.
When a university embraces DEI and uses the tenets of DEI to interview prospective professors, they are going to end up with far left liberal "scholars."
If universities want to get back to what they are supposed to be doing - educating and not indoctrinating - they need to reject the whole DEI movement and the CRT nonsense and start looking for professors who are knowledgeable in their fields and who actually know how to teach.
You know..... start basing their hiring on merit.

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gay is only the tip of the iceberg. The right is going to start going after professors and administrators with whom they disagree by using software to comb through their research looking for errors and plagiarism. Buckle up.

I totally agree that the right is going to use this incident to go after even more professors, especially ones of color. But they should remember that the anti-plagiarism software doesn't care about politics--it can also find plagiarism in the work of right-leaning academics.

Not a problem. Especially given that there's, what, 50 left wing academics for every 1 right wing academic.

Let's start with Liberty U., BYU, Bob Jones U., SMU, and keep going. I'm sure all the professors there were hired due to their sterling academic credentials solely.

In New England alone, surveys reveal for every 28 university professors who identify as liberal or progressive, there is just 1 who identifies as a republican.

Does anyone believe 28 to 1 is "balance?"

Sounds like you believe in quotas based on political orientation.

I believe in balance, or some semblance thereof.

Are you arguing 28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced? Sounds like it.

No, I'm not arguing that "28 to 1 is anywhere near balanced." What I am doing is wondering how you would address this imbalance. Would you seek to institute quotas based on political orientation? In other words, what would a solution to this issue look like?

DP.
When a university embraces DEI and uses the tenets of DEI to interview prospective professors, they are going to end up with far left liberal "scholars."
If universities want to get back to what they are supposed to be doing - educating and not indoctrinating - they need to reject the whole DEI movement and the CRT nonsense and start looking for professors who are knowledgeable in their fields and who actually know how to teach.
You know..... start basing their hiring on merit.

If you think that in real life--in any job--people are hired solely on merit, you are deluded my friend. It is a lofty ideal that I share, but it is not reality. There is a ton of research showing that people in a position to hire others are influenced by a host of factors, including personal biases. If DEI is biased in one direction, status quo hiring practices are biased in another direction.

PS Re: your comment about universities "indoctrinating" their students, you know that conservative, especially some religious universities do so as well, right? The right is welcome to create more universities that teach their particular viewpoint. And students can decide where they want to go.

PPS Re: your point about the need to hire professors "who are knowledgeable in their fields and who actually know how to teach"--having been through a bachelors, masters, and PhD program where I was taught by all-white professors, I can tell you that lots of knowledgeable professors are not good at teaching. The ones who are can be transformative, but they are few and far between and have a gift that does not necessarily correlate with their record of scholarly work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The values of honesty and integrity in one's academic work should be embraced by everyone.