Behavior in DD's school/grade

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The behavior was going south pre-pandemic. Don't blame it on Covid.

As a teacher I wholeheartedly agree. So many kids we get have clearly never heard, or at least never had enforced prior to K:

1. Be quiet, someone else is talking or its not time for talking
2. Wait, its not your turn
3. Multistep directions (ie: do X first, and only do Y after doing X.)

Parents, this is on you.

[Anonymous]

I remember teaching my son how to wait to talk to an adult. It took years of practice but he finally learned. So many parents just aren't willing or interested in this long term teaching of manners. I don't mind reinforcing these skills but when 2/3 of the class has never been taught any of them, it's an uphill battle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, I just volunteered in my kids' 3rd grade and K classrooms in APS and it seemed pretty buttoned up. Could I do it everyday? Naw. Was it what I expected for a bunch of kids during a party? Yes, it seemed well within the realm of normal.

Like PP, I think I would look into moving my kid if it was as wild as you describe.

+ 1. I have some aged kids in APS. The K party had some potty humor that I tried my best to shut down. The third graders managed the games and crafts mostly on their own. Kids were pumped up for winter break, but they were nice to the teacher and parent volunteers. What OP is describing sounds extreme.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Teacher here: most kids lack good families to raise them…this is the result.

So are millennial/Gen-X parents just really poor parents compared to their boomer parents? Is that really what it comes down to? I just don't recall my friends parents being super-involved in the 80s either, there were lots of latchkey kids. But the vast majority weren't going apesh-t at school.

This is what I don't get. My parents were SUPER lax in the 80s. They didn't teach me manners, they hardly taught me anything. We had a "go outside and play and come home when it gets dark" upbringing. I feel like I learned manners sort of through osmosis at school? Also there were strict expectations at school -- you had to say please and thank you, you couldn't talk back, if you fought with other kids, you'd get in trouble. Not corporal punishment but like detention or sent to the principal. We didn't want those things so we complied.

I think one reason my parents did so little parenting is that we got it at school. I remember being taught to tie my shoes and brush my teeth in preschool. My parents definitely didn't teach me those things. My parents were so lax that stuff the schools didn't teach me (like swimming and riding a bike), I simply didn't learn. But I have good manners. Though not with my parents! I used to talk back to my parents so much! Never to teachers, but my parents were so lax I could say anything to them and never really got in trouble. Or sometimes I'd get in trouble but only after they said worse things to me than I said them, so I didn't learn anything. Again, I learned it at school.

Not saying millennial/Gen X parents don't have issues with parenting. But I can tell you I spend way more time actually parenting than my parents did. I've tought my kid all kinds of stuff that my parents never discussed with me, including stuff like polite manners, keeping hands to yourself, walking away from conflicts rather than engaging, being respectful to teachers and other minders, etc. Also practical things like how to brush teeth or tie shoes. Schools don't teach this stuff anymore, not even the expensive private preschool I sent my kid to for ages 3 and 4. Schools want kids to show up with this knowledge. They also expected my kid to show up with basic literacy skills for K, so I taught that too.

Not the PP, but I definitely think the shifting expectations at school has not helped. In the 80s we all went to half day kindergarten and spent most of the day playing, not sitting. Those who complain about kids not being able to sit still should take a step back and ask how we got here rather than just blame it on parents. Maybe kindergarten and 1st grade shouldn’t be so intense to begin with.

No, sorry. Plenty of kids are succeeding in kindergarten. They aren’t asked to “sit still” nonstop all day. Many kids can do and are doing what the teacher asks of them.

It’s parenting.

Why can’t it be both? I think the common thread between home and school these days is that young kids aren’t engaging in unstructured play as often as they used to. At home they are handed screens because it’s easier, and/or shuttled from one structured activity to another even by age 3 or 4. At school there’s so much pressure to meet state standards that there’s little to no time for the kind of play from which kids in preschool through 2nd grade would benefit. So many skills are learned through play — self regulation, conflict resolution, putting yourself in someon else’s shoes, and more.

Of course there are many kids who are still doing fine. But clearly what’s going on isn’t working for a growing subset of children. Rather than schools and parents pointing fingers at each other we ought to be looking for ways to work together to improve things.

And yes, I know some parents truly do not care and will do absolutely nothing or actively make teachers’ lives harder. That is not new. But I think there’s a sizable chunk of parents who would welcome a conversation with their schools’s admin to think about ways to better support children at home and school. Some are just overwhelmed with life but receptive to advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The behavior was going south pre-pandemic. Don't blame it on Covid.

As a teacher I wholeheartedly agree. So many kids we get have clearly never heard, or at least never had enforced prior to K:

1. Be quiet, someone else is talking or its not time for talking
2. Wait, its not your turn
3. Multistep directions (ie: do X first, and only do Y after doing X.)

Parents, this is on you.

I have 2 NT kids who do well in school, whose teachers gush about their behavior, and are just generally overall polite kids. And one kid with fairly severe ADHD and possible ASD who gets dysregulated and can be disruptive in class.

So which outcome is on me as a parent? Do you really think we’re parenting just one kid differently?

FWIW, we do have good relationships with his teachers, always answer school phone calls, attend frequent IEP meetings, are doing therapies and meds, and try to reinforce things at home the school is working on. But it’s hard and depressing to hear a teacher lay blame on parents entirely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The behavior was going south pre-pandemic. Don't blame it on Covid.

As a teacher I wholeheartedly agree. So many kids we get have clearly never heard, or at least never had enforced prior to K:

1. Be quiet, someone else is talking or its not time for talking
2. Wait, its not your turn
3. Multistep directions (ie: do X first, and only do Y after doing X.)

Parents, this is on you.

I have 2 NT kids who do well in school, whose teachers gush about their behavior, and are just generally overall polite kids. And one kid with fairly severe ADHD and possible ASD who gets dysregulated and can be disruptive in class.

So which outcome is on me as a parent? Do you really think we’re parenting just one kid differently?

FWIW, we do have good relationships with his teachers, always answer school phone calls, attend frequent IEP meetings, are doing therapies and meds, and try to reinforce things at home the school is working on. But it’s hard and depressing to hear a teacher lay blame on parents entirely.

I doubt anyone is critical of how hard it is to parent a child with diagnosed severe ADHD or compares that to a NT child who is making the classroom experience rough.

[Anonymous]

Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes you just get stuck with a really bad cohort and the terrible thing is that it lasts for six years in elementary school. Third grade in my school is particularly bad too. I definitely think it’s some lingering Covid effects.

I don’t buy Covid excuses. These third graders have been in school for over 2 years now

But the 3rd graders missed out on K, where the majority of behavioral expectations are set. They likely didn’t learn much in K either, so 1st and 2nd were a lot of catch up work. If you consider that they missed K, and then 1st was a bunch of makeup work and basic expectation setting for kids who hadn’t been in a group setting in many months … they’re probably still dealing with some after effects and will continue to do so.

The COVID card is expired, folks. You’re going to have to find a new excuse. DP

NP. I'm noticing a big difference between my now 2nd grader's classes and my older kids classes. The older ones have classes that keep getting to the point of clearing out the classroom. The younger grades though have been running smoothly each year. I think it's because the younger one is in a pool of kids that missed preK but that was it vs the older kids who had a free for all a few years ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

This. And its way more students than can be explained by SN.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

This. And its way more students than can be explained by SN.

Exactly. I see behaviors in my kindergarten students that are more typical of toddlers-3 yr olds. Many of them have never heard the word "no" before and they react in meltdowns, similar to a toddler. Teachers shouldn't be the first limits kids have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:My kid is behaviorally challenging and I'll tell you why. We lost several family members due to COVID and I am an ICU nurse so she didn't see me much. It wasn't just the screens. Maybe for the banana bread crew, but not all of us were.

If true, your case is a rare unicorn. That is NOT the cause of ill-behaved kids in school in 99.9999999% of cases. No.

Check yourself

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/more-140000-us-children-lost-primary-or-secondary-caregiver-due-covid-19-pandemic

DP. The average poster HERE is not in that cohort and we all goddamned know it. Signed - someone who lost a grandparent to COVID, and yet managed to parent a child in K at the start of the pandemic with zero of the generalized jerkoff behaviors identified by the OP and others willing to call it what it is.

Oh im sorry. I didn’t realize you did a census of DCUM posters and compared them to the study

And btw, based on your response, your kids clearly were exposed to some toxicity by you

Oh no, let me apologize! Did your kids lose your husband and both sets of grandparents? I’m so sorry, I didn’t realize that you weren’t just argumentative and excuse-making but a poor and suffering soul.

I don’t know if you realize this - you could parent your sh!tbeasts, it’ll be an amazing change of pace. You wouldn’t get pissy about people describing horrendous kids because it might not describe yours for once.

First lost a grandparent. Now it's husband and both sets of grandparents. Oh ok. got it.

I didn’t say that was my situation, ya utter gobshite. (“Now you’re posting like you’re from abroad huhhhhhh??”) Is it your situation? Of course not. Did you lose anyone? No. Oh, so you were part of a cohort where most were essential workers without redundancy in childcare? No. But…you think *this* parenting board is largely frequented by people in professions deemed essential? No, unless you’re an absolute idiot. So, you’re offended because you know you don’t have COVID as a basis for lazy-assed parenting to a wack-assed kid or kids. Oh, ok.

And one wonders why kids are behaving poorly. You e got trashy parents raising them like this poster

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid is behaviorally challenging and I'll tell you why. We lost several family members due to COVID and I am an ICU nurse so she didn't see me much. It wasn't just the screens. Maybe for the banana bread crew, but not all of us were.

If true, your case is a rare unicorn. That is NOT the cause of ill-behaved kids in school in 99.9999999% of cases. No.

Check yourself

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/more-140000-us-children-lost-primary-or-secondary-caregiver-due-covid-19-pandemic

DP. The average poster HERE is not in that cohort and we all goddamned know it. Signed - someone who lost a grandparent to COVID, and yet managed to parent a child in K at the start of the pandemic with zero of the generalized jerkoff behaviors identified by the OP and others willing to call it what it is.

Oh im sorry. I didn’t realize you did a census of DCUM posters and compared them to the study

And btw, based on your response, your kids clearly were exposed to some toxicity by you

Oh no, let me apologize! Did your kids lose your husband and both sets of grandparents? I’m so sorry, I didn’t realize that you weren’t just argumentative and excuse-making but a poor and suffering soul.

I don’t know if you realize this - you could parent your sh!tbeasts, it’ll be an amazing change of pace. You wouldn’t get pissy about people describing horrendous kids because it might not describe yours for once.

First lost a grandparent. Now it's husband and both sets of grandparents. Oh ok. got it.

I didn’t say that was my situation, ya utter gobshite. (“Now you’re posting like you’re from abroad huhhhhhh??”) Is it your situation? Of course not. Did you lose anyone? No. Oh, so you were part of a cohort where most were essential workers without redundancy in childcare? No. But…you think *this* parenting board is largely frequented by people in professions deemed essential? No, unless you’re an absolute idiot. So, you’re offended because you know you don’t have COVID as a basis for lazy-assed parenting to a wack-assed kid or kids. Oh, ok.

And one wonders why kids are behaving poorly. You e got trashy parents raising them like this poster

No, that’s you, making excuses and lashing out. It’s so pathetic. When you fail to parent your kid you fail them but also yourself, and act out because it’s all you (like they) know to do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

This. And its way more students than can be explained by SN.

Exactly. I see behaviors in my kindergarten students that are more typical of toddlers-3 yr olds. Many of them have never heard the word "no" before and they react in meltdowns, similar to a toddler. Teachers shouldn't be the first limits kids have.

Exactly this. And it’s difficult to deal with in the kindergarten context. In preschool you might have 12 kids and 2 teachers. In K we have 18 kids and 1 teacher. Tantrums are really not practical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

This. And its way more students than can be explained by SN.

Exactly. I see behaviors in my kindergarten students that are more typical of toddlers-3 yr olds. Many of them have never heard the word "no" before and they react in meltdowns, similar to a toddler. Teachers shouldn't be the first limits kids have.

Exactly this. And it’s difficult to deal with in the kindergarten context. In preschool you might have 12 kids and 2 teachers. In K we have 18 kids and 1 teacher. Tantrums are really not practical.

when you think about it, some of the current 5 year olds were in utero during stay at home orders and it was a period of very high stress for pregnant women.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers aren’t griping about parents like you PP. I think the replies make that very clear. There are a large percentage of children who are raising themselves for whatever reason. When you have a large percentage of your class with kids who have never been taught anything at home, the classroom environment is negatively affected for every student.

This. And its way more students than can be explained by SN.

Exactly. I see behaviors in my kindergarten students that are more typical of toddlers-3 yr olds. Many of them have never heard the word "no" before and they react in meltdowns, similar to a toddler. Teachers shouldn't be the first limits kids have.

Exactly this. And it’s difficult to deal with in the kindergarten context. In preschool you might have 12 kids and 2 teachers. In K we have 18 kids and 1 teacher. Tantrums are really not practical.

when you think about it, some of the current 5 year olds were in utero during stay at home orders and it was a period of very high stress for pregnant women.

That’s true. And all kids alive in March 2020 in the US who are still alive really are GenerationCOVID, marked indelibly by the pandemic. It’s not right to expect them to consider anything other than their first or worse impulse in anything.